Discussion RISC V Latest Developments Discussion [No Politics]

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DisEnchantment

Golden Member
Mar 3, 2017
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Some background on my experience with RISC V...
Five years ago, we were developing a CI/CD pipeline for arm64 SoC in some cloud and we add tests to execute the binaries in there as well.
We actually used some real HW instances using an ARM server chip of that era, unfortunately the vendor quickly dumped us, exited the market and leaving us with some amount of frustration.
We shifted work to Qemu which turns out to be as good as the actual chips themselves, but the emulation is buggy and slow and in the end we end up with qemu-user-static docker images which work quite well for us. We were running arm64 ubuntu cloud images of the time before moving on to docker multi arch qemu images.

Lately, we were approached by many vendors now with upcoming RISC-V chips and out of curiosity I revisited the topic above.
To my pleasant surprise, running RISC-V Qemu is smooth as butter. Emulation is fast, and images from Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora are available out of the box.
I was running ubuntu cloud images problem free. Granted it was headless but I guess with the likes of Imagination Tech offering up their IP for integration, it is only a matter of time.

What is even more interesting is that Yocto/Open Embedded already have a meta layer for RISC-V and apparently T Head already got the kernel packages and manifest for Android 10 working with RISC-V.
Very very impressive for a CPU in such a short span of time. What's more, I see active LLVM, GCC and Kernel development happening.

From latest conferences I saw this slide, I can't help but think that it looks like they are eating somebody's lunch starting from MCUs and moving to Application Processors.


And based on many developments around the world, this trend seems to be accelerating greatly.
Many high profile national and multi national (e.g. EU's EPI ) projects with RISC V are popping up left and right.
Intel is now a premium member of the consortium, with the likes of Google, Alibaba, Huawei etc..
NVDA and soon AMD seems to be doing RISC-V in their GPUs. Xilinx, Infineon, Siemens, Microchip, ST, AD, Renesas etc., already having products in the pipe or already launched.
It will be a matter of time before all these companies start replacing their proprietary Arch with something from RISC V. Tools support, compiler, debugger, OS etc., are taken care by the community.
Interesting as well is that there are lots of performant implementation of RISC V in github as well, XuanTie C910 from T Head/Alibaba, SWerV from WD, and many more.
Embedded Industry already replaced a ton of traditional MCUs with RISC V ones. AI tailored CPUs from Tenstorrent's Jim Keller also seems to be in the spotlight.

Most importantly a bunch of specs got ratified end of last year, mainly accelerated by developments around the world. Interesting times.
 

naukkis

Senior member
Jun 5, 2002
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Wouldn't emulation across profiles enable a "sort of" compatibility, using something like Qemu or even aiding emulation of profiles in hardware?
It's upward compatible, lower feature levels are executable on higher levels. Other way around it's possible for kernel to trap nonsupported instructions and emulate those like arm is recommending for cpu that lack for example div - but it's that forward path which is important. Your code build for mimimal arch will be future proof and executable any cpu with at least same feature level support
 
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naukkis

Senior member
Jun 5, 2002
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I also don't consider excessive simplicity as the way to go.
Keep it simple stupid is pretty valid design point. Complex things are hardware dependent and probably go wrong sooner or later. Good example is arm load register pair, which if used on later Apple cpus will tank performance. Without that instruction problem won't be possible at all.
 

DZero

Member
Jun 20, 2024
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Now with the development between ARM and Qualcomm and seeing that it might affect to the rest it left me think... what if Nintendo foreshadowing all of that, starts to make a BIG project to make an uArch based on RISC-V, which will work in all aspects in order to be competitive, but also allowing to be totally free to add and not add the specs they need.
While it will combat piracy with this, also they might get the prices in control and also they initially locks the accesories sales for them.

Yeah, it would be a fantasy, but seeing the current situation, even thinking on a less problematic uArch would be plausible now.
 

NostaSeronx

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2011
3,712
1,241
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"Samsung has developed Tizen based on RISC-V for developers, and a new SDK for Tizen applications designed with RISC-V will be available in 2026."

HarmonyOS variants and Tizen, I guess is going to duke it out in the Smart TV RISC-V arena eventually. Assume upcoming Smart TVs as game consoles down road.
 
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soresu

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2014
3,274
2,551
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"Samsung has developed Tizen based on RISC-V for developers, and a new SDK for Tizen applications designed with RISC-V will be available in 2026."

HarmonyOS variants and Tizen, I guess is going to duke it out in the Smart TV RISC-V arena eventually. Assume upcoming Smart TVs as game consoles down road.
I was under the impression that Tizen was absorbed into Android Wear OS.
 

soresu

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2014
3,274
2,551
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I feel that because Google is getting futher and further from Android, Samsung is preparing Tizen as backup
Dunno about them getting further from it.

If anything they refocused on Android after diverting attention to Chrome for a few years, and now Android 16 is expected a quarter earlier than usual.
 

NostaSeronx

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2011
3,712
1,241
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RVA23 with the other option flag = RISC-V Application Processor Version 3.0 profile
// RVA30 with the other option flag = RISC-V Application Processor Version 4.0 profile (about a decade gap between RVA23 <-> RVA30)
// RVA40 with the other option flag = RISC-V Application Processor Version 5.0 profile (about a two decade gap between RVA23 <-> RVA40)
Which this will probably be available for hardware target by Android 16.

Do to licensed cores not sure how fast the launch of actual devices will be.
 
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