Question Wow the GPU market is INSANE pricey and confusing. Poor man's value GPU?

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markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
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With this new free GPU coming, I can afford to upgrade my SSD. Right now I'm just living with a 500GB SATA 3 SSD and an old 7200 RPM standard 750GB hard drive.

I really want one of the new PCIe fast 1TB drives, but there again is another area where I don't know a damn thing, and will have to ask questions and do research to figure out what I need there.

I'll probably go for a newer GPU soon, but this free one gives me a mini upgrade, and buys me time to save up. So stoked to build my new system in a few days!
 
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igor_kavinski

Lifer
Jul 27, 2020
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markjs said:
I really want one of the new PCIe fast 1TB drives, but there again is another area where I don't know a damn thing, and will have to ask questions and do research to figure out what I need there.
Click to expand...
Just go with a decent brand. This is pretty good: https://www.newegg.com/western-digital-1tb-black-sn770-nvme/p/N82E16820250217

If you want faster, go with SN850 or Samsung 980 Pro or 990 Pro. The 990 EVO is cheaper and should be fine too.

You may find SSDs from Silicon Power or Teamgroup at good prices. Those are fine too but read the specs closely. PCIe 3.0 NVMe SSDs usually max out at 3300 MB/s. PCIe 4.0 SSDs can go up to 7000 MB/s. Avoid any SSD that uses QLC NAND. The performance on these is known to tank. Another type of SSD to avoid is the DRAM-less SSD. You can avoid all these pitfalls by just going with the brands and models I mentioned in the beginning.
 
M

markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
29
91
igor_kavinski said:
Just go with a decent brand. This is pretty good: https://www.newegg.com/western-digital-1tb-black-sn770-nvme/p/N82E16820250217

If you want faster, go with SN850 or Samsung 980 Pro or 990 Pro. The 990 EVO is cheaper and should be fine too.

You may find SSDs from Silicon Power or Teamgroup at good prices. Those are fine too but read the specs closely. PCIe 3.0 NVMe SSDs usually max out at 3300 MB/s. PCIe 4.0 SSDs can go up to 7000 MB/s. Avoid any SSD that uses QLC NAND. The performance on these is known to tank. Another type of SSD to avoid is the DRAM-less SSD. You can avoid all these pitfalls by just going with the brands and models I mentioned in the beginning.
Click to expand...
I was planning to at least go with a WD or Samsung or Seagate, whatever, known HD brand, hoping that's right? I often buy stuff like team group RAM (dirt cheap) and it's never been an issue with RAM, but for HDDs of any type, I've never trusted off brands. Even WD "Green" models scare me, with the 2 years less warrantee time, what's up with that? That's never a good sign with data storage. You want at least industry standard warranty stuff!
 
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Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,564
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Not the best time to buy a SSD. The prices are much higher than a year ago.

There were some slight price decreases lately so maybe this trend will continue. On the other hand, a black swan event can bring SSD prices even higher.

Now that you say you plan to upgrade this MB+CPU in 1-2 years, can't you return what you purchased? Redistribute the MB+CPU(+RAM) money and the graphics card money towards a better CPU+MB+RAM combo.
 
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M

markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
29
91
Seba said:
Not the best time to buy a SSD. The prices are much higher than a year ago.

There were some slight price decreases lately so maybe this trend will continue. On the other hand, a black swan event can bring SSD prices even higher.

Now that you say you plan to upgrade this MB+CPU in 1-2 years, can't you return what you purchased? Redistribute the MB+CPU(+RAM) money and the graphics card money towards a better CPU+MB+RAM combo.
Click to expand...
I think I've been pretty clear this is just all I can afford now. You can't touch a latest gen AMD CPU for under $150, most are over $200. I also really want the DDR5 standard, eventually everything will need it anyway, so AM5 boards are also at least $80, which leaves me still needing an additional $80 worth of memory. Yeah I could send stuff back, but then I'm out an extra shipping charge, plus I'd have to obtain at least an additional $100-$150, which would mean waiting a month. While I could do it, I want the upgrade now.

It'd probably be a lot easier to just go with an AMD system were I to already be running DDR4. Since my current rig is ancient DDR3, it's useless. So my way of thinking was just to grab the DDR5 now, and the board that can run it. Again, at the $200 level, Intel is the ONLY possibility. No matter how much I shop around, AMD< even the lowliest system would be a minimum of $350.

Not sure what is so hard to understand about I had a $250 ceiling on my budget, but that's just the current reality for me, no matter who likes it or doesn't

In the end, there's just no beating the $50 Intel CPU and $50 open box motherboard. No way to touch that price level with AMD stuff, much as other folks wish I could, I just can't afford $300 when all I had was the $220 total I spent.
 
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In2Photos

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
2,159
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markjs said:
I think I've been pretty clear this is just all I can afford now. You can't touch a latest gen AMD CPU for under $150, most are over $200. I also really want the DDR5 standard, eventually everything will need it anyway, so AM5 boards are also at least $80, which leaves me still needing an additional $80 worth of memory. Yeah I could send stuff back, but then I'm out an extra shipping charge, plus I'd have to obtain at least an additional $100-$150, which would mean waiting a month. While I could do it, I want the upgrade now.

It'd probably be a lot easier to just go with an AMD system were I to already be running DDR4. Since my current rig is ancient DDR3, it's useless. So my way of thinking was just to grab the DDR5 now, and the board that can run it. Again, at the $200 level, Intel is the ONLY possibility. No matter how much I shop around, AMD< even the lowliest system would be a minimum of $350.

Not sure what is so hard to understand about I had a $250 ceiling on my budget, but that's just the current reality for me, no matter who likes it or doesn't

In the end, there's just no beating the $50 Intel CPU and $50 open box motherboard. No way to touch that price level with AMD stuff, much as other folks wish I could, I just can't afford $300 when all I had was the $220 total I spent.
Click to expand...
I get where you are coming from, but your logic is flawed. Just because you have a DDR5 system doesn't mean it performs any better than a DDR4 system. There is a lot more to it than that.

Also, you are comparing a brand new AMD system against open box Intel. Of course you will pay more for the AMD system. But I just spent 5 minutes on Newegg and found a Ryzen 5 4500, refurbished AsROCK A320 motherboard and 32GB of 3600MHz DDR4 for $180 (For $10 more you can get a new B450 board too). So an AMD system is possible. And the 4500 is a better CPU than the 13100 IMO. That leaves $70 for the NVME drive you want too. Just saying.

 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
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^ Thanks for making me take a look.

The 5600X includes a free 2x8GB kit of Vengeance LPX 3200. Add the ASRock B550M PRO 4 and you have a combo with PCIe 4.0 that can handle the flagship 5800X3D in the future for $204. It spanks that i3 combo in every way as previously noted.

EDIT: the wraith stealth cooler included with the 5600X works well.
 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
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Almost forgot. If the combo you bought had the hassle free 30 day return Newegg pays return shipping, you just print a label for the box.

Just food for thought. I know you are anxious to get a build done and get to gaming.
 
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In2Photos

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
2,159
2,234
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DAPUNISHER said:
^ Thanks for making me take a look.

The 5600X includes a free 2x8GB kit of Vengeance LPX 3200. Add the ASRock B550M PRO 4 and you have a combo with PCIe 4.0 that can handle the flagship 5800X3D in the future for $204. It spanks that i3 combo in every way as previously noted.
Click to expand...
There you go, even better deal. Could easily upgrade to 32GB of RAM later as well. And it actually shows $194 in cart.

Edit: I think you had the other ASRock model which is $204.

 
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markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
29
91
Ermergerd!?!

Seems VITALLY important to some of you that I get an AMD system. It's not to me, but here's the last bit of my reasoning. If I go AMD, I want AM5 and DDR5. I don't want to even bother with DDR4 boards and AM4 socket chips, as that is AMD's 'dead upgrade path'. I'd want the full AM5 board, DDR5, and and AM5 chip. If you could find me that, maybe, but even so, those prices really should come down in the next year. It's even possible in January, I might buy the stuff sell this off, and, well whatever...

What I do know is what I already have here will work fine, and be enough for me for now, with much less hassle and waiting. I appreciate the advice and I will look heavily into going AMD on my next upgrade, but I just don't want to go through all the time, trouble and such just to get a different branded system with an equally dead upgrade path.

I mean it's not like I will get double performance if I go AMD is it? At best I might believe a 25% performance increase, and even that only in some games and applications, probably most stuff would realistically be 10-15% better. When you get right down to it, it's not even that noticeable, unless you're a crazy geek, who does a lot of builds and is really anal about every drop of performance, and looking good on benchmark tests. That's just not me. Hell I haven't even overclocked anything since AMD chips with 3d Now, like 20+ years ago. Stuff is fast enough as is nowadays, I just don't fine it worth it to push my hardware past safe design for 5 framerates per second increase.

I really don't think I will be that unhappy with the hardware I just bought, nor will it be that long before I can upgrade to an AMD setup, where I can get the new AM5 socket, board with all the latest or close to features, and DDR5.

I do appreciate folks helping me understand things though. I just think I will be fine with what I have for now and massively happy with the upgrade over this core 2 duo DDR3 setup. I definitely will go AMD on my next upgrade, which likely will be in 1-2 years. At least, I will also be able to recoup a few bucks on my chip and board later as well. I figure I should be able to get $75 used for them, considering they will have never been overclocked, not used long, so there's also that factor. Also that the DDR5 can just be used in the new AMD system.

LoL I feel like a kid buying his first car, and I want the hotrod used Jaguar that dad knows will cost me too much to work on, and be unreliable, and he's steering me towards a reliable Camaro, just as fast but much better. I don't think this is that situation though that's how it feels.

I think in reality, this is probably a barely noticeable difference (to a guy like me), that might matter a lot more to other folks than me.
 
Last edited:

In2Photos

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
2,159
2,234
136
markjs said:
Ermergerd!?!

Seems VITALLY important to some of you that I get an AMD system. It's not to me, but here's the last bit of my reasoning. If I go AMD, I want AM5 and DDR5. I don't want to even bother with DDR4 boards and AM4 socket chips, as that is AMD's 'dead upgrade path'. I'd want the full AM5 board, DDR5, and and AM5 chip. If you could find me that, maybe, but even so, those prices really should come down in the next year. It's even possible in January, I might buy the stuff sell this off, and, well whatever...

What I do know is what I already have here will work fine, and be enough for me for now, with much less hassle and waiting. I appreciate the advice and I will look heavily into going AMD on my next upgrade, but I just don't want to go through all the time, trouble and such just to get a different branded system with an equally dead upgrade path.

I mean it's not like I will get double performance if I go AMD is it? At best I might believe a 25% performance increase, and even that only in some games and applications, probably most stuff would realistically be 10-15% better. When you get right down to it, it's not even that noticeable, unless you're a crazy geek, who does a lot of builds and is really anal about every drop of performance, and looking good on benchmark tests. That's just not me. Hell I haven't even overclocked anything since AMD chips with 3d Now, like 20+ years ago. Stuff is fast enough as is nowadays, I just don't fine it worth it to push my hardware past safe design for 5 framerates per second increase.

I really don't think I will be that unhappy with the hardware I just bought, nor will it be that long before I can upgrade to an AMD setup, where I can get the new AM5 socket, board with all the latest or close to features, and DDR5.

I do appreciate folks helping me understand things though. I just think I will be fine with what I have for now and massively happy with the upgrade over this core 2 duo DDR3 setup.
Click to expand...
It's not that we want you to have an AMD system, but when we try to help people with their builds we tend to treat it as if we are spending our own money. And none of us would likely have chosen the gear you did. In the end it is your money and your system, so if you are happy with it that's all that matters.
 
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I

igor_kavinski

Lifer
Jul 27, 2020
20,898
14,487
146
markjs said:
My new System will start out with a Intel Core i3-13100F, quad core "Raptor Lake" 3.4GHz CPU, on 16GB of DDR5.
Click to expand...
Which mobo and which DDR5 kit?

Asking out of curiosity only. I know your mind can't be changed and that's fine
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,564
223
106
markjs said:
Not sure what is so hard to understand about I had a $250 ceiling on my budget, but that's just the current reality for me, no matter who likes it or doesn't
Click to expand...
That is not hard to understand and I understood it very well.

What is not so easy to understand is your fixation on DDR5 on a very tight total budget, while making huge compromises elsewhere.

After all, if you stick with 16GB of RAM, but DDR4, it's not a huge loss even if you discard it after 1-2 years when you say you will make a bigger upgrade.
 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
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In2Photos said:
It's not that we want you to have an AMD system, but when we try to help people with their builds we tend to treat it as if we are spending our own money. And none of us would likely have chosen the gear you did. In the end it is your money and your system, so if you are happy with it that's all that matters.
Click to expand...
Perfectly stated. And I am just happy the RX 560 will have a good home. It was only getting used on the test bench and that was infrequently.
 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
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Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,564
223
106
Also I don't quite understand why his CPU+MB+RAM budget is limited to $200.

As I wrote in an earlier post, now that he will get that free graphics card, the idea was add those $150-$200 he reserved for a graphics card to those $200 he paid for that Intel setup (assuming he can return it and get all/some money back).

So the actual budget for CPU+MB+RAM should be $350-$400.

LE
Or you only paid $100 for the Intel CPU + MB + 16GB DDR5? Not clear to me.
 
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markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
29
91
Damn you Amazon! I was all set to build my base machine today, because the CPU cooler was to arrive. So Amazon waits until this morning to send a note to the effect of "Sorry we sold you this, but we don't actually have any, so eventually you will get a refund".

They could have done this right away, allowing me only a one day delay, but no, they wait until Saturday, so the fastest I can get it is Monday.

Anyway I ordered this one, so I hope it actually comes:


Doesn't look like anything special to be sure, but I recall Zalman being a decent brand as coolers go? (That is back when I used to build systems, 10-15 years back).
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,564
223
106
A tower cooler with a 92mm fan? Not the best choice, again.
 
M

markjs

Senior member
Sep 4, 2000
926
29
91
Seba said:
A tower cooler with a 92mm fan? Not the best choice, again.
Click to expand...
Well IDK what I'm doing here. I just needed something affordable that will do the job. Will this not work adequately?

I mean I don't overclock and I sure as well don't want to spend $80 in a heatsink.

This will work at stock speeds, right?

I can upgrade later if I should need to. I don't see why a decent CPU cooler can't be had for $30 or less.
 
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