Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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RnR_au

Platinum Member
Jun 6, 2021
2,115
5,098
106
- Russia has well over 3x the population to throw at meat grinder (and has been using it), it takes consistent >>3:1 losses for Ukraine just to keep up
Its not like for like in terms of population numbers. Russia hasn't fully mobilised. Its very very short on workers. Its struggling on getting contracts signed even though its signup bonus is very high (by Russian standards). From a Russian narrative, its not a 'war'. Its a SMO. This is why Putin doesn't feel like he can mobilise like Ukraine has. If he did it, he would lose massive public support. The Russian support for the Ukrainian 'incursion' is already dropping.

The ratio is better than 6:1.

- And most of the fighting is on Ukraine soil, limited deep strikes by Ukraine are just a fraction of those sent in daily by Russia into smaller Ukraine. Which results in far more damage to Ukrainian civilian population, infrastructure, and gutting of the Ukraine economy.
Ukraine's economy is already on a war footing, and they are now getting a stream of revenue thanks to the frozen Russian funds. So you could say that Ukraine's economy is already dead, but its very much kept alive from outside funding. Russia don't have such an arrangement available to it.

And Russia's economy is a 1 trick pony. Oil and gas. And Ukraine has already demonstrated how vulnerable Russia is in this space. I believe that Ukraine is holding off on hitting more oil and gas refineries until after the American election. Thankfully there is no lack of targets that Ukraine can now threaten on a regular basis. The destruction of 4 months worth of ammo recently was a damn good start.
 
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trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,143
7,653
136
Speaking of the Russian economy...

View attachment 108492

Russia is not healthy

It's pretty amazing how far Putin can push his subjects into being the obedient serfs that dare not express their grievances no matter how much they suffer from his dreams of reviving the vaunted USSR with (of course) himself as their Beloved Potentate Incarnate delivering unto him every fascist's dream of acquiring unquestioned unchallenged power.

He is no Hitler with the Fuhrer's mysterious and deadly allure that convinced his countrymen they were the superior race and murdering millions of Jews "was the right thing to do". Rather, Putin is a strongarm thug, a ruthless mob boss that controls his subjects by having them fear for their lives should they dare to defy his rule. All the while he luxuriates in his opulence. What a setup. I'm so certain all of that power and wealth does not a happy man make. In the role he fashioned for himself, what rules his decision making powers is his paranoia.
 
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IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
70,733
29,887
136
Suicide robot dogs. I never imagined that from happening yet it's so logical from a practicable point of view. Much better than blowing up real live ones, although it must've crossed the minds of at least a few innovative minds in-theater.
Bomb carrying suicide dogs are a staple of video games.
 
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Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
5,777
2,067
136
Our inability to supply Ukraine should be self evident that we never prepared for a full scale war with Russia.

NATO wouldn't fight a war the same way as Ukraine has. I really don't understand your comments relevance.
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
910
75
91
Just before the US Elections, both sides are struggling to enlarge their controlled areas because there is 50% chance that Trump may win and a peace accord will follow.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
34,256
8,300
136
NATO wouldn't fight a war the same way as Ukraine has. I really don't understand your comments relevance.
So our plan was what, gift Russia the breadbasket of Europe?
To sit back and do nothing as genocide engulfs the countryside?

An airforce that is not used is rather pointless. This war is being fought with trenches on the ground and our ground game was never prepared for a full scale war.
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
5,777
2,067
136
So our plan was what, gift Russia the breadbasket of Europe?
To sit back and do nothing as genocide engulfs the countryside?

An airforce that is not used is rather pointless. This war is being fought with trenches on the ground and our ground game was never prepared for a full scale war.

Once again the US and NATO don't fight the same way that Russia and Ukraine fight. For example we use airpower to do deep interdiction strikes on supply lines and C&C. NATO airpower would decimate the rigid Russian logistic system and then use maneuver warfare similar to Ukraine's special operation in Kursk right now. NATO wouldn't engage in this type of trench warfare and Russia would quickly find it's ability to push forward crippled by lack of supplies. Kind of hard to fire massive artillery barrages when your shells are stuck in depots far behind the lines because your rail infrastructure is decimated.

The inability of the west to give Ukraine everything it needs to push the enemy out of it's country is a political decision and says nothing about NATO's conventional forces capability to defend NATO member countries.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
29,183
41,262
136
Just before the US Elections, both sides are struggling to enlarge their controlled areas because there is 50% chance that Trump may win and a peace accord will follow.



Uh, no. Trump can only lose or steal, and remember he's almost as untrustworthy as Putin.

There is a 0% chance there will be peace if Trump somehow steals another election. It would embolden Putin, not that his regime gives a shit about treaties or agreements to begin with. No one understands this better than Ukraine.

The best Trump would be able to do for his master Putin is put up roadblocks for military support, also threaten the NATO alliance. The EU will continue to support Ukraine regardless of what we do.
 
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brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
28,030
27,437
136
So our plan was what, gift Russia the breadbasket of Europe?
To sit back and do nothing as genocide engulfs the countryside?

An airforce that is not used is rather pointless. This war is being fought with trenches on the ground and our ground game was never prepared for a full scale war.
Wow
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
34,256
8,300
136
The inability of the west to give Ukraine everything it needs to push the enemy out of it's country is a political decision and says nothing about NATO's conventional forces capability to defend NATO member countries.
Whether NATO bothers to show up and defend other countries, including their own members, will ALSO be a political decision.
A potential that is not realized, is a potential that does not practically exist.
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
5,777
2,067
136
Whether NATO bothers to show up and defend other countries, including their own members, will ALSO be a political decision.
A potential that is not realized, is a potential that does not practically exist.

Article V of NATO has been previously invoked.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,143
7,653
136

And the commoners of Russia will be like "Oh, OK, whatever. It's not like we could do anything about it anyway". This with the threat of anyone and their family members being not-too mysteriously vanished if they even softly think out loud what everyone knows they should keep absolutely quiet about.

Thing is, everyone there knows what's going on by side mouthing whispers. It's just that they can't do anything as a movement or outright rebellion.

Would surprise the heck out of me if there ever was a popular uprising that would result in Putin being dragged through the streets by his heels to a public hanging.
 
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trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,143
7,653
136
Bomb carrying suicide dogs are a staple of video games.

Haven't played COD for awhile now, but you sure brought back a lot of memories having my dog do some pretty cool shit.

Thanks for the memories. And thanks for posting those awesome pix in the camera forum. You do some really great work.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
49,022
39,140
136
Do you know if the Gepards shoot air burst rounds or not?

The Gepard considerably predates AHEAD ammunition and AFAIK was never upgraded (outside of experimentally maybe) to utilize it. They fire HEI-T/SD and FAPDS-T in Ukrainian service. Also the only video we have seen from Ukraine of the Skynex system in use appeared to show it using FAPDS-T to engage a Shahed 136 drone.
 
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K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
49,022
39,140
136
Once again the US and NATO don't fight the same way that Russia and Ukraine fight. For example we use airpower to do deep interdiction strikes on supply lines and C&C. NATO airpower would decimate the rigid Russian logistic system and then use maneuver warfare similar to Ukraine's special operation in Kursk right now. NATO wouldn't engage in this type of trench warfare and Russia would quickly find it's ability to push forward crippled by lack of supplies. Kind of hard to fire massive artillery barrages when your shells are stuck in depots far behind the lines because your rail infrastructure is decimated.

The inability of the west to give Ukraine everything it needs to push the enemy out of it's country is a political decision and says nothing about NATO's conventional forces capability to defend NATO member countries.

There is also no way that we would ever assault an enemy trench system that hasn't eaten enough JDAMs to make it look like we are invading the moon.
 
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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
34,256
8,300
136

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
34,256
8,300
136
There is also no way that we would ever assault an enemy trench system that hasn't eaten enough JDAMs to make it look like we are invading the moon.
Saw a timely headline for this sort of subject. Are we prepared for a full scale conventional war?
Remember. This exists under the context of MAGA chomping at the bit to attain the power to betray NATO and leave Europe without America.

NATO 'inadequately' prepared for large-scale war with Russia, Gen. Ben Hodges says

NATO lacks adequate air defenses, military mobility, ammunition, and the mindset to be fully ready for a large-scale conventional war, retired U.S. Lieutenant General Ben Hodges said on Oct. 2.
Speaking at a discussion at the Warsaw Security Forum attended by the Kyiv Independent, Hodges said that many of Europe's political and military leaders do not fully acknowledge the realities of a possible war with Russia.
...
"We don't have adequate missile and air defense to protect our seaports, airports, and critical infrastructure," Hodges said.
NATO's eastern flank has only 5% of the air defense capabilities necessary to deter an attack, the Financial Times reported in May.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
86,098
51,668
136
Saw a timely headline for this sort of subject. Are we prepared for a full scale conventional war?
Remember. This exists under the context of MAGA chomping at the bit to attain the power to betray NATO and leave Europe without America.

NATO 'inadequately' prepared for large-scale war with Russia, Gen. Ben Hodges says

NATO lacks adequate air defenses, military mobility, ammunition, and the mindset to be fully ready for a large-scale conventional war, retired U.S. Lieutenant General Ben Hodges said on Oct. 2.
Speaking at a discussion at the Warsaw Security Forum attended by the Kyiv Independent, Hodges said that many of Europe's political and military leaders do not fully acknowledge the realities of a possible war with Russia.
...
"We don't have adequate missile and air defense to protect our seaports, airports, and critical infrastructure," Hodges said.
NATO's eastern flank has only 5% of the air defense capabilities necessary to deter an attack, the Financial Times reported in May.
Depends on what you mean by 'we'. The US is very prepared for a full scale conventional war. The rest of NATO, not so much.
 
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