My hot take is that's a false narrative. The i7s were consistently around $435-$445 adjusted for '24. Even at $499 the 9800X3D will have barely moved the needle for the mainstream gaming king in all these years. I'd hardly call any of it milking, you want to play you gotta pay. Same as it ever was. Don't reference HEDT before Ryzen rocked the boat on cores and threads; those numbers are Oogly = That's four kinds of ugly. And is it just me, or was arrow to the knee initially selling for above MSRP to clear out the hardcores? Not throwing shade there, they do the same with AMD CPUs and GPUs.Why let scalpers milk when AMD can milk instead??
So basically, the reviewers need to compare ARL 23H2 vs Zen5 24H2, if they want to show each system at their best?
Or simply check out the review @phoronix
Everyone gave arrow a Mulligan on not being ready for prime time. The correct way to handle the reviews would have been to say 24H2 is the current official windows version. Arrow Lake is broken on windows 11 at launch. Intel should have this issue fixed in the coming days, and we have full confidence that will happen. We will provide updated numbers at the time. Until then, BIG OOF! What were they thinking sending these out for review? Contrasted to how Zen 5 has been treated, it is highly preferential treatment.
I'll have popcorn for the 9800X3D reviews. Will the dominant narrative be that AMD pricing is bad and they should feel bad? If what I have been reading on message boards is any guide, that is going to be the talking point getting pushed the hardest. If leaks are accurate the correct narrative is that AMD now not only has the best gaming CPUs, but has increased the value by significant gains in productivity.
6th 9am CSTWhen does the review embargo drop? Anyone know?
100% my point. Loyal customers are getting boned with no kiss or lube, to put it crudely. This should not be happening and I question why it was allowed to. And why reviewers are complicit.I’m OK with reviewers testing ARL on 23H2 as you do expect that the 24H2 issues will be resolved with software updates. However, I do think reviewers should have made a much bigger effort to highlight the fact that ARL is broken on 24H2 at the moment. They’re only doing their audience a disservice by not doing so. I’ve already seen people online who bought ARL posting for help because the performance they’re seeing is awful and their systems/games keep crashing. Had reviewers informed the readers better, they probably would have at least delayed purchase or, bare minimum, known what they were getting into and not left wondering why their new build is broken.
It seems you've misspelled Win10 22h2So basically, the reviewers need to compare ARL 23H2 vs Zen5 24H2, if they want to show each system at their best?
Considering how fast all those leaked reviews disappeared even from Xitter accounts of the leakers, I'd say some black choppers and minivans were involvedLoyal customers are getting boned with no kiss or lube, to put it crudely.
Dont get me wrong, Im not whining about it. Halo products are halo products. Honestly, I'd much rather the corpo producing the products rake in the profits than scalpers. I do think that Zen 5 launch pricing was pie in the sky, meant to capitalize on early adopters, as it just didnt make sense compared to contemporary Zen 4 pricing/perf.My hot take is that's a false narrative. The i7s were consistently around $435-$445 adjusted for '24. Even at $499 the 9800X3D will have barely moved the needle for the mainstream gaming king in all these years. I'd hardly call any of it milking, you want to play you gotta pay. Same as it ever was. Don't reference HEDT before Ryzen rocked the boat on cores and threads; those numbers are Oogly = That's four kinds of ugly. And is it just me, or was arrow to the knee initially selling for above MSRP to clear out the hardcores? Not throwing shade there, they do the same with AMD CPUs and GPUs.
Many are conflating a competitive price war which existed for only a brief period in time since the 2000s with being milked. Let me cosplay Capt. Obvious for a moment since it's my favorite holiday this week: Basic performance parity in gaming means MSRPs don't last long in retail, and vendors compete on price in order to win sales.(disregarding Intel's hubris) When there is a clear champ, those products demand a premium, it's that simple. Everything else, in my considered opinion only of course, is complaint culture and psyop/marketing campaign talking points being disseminated. Be they intentional or incidental.
Seems like Intel has been out-advertising and outdoing AMD in "thought leadership" forever. If AMD wants to change the narrative, they need to figure out how the publicity game works and learn to play it better as well IMO.Everyone gave arrow a Mulligan on not being ready for prime time. The correct way to handle the reviews would have been to say 24H2 is the current official windows version. Arrow Lake is broken on windows 11 at launch. Intel should have this issue fixed in the coming days, and we have full confidence that will happen. We will provide updated numbers at the time. Until then, BIG OOF! What were they thinking sending these out for review? Contrasted to how Zen 5 has been treated, it is highly preferential treatment.
I'll have popcorn for the 9800X3D reviews. Will the dominant narrative be that AMD pricing is bad and they should feel bad? If what I have been reading on message boards is any guide, that is going to be the talking point getting pushed the hardest. If leaks are accurate the correct narrative is that AMD now not only has the best gaming CPUs, but has increased the value by significant gains in productivity.
In the DIY/retail space there is no need at present. Performance talks BS walks. All of the polls by tech sites/tubers the last year or so, have AMD at 70%+ share. 5 will get you 50 when the next polls are conducted, 3D CPUs alone will exceed all Intel CPUs put together; they were already close to doing it last go around. As I mused last week, are tech sites/tubers really that influential? They all say don''t build AM4 new, but it stays near the top in sales. It is evident that the user to user network and real bang for buck are winning, and our crowd is not nearly so susceptible to the contrived narratives.Seems like Intel has been out-advertising and outdoing AMD in "thought leadership" forever. If AMD wants to change the narrative, they need to figure out how the publicity game works and learn to play it better as well IMO.
It isn't enough to BE better, you need the masses to BELIEVE you are better. The latter is often more difficult.
With the pent-up demand due to utter failure of Arrow Lake as a viable gaming upgrade for literally anyone outside of Intel fanatics still rocking Comet or Rocket(!) Lake, AND the possibility of limited stock and thus scalping, AND the fact that increasingly appears that Zen 5 X3D will distinguish itself with the largest gaming margin win vs Intel since Alder Lake vs vanilla Zen 3, I wouldnt put it past AMD to try and slap a $479 USD price tag on it. Why let scalpers milk when AMD can milk instead??
AMD want so bad to not be the "bargain" brand, and if ever they had a product to not be the bargain brand with, its the Zen 5 X3D series.
They would need enough packaging capacity which is unlikely since AMD is pretty conservative with how much capacity they buy.There is an option that AMD will have enough stock that it will be in stock at all the major outlets, not leaving anything to scalpers that way.
Considering that Zen 5 has not sold at all, AMD can just turn most of the Zen 5 wafers they get from the foundry into 9800x3d.
Or we could see another reality. People skipping the 9800X3D because they want the fastest x86 CPU on the planet, the 9950X3D?Most likely initial stock will sell out even if priced quite high because anyone waiting to upgrade to ARL would now also be wanting a 9800x3d.
They would need enough packaging capacity which is unlikely since AMD is pretty conservative with how much capacity they buy.
Most likely initial stock will sell out even if priced quite high because anyone waiting to upgrade to ARL would now also be wanting a 9800x3d.
Seems their best software engineers have been re-assigned to their Windows 11 for ARM effort.Frequently we see the whole press community and users gang up against some issue until the responsible company responds and fixes the issue. The same should be done with Microsoft, they need to take responsibility.
That wasn't great either.Seems their best software engineers have been re-assigned to their Windows 11 for ARM effort.
Seems their best software engineers have been re-assigned to their Windows 11 for ARM effort.
LoL, both x86 vendors lick Microsoft's boots in the most pathetic way.It's almost at the point AMD and Intel should sue Microsoft for damages.
If you're just a gamer every $ is better spend on getting a better videocard than going for a 9950X3D over a 9800X3D. And despite the fact that all gamers in here are going to get a 5090 at launch, most do somewhat have a budget to balance.Or we could see another reality. People skipping the 9800X3D because they want the fastest x86 CPU on the planet, the 9950X3D?
I think it's joever for intel... 9950X is overall better than 285K in pretty much everything (except R24 of course), while X3D will be making everything else look bad in games (7800X3D already does that even now). It is a missed opportunity by intel, for sure.Jay is already testing the 9800X3D. He said "All of these charts are about to look very small." He is a bit of a flim-flam man but my gut brain says he is not BSing the troops on this one.
lol, not anymore. @Det0x got this. He also got 149 ST which is close to the 150 which the 285k got. Has the 285K passed 2800 MT?285K in pretty much everything (except R24 of course)