Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

Tigerick · Aug 22, 2022

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

Comparison of upcoming Intel's U-series CPU: Core Ultra 100U, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

Model	Code-Name	Date	TDP	Node	Tiles	Main Tile	CPU	LP E-Core	LLC	GPU	Xe-cores
Core Ultra 100U	Meteor Lake	Q4 2023	15 - 57 W	Intel 4 + N5 + N6	4	tCPU	2P + 8E	2	12 MB	Intel Graphics	4
?	Lunar Lake	Q4 2024	17 - 30 W	N3B + N6	2	CPU + GPU & IMC	4P + 4E	0	12 MB	Arc	8
?	Panther Lake	Q1 2026 ?	?	Intel 18A + N3E	3	CPU + MC	4P + 8E	4	?	Arc	12

Comparison of die size of Each Tile of Meteor Lake, Arrow Lake, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

	Meteor Lake	Arrow Lake (20A)	Arrow Lake (N3B)	Lunar Lake	Panther Lake
Platform	Mobile H/U Only	Desktop Only	Desktop & Mobile H&HX	Mobile U Only	Mobile H
Process Node	Intel 4	Intel 20A	TSMC N3B	TSMC N3B	Intel 18A
Date	Q4 2023	Q1 2025 ?	Desktop-Q4-2024 H&HX-Q1-2025	Q4 2024	Q1 2026 ?
Full Die	6P + 8P	6P + 8E ?	8P + 16E	4P + 4E	4P + 8E
LLC	24 MB	24 MB ?	36 MB ?	12 MB	?
tCPU	66.48
tGPU	44.45
SoC	96.77
IOE	44.45
Total	252.15

Intel Core Ultra 100 - Meteor Lake

As mentioned by Tomshardware, TSMC will manufacture the I/O, SoC, and GPU tiles. That means Intel will manufacture only the CPU and Foveros tiles. (Notably, Intel calls the I/O tile an 'I/O Expander,' hence the IOE moniker.)

Henry swagger · Monday at 7:43 AM

511 said:
Leaked Excel Sheet from the file looks Interesting Cougar Cove and Panther Cove for Noval lake iirc Cougar is 5-10% IPC Increase while Panther is double digit over Cougar

Where are the numbers ?

511 · Monday at 7:46 AM

Henry swagger said:
Where are the numbers ?

Mild put them in one of his video 🤣

cannedlake240 · Monday at 7:46 AM

511 said:
Panther Cove for Noval lake iirc Cougar is 5-10%

This is mlid info

eek2121 · Monday at 7:47 AM

Aeonsim said:
AVX512 isn't useless for the standard user. Plenty of basic functions, such as parsing JSON (lots of websites), text processing, sorting, base64 encoding/decoding and similar, can substantially benefit (30-60% faster) when rewritten to use AVX512 operations. The problem is simply the lack of penetration in the CPU market due to Intel's confused approach to AVX12. This has meant there has been little benefit for the massive amount of legacy code and libraries to switch to using the instructions.

You took the words right out of my mouth.

AVX-512 can accelerate a ton of workloads, even the web browser. Hopefully someone will drop a build of Firefox that supports it.

I hope all you folks are doing well. I dropped by briefly to see what is new. I have some medical issues going on, so I haven’t been on the forum very much lately.

cannedlake240 · Monday at 7:48 AM

SiliconFly said:
SOUNDS REAL AWESOME

Could be the name of the new unified arch from Royal scraps, Core and Atom? Doubt Intel had yet another top secret uarch project..

Thunder 57 · Monday at 7:50 AM

eek2121 said:
You took the words right out of my mouth.

AVX-512 can accelerate a ton of workloads, even the web browser. Hopefully someone will drop a build of Firefox that supports it.

I hope all you folks are doing well. I dropped by briefly to see what is new. I have some medical issues going on, so I haven’t been on the forum very much lately.

Hope you are getting better. You are an asset to this forum.

511 · Monday at 7:51 AM

cannedlake240 said:
This is mlid info

Yes I said iirc I don't think anything else has been leaked For IPC for PTL besides MLID Figures

SiliconFly · Monday at 8:41 AM

511 said:
Leaked Excel Sheet from the file looks Interesting Cougar Cove and Panther Cove for Noval lake iirc Cougar is 5-10% IPC Increase while Panther is double digit over Cougar

Oh! For heaven's sake! It's not an official Intel spreadsheet people. It's says "Rumor/Leaked" on the top right corner. Probably an old MLID excel sheet.

eek2121 said:
You took the words right out of my mouth.

AVX-512 can accelerate a ton of workloads, even the web browser. Hopefully someone will drop a build of Firefox that supports it.

I hope all you folks are doing well. I dropped by briefly to see what is new. I have some medical issues going on, so I haven’t been on the forum very much lately.

Get well soon!

SiliconFly · Monday at 8:46 AM

cannedlake240 said:
Could be the name of the new unified arch from Royal scraps, Core and Atom? Doubt Intel had yet another top secret uarch project..

What ever it is, sounds very exciting! Somebody pls share some insights...

🐍 Cove

511 · Monday at 9:25 AM

eek2121 said:
You took the words right out of my mouth.

AVX-512 can accelerate a ton of workloads, even the web browser. Hopefully someone will drop a build of Firefox that supports it.

I hope all you folks are doing well. I dropped by briefly to see what is new. I have some medical issues going on, so I haven’t been on the forum very much lately.

Get well soon

9949asd · Monday at 9:34 AM

ARL can turn off p core now, there is a 12 e core only cpuz score.

AcrosTinus · Monday at 9:35 AM

9949asd said:
ARL can turn off p core now, there is a 12 e core only cpuz score.View attachment 107654

I don't think so, the CPU-Z bench has the option to only bench the E-Cores.

LightningZ71 · Monday at 9:39 AM

eek2121 said:
You took the words right out of my mouth.

AVX-512 can accelerate a ton of workloads, even the web browser. Hopefully someone will drop a build of Firefox that supports it.

I hope all you folks are doing well. I dropped by briefly to see what is new. I have some medical issues going on, so I haven’t been on the forum very much lately.

get well soon!

AcrosTinus · Monday at 9:41 AM

SiliconFly said:
Oh! For heaven's sake! It's not an official Intel spreadsheet people. It's says "Rumor/Leaked" on the top right corner. Probably an old MLID excel sheet.

Get well soon!

Media literacy at its best again.

cebri1 · Monday at 9:41 AM

9949asd said:
ARL can turn off p core now, there is a 12 e core only cpuz score.View attachment 107654

That’s nuts. We need a N processor with chadmont.

DZero · Monday at 9:45 AM

Alder Lake N was pretty much a nice concept but the single channel screwed them hard.

We need a 12 or even 16 Lake -N tier processor with a GTX 1050 GPU tier.

511 · Monday at 9:52 AM

We need dual channel to feed the beast that is chadmont also from cpu z site wish CPU Z a Better bench

CPU-Z Benchmark for AMD Ryzen 9 7900X (24T) - CPU-Z VALIDATOR

Best CPU performance - 64-bit - September 2024

valid.x86.fr

511 · Monday at 9:55 AM

AcrosTinus said:
Media literacy at its best again.

I am better than Tom's Hardware at least i edited my original Post 🤣

511 · Monday at 10:03 AM

9949asd said:
ARL can turn off p core now, there is a 12 e core only cpuz score.View attachment 107654

Anyway please tell me it's real we had too many fake CPU-Z leaks already
we already have LNC data from Intel giving 130 CB R24 at 5.1 ghz we can assume chadmont to similar as RPC i will take it a bit less so approx
Assuming all core boost of 5.4 GHZ P-> 8*130*1.05 = 1088
Skymont 4.6 all core and RPC level IPC we get 100 per core at 4.6 ghz => 1600
Total would be around 2688 any comments?

Cinebench 2024 Scores [CPU & GPU] (Updated Results)

The new Version of Cinebench, 2024, benchmarks CPUs and GPUs in the popular Redshift render engine. We benchmarked all modern CPUs and GPUs and list them in our score overview.

www.cgdirector.com

9949asd · Monday at 10:07 AM

AcrosTinus said:
I don't think so, the CPU-Z bench has the option to only bench the E-Cores.really? I have a long time didn’t run cpuz.

Really? I don’t know that, I have a long time didn’t run cpuz.

9949asd · Monday at 10:15 AM

511 said:
Anyway please tell me it's real we had too many fake CPU-Z leaks already

I would say high chance it’s real.

ikjadoon · Monday at 10:22 AM

What is everyone's speculation why Intel uses older TSMC nodes for non-CPU tiles? Why not use Intel 4 or even Intel 3? Are both Intel nodes not fit for purpose here?

Meteor Lake
GPU tile - TSMC N5
SOC tile - TSMC N6
IOE tile - TSMC N6

Lunar Lake
Platform Controller Tile - TSMC N6

AcrosTinus · Monday at 10:38 AM

ikjadoon said:
What is everyone's speculation why Intel uses older TSMC nodes for non-CPU tiles? Why not use Intel 4 or even Intel 3? Are both Intel nodes not fit for purpose here?

Meteor Lake
GPU tile - TSMC N5
SOC tile - TSMC N6
IOE tile - TSMC N6

Lunar Lake
Platform Controller Tile - TSMC N6

View attachment 107658

My guess is due to de-risking.
The decision to go with TSMC has been done years ago informed by the state of Intel 3 and 4 at that time.

511 · Monday at 10:41 AM

N6 is just a cost savings measure for things that doesn't shrink well Xe GPU IP was mostly on on TSMC since the introduction of Arc also the priore CEO had contracts made pre-pat

cannedlake240 · Monday at 10:42 AM

SiliconFly said:
sounds very exciting

Apparently not a thing anymore, since rumor has It was a part of royal or something like that. Intel doesn't care about leading P cores anymore, or at least in the near future. Apple won that race. Intel bet everything on foundry and AI plays, which is part of why, according to most rumors(not just mlid), Royal was canned.

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