Discussion RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

DisEnchantment · Mar 23, 2022

With the GFX940 patches in full swing since first week of March, it is looking like MI300 is not far in the distant future!
Usually AMD takes around 3Qs to get the support in LLVM and amdgpu. Lately, since RDNA2 the window they push to add support for new devices is much reduced to prevent leaks.
But looking at the flurry of code in LLVM, it is a lot of commits. Maybe because US Govt is starting to prepare the SW environment for El Capitan (Maybe to avoid slow bring up situation like Frontier for example)

See here for the GFX940 specific commits

History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

The LLVM Project is a collection of modular and reusable compiler and toolchain technologies. - History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

github.com

Or Phoronix

More AMD "GFX940" Enablement Work Landing In LLVM - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

There is a lot more if you know whom to follow in LLVM review chains (before getting merged to github), but I am not going to link AMD employees.

I am starting to think MI300 will launch around the same time like Hopper probably only a couple of months later!
Although I believe Hopper had problems not having a host CPU capable of doing PCIe 5 in the very near future therefore it might have gotten pushed back a bit until SPR and Genoa arrives later in 2022.
If PVC slips again I believe MI300 could launch before it

This is nuts, MI100/200/300 cadence is impressive.

Previous thread on CDNA2 and RDNA3 here

Question - Speculation: RDNA3 + CDNA2 Architectures Thread

Man I have been dying to make this one for a while now. First rumours for RDNA3 are here so new thread time! Just going to start off with this one for now: kopite7kimi on Twitter: "@VideoCardz Ah, I mean a simple mcm design with 10240 cores is not enough. Because the lift from RDNA2 to RDNA3...

forums.anandtech.com

branch_suggestion · Sep 9, 2024

Mahboi said:
AIMD king of Compute
I may crap on AI all day but it is a legitimately amazing all-around capable HPC chip too so...yay of big stuff.

It is all but certain that MI350 and onwards will gut FP64, just as Blackwell did.
Still overall better in HPC regardless.

reaperrr3 said:
IIRC, the latest rumors are pointing more in the 270mm² direction.

But generally speaking, size isn't necessarily a good indicator. Not all architectural improvements cost much area, sometimes newly designed IP blocks even occupy less area.
Case in point: Despite more L0 and L1 cache, improved RT and doubled maximum FP32 throughput, Navi33 is 25mm² smaller than N23, and normally the N6 process doesn't offer enough density improvement over N7 to accomplish that, so they must've reduced the size of some units while still improving their performance.

For RDNA4, the known info and rumors suggest RT-Performance per CU per clock may more than double. That doesn't mean double the FPS, but the perf hit taken from enabling RT may get cut in half.
Basically, in games where a 7900XTX may drop from 100 to 60 fps if you enable RT, an N48 card may only drop from 100 to 80 (or 90 to 72).

Besides, if the architecture is better optimized for clocks/efficiency than its predecessor, a ~20% higher clockspeed can do a lot for performance per area, and RDNA4 is suggested to clock significantly higher than RDNA3.

I'm still banking on SkyJuice dropping the nuke outta nowhere.

ToTTenTranz · Sep 9, 2024

linkgoron said:
You're suggesting that Navi 48 at 240mm^2 will compete with the 4070ti at 294mm in raytracing?

If the former is clocking 25% higher and has +33% more memory channels? Yes, absolutely.

Ghostsonplanets · Sep 9, 2024

Hans Gruber said:
The only real benefit AMD has this round is the silicon. Nvidia will be using essentially the same silicon as the 40 series

Nvidia will use TSMC 4NP. Everyone will be on the same playing field regarding manufacturing node.

Glo. · Sep 9, 2024

AMD announces unified UDNA GPU architecture — bringing RDNA and CDNA together to take on Nvidia's CUDA ecosystem

Two become one.

www.tomshardware.com

So, next gen GPUs will become unified. But what it means is that the UDNA GPUs will span from APUs to desktop to server/HPC products.

Tuna-Fish · Sep 9, 2024

Hans Gruber said:
Nvidia will be using essentially the same silicon as the 40 series

Will they? They could move to their own rebranded version of N4P too. I would certainly expect them to.

Hans Gruber said:
For AMD's sake, I hope they use 20gbit DDR6.

The rumors are that the top card of the lineup will, with the cut models cutting memory speed.

I understand that the price difference between 20GT and 18GT GDDR6 is greater than usual for such a small speed difference, and has grown recently. Apparently a huge portion of all GDDR6 made still doesn't make the cut for 20GT speeds, and the consoles helped make 20GT more affordable by being a huge volume customer for the bad bins.

Mahboi · Sep 9, 2024

branch_suggestion said:
It is all but certain that MI350 and onwards will gut FP64, just as Blackwell did.
Still overall better in HPC regardless.

Sad, but not that surprising. So what, they'll have another top tier HPC chip? Or they're just not caring for now, AI takes all?

branch_suggestion said:
I'm still banking on SkyJuice dropping the nuke outta nowhere.

The Angstronomics guy? Is he still alive? Haven't heard a thing in forever.

branch_suggestion · Sep 9, 2024

Glo. said:
AMD announces unified UDNA GPU architecture — bringing RDNA and CDNA together to take on Nvidia's CUDA ecosystem

Two become one.

www.tomshardware.com

So, next gen GPUs will become unified. But what it means is that the UDNA GPUs will span from APUs to desktop to server/HPC products.

And now everything makes sense.
When UDNA1 or whatever is introduced, might be as early as MI350.
As was said earlier, this means Instinct gets the better WGP and memory hierarchy of RDNA, and Radeon gets some low cost Matrix accel as NV's heavier approach yields little actual performance on client due to membw bottlenecks.
Still better than an NPU, assuming it has support.
Having one core uArch with a lot of levers depending on the application is what NV has done since forever. It does slightly limit maximum PPA for a given market, but you have only one set of everything to manage instead of two.
Besides, halo parts win on how much area you are willing to commit to, so small changes here don't really matter.

Mahboi said:
Sad, but not that surprising. So what, they'll have another top tier HPC chip? Or they're just not caring for now, AI takes all?

More or less, FP64 is very hungry in every way, most HPC apps are memory bound, common theme.

Mahboi said:
The Angstronomics guy? Is he still alive? Haven't heard a thing in forever.

I believe.

Mahboi · Sep 9, 2024

branch_suggestion said:
And now everything makes sense.
When UDNA1 or whatever is introduced, might be as early as MI350.

This is lovely but calling it UDNA doesn't sit right. Sounds like Jawa language.

(best subtitles ever)

Also Radeon DNA was a meh name, Compute DNA was just silly, Unified DNA is just....nah. Unified Radeon or Ultimate Radeon?
Universal Radeon Architecture - Neural Unified Scaffold

branch_suggestion said:
As was said earlier, this means Instinct gets the better WGP and memory hierarchy of RDNA, and Radeon gets some low cost Matrix accel as NV's heavier approach yields little actual performance on client due to membw bottlenecks.
Still better than an NPU, assuming it has support.
Having one core uArch with a lot of levers depending on the application is what NV has done since forever. It does slightly limit maximum PPA for a given market, but you have only one set of everything to manage instead of two.
Besides, halo parts win on how much area you are willing to commit to, so small changes here don't really matter.

Yay for finally going to the deep end.

Kepler_L2 · Sep 9, 2024

Glo. said:
AMD announces unified UDNA GPU architecture — bringing RDNA and CDNA together to take on Nvidia's CUDA ecosystem

Two become one.

www.tomshardware.com

So, next gen GPUs will become unified. But what it means is that the UDNA GPUs will span from APUs to desktop to server/HPC products.

Told ya http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=thread...ical-discussion.2619688/page-15#post-41283811

Mahboi · Sep 9, 2024

Kepler_L2 said:
Told ya http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=thread...ical-discussion.2619688/page-15#post-41283811

Yeah I remember.
You're a good leaker, have a cookie and some milk for your wccftech baiting.

marees · Sep 9, 2024

Glo. said:
AMD announces unified UDNA GPU architecture — bringing RDNA and CDNA together to take on Nvidia's CUDA ecosystem

Two become one.

www.tomshardware.com

So, next gen GPUs will become unified. But what it means is that the UDNA GPUs will span from APUs to desktop to server/HPC products.

Looks like AMD has a long term strategy / vision

I am still suspicious/skeptical of short/medium term execution

The absence of a monolithic navi '49' to replace n31 sucks. It feels like Lisa Su took her toys back & went home

marees · Sep 9, 2024

?????

FSR 4 🤔

https://twitter.com/x/status/1833160336872005955

Mahboi · Sep 9, 2024

marees said:
Looks like AMD has a long term strategy / vision

I am still suspicious/skeptical of short/medium term execution

What execution? They murdered all RDNA 4 chiplets and only outputting a tiny laptop die and a monolithic small die in case all chiplets failed. There is nothing left to execute, N44/48 out, then it's everyone on board the chiplets train for MI350X and same thing but on a cheaper solution for RDNA 5.

marees said:
The absence of a monolithic navi '49' to replace n31 sucks. It feels like Lisa Su took her toys back & went home

So it does.
I can accept the whole "we focus everything on compute so F gheymers" if at least the compute SW support really gets boosted hard in the next 2 years.
Just...get Blender to run decently. Please. And get some freaking early support for RDNA 4 for everything.
Literally my only request is to not freaking wait 7 months for VR to work this time, or to see that the HW has the chops but the SW just doesn't use it right.
You can't get all the software running in 2 years but you can make some heavy strides.

SolidQ · Sep 9, 2024

marees said:
FSR 4

I think maybe with RDNA4?

DokiDoki · Sep 9, 2024

What flip-flop means to mortals:

What flip-flop means to AMD: indecision regarding what their high-level GPU-architecture is supposed to be like.

marees · Sep 9, 2024

SolidQ said:
I think maybe with RDNA4?

RDNA 4 all set to be revealed

Sony is holding a PlayStation “Technical Presentation” tomorrow, just days after teasing a PS5 Pro console. The nine-minute stream will be hosted by Mark Cerny, the lead architect of the PS5 console. Cerny previously revealed the full PS5 specs ahead of its debut in 2020.
The stream will start at 8AM PT / 11AM ET / 4PM UK on September 10th and will be broadcast on the PlayStation YouTube channel. Sony hasn’t provided any further details about the technical presentation, but the announcement comes just after Sony teased the PS5 Pro in a 30th anniversary PlayStation image.

Sony announces PlayStation “Technical Presentation” after teasing a PS5 Pro

Mark Cerny looks set to announce the PS5 Pro.

www.theverge.com

branch_suggestion · Sep 9, 2024

DokiDoki said:
What flip-flop means to mortals:

What flip-flop means to AMD: indecision regarding what their high-level GPU-architecture is supposed to be like.

You're still going to buy Intel/NV until the heat death of the universe no matter what.
So why are you here?

DokiDoki · Sep 9, 2024

branch_suggestion said:
You're still going to buy Intel/NV until the heat death of the universe no matter what.
So why are you here?

I didn't know that this was a members-only safe-space for AMD enthusiasts.

marees · Sep 9, 2024

marees said:
As per leaks today is the D-day

It is here @SolidQ @blckgrffn

marees said:
RDNA 4 all set to be revealed

Sony is holding a PlayStation “Technical Presentation” tomorrow, just days after teasing a PS5 Pro console. The nine-minute stream will be hosted by Mark Cerny, the lead architect of the PS5 console. Cerny previously revealed the full PS5 specs ahead of its debut in 2020.
The stream will start at 8AM PT / 11AM ET / 4PM UK on September 10th and will be broadcast on the PlayStation YouTube channel. Sony hasn’t provided any further details about the technical presentation, but the announcement comes just after Sony teased the PS5 Pro in a 30th anniversary PlayStation image.

Sony announces PlayStation “Technical Presentation” after teasing a PS5 Pro

Mark Cerny looks set to announce the PS5 Pro.

www.theverge.com

branch_suggestion · Sep 9, 2024

marees said:
RDNA 4 all set to be revealed

Sony is holding a PlayStation “Technical Presentation” tomorrow, just days after teasing a PS5 Pro console. The nine-minute stream will be hosted by Mark Cerny, the lead architect of the PS5 console. Cerny previously revealed the full PS5 specs ahead of its debut in 2020.
The stream will start at 8AM PT / 11AM ET / 4PM UK on September 10th and will be broadcast on the PlayStation YouTube channel. Sony hasn’t provided any further details about the technical presentation, but the announcement comes just after Sony teased the PS5 Pro in a 30th anniversary PlayStation image.

Sony announces PlayStation “Technical Presentation” after teasing a PS5 Pro

Mark Cerny looks set to announce the PS5 Pro.

www.theverge.com

PS5 Pro is 3.5 with some 4 features, but still gives nice early insight.

branch_suggestion · Sep 9, 2024

DokiDoki said:
I didn't know that this was a members-only safe-space for AMD enthusiasts.

Be constructive in your critique, the same way you started your account to run damage control for Intel.

Mahboi · Sep 9, 2024

DokiDoki said:
I didn't know that this was a members-only safe-space for AMD enthusiasts.

You have nothing to bring to the conversation except spite, so why are you here?

SolidQ · Sep 9, 2024

Kepler_L2 said:
Told ya

That also going to PS6?

DokiDoki · Sep 9, 2024

Mahboi said:
You have nothing to bring to the conversation except spite, so why are you here?

It's called banter. You don't have to respond to it if you don't like it. There is an ignore button y'know.

marees · Sep 9, 2024

I

SolidQ said:
That also going to PS6?

If RDNA 5, then most likely xbox next

PS6 likely to be RDNA 6

Discussion RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

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