Could 2025 be a good year for free operating systems?

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lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
58,896
9,236
126
When I quit windows, my opinion of it was neutral/positive. There were some hassles, but nothing terrible, and it generally worked well for my purposes. I just preferred gnu/linux; specifically ubuntu and gnome2. Windows has gotten worse, and gnu/linux better. I'd rather eat glass than switch back. I still set my desktop up that somewhat replicates gnome2, but I'm on debian and xfce or plasma, and I miss absolutely nothing from windows. I've only gained.
 

GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
7,797
8,852
136
Ah another "Is this Linux's big break out moment!"

No, it's not.

What I can see happening is something like Steam OS launching driving a lot of users to "linux" for a more console like gaming experience on their PCs. With the backing of an actual multi-billion dollar company keeping whatever underlying distro easily and regularly updated, along with being a very targeted use case is really what Linux needs. The Valve backing would also make sure a lot of software/hardware/peripheral device manufacturers would bother throwing the ecosystem a bone.

Then you'll get people peeling back the Steam OS part and realizing there is a whole ass operating system "like windows" in there and you'll get another minor uptick.

Honestly I figure the best Linux can really do is may 5-10% of the market with sugar daddy backing in the form of Valve.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
69,560
13,227
126
www.anyf.ca
When I quit windows, my opinion of it was neutral/positive. There were some hassles, but nothing terrible, and it generally worked well for my purposes. I just preferred gnu/linux; specifically ubuntu and gnome2. Windows has gotten worse, and gnu/linux better. I'd rather eat glass than switch back. I still set my desktop up that somewhat replicates gnome2, but I'm on debian and xfce or plasma, and I miss absolutely nothing from windows. I've only gained.

That's pretty much how I feel too. The only thing I miss is video editing programs, photoshop, and CAD programs. The Windows ones are just better than what any of the open source ones can offer. But it's a compromise I'm willing to make. Even the Windows ones are all going subscription based now too, so FTS. I would not do that even if I was still on Windows. I'm ok with paying once and owning a copy I can use for as long as I want but not paying per month to be at the mercy of the company for the program to keep working.
 
Reactions: lxskllr

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
58,896
9,236
126
Yea, subscription software is bullshit. It can sometimes make sense in the enterprise market, and especially for higher end niche software, but even in enterprise, I doubt there's many that are chomping at the bit for all the great new features being released in Office.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
12,004
2,748
136
Linux is a bad tool that can't do the job. The Harbor Freight of DEs. good in a pinch for slightly advanced individuals with regards to the tools. Bad quality compared to the established players.
 
Reactions: Indus and repoman0

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
98,483
17,078
126
Linux is a bad tool that can't do the job. The Harbor Freight of DEs. good in a pinch for slightly advanced individuals with regards to the tools. Bad quality compared to the established players.
Umm whut? Linux is the defacto os for anything internet related
 

repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
5,048
4,274
136
I use Ubuntu full time at work and it absolutely does the job and does it well. Ironically Microsoft enables it with solid browser versions of Office.

I have more problems on my personal Win11 machine than I do on my work Linux setup. Windows has turned into a real clunky POS but it still has the software I care about. Hate that it spies on me but honestly I don’t use my desktop that much anymore.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
12,004
2,748
136
Umm whut? Linux is the defacto os for anything internet related
I said DEs as in desktop environment. Not the server branch...which isn't relevant for Year of the Linux talk.

Linux gets buggy as any Samsung owner knows when the boot loop occurs.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
58,896
9,236
126
I installed my home debian system(stretch) in 2017, and have updated it in place every ~2 years since. It's never been anything but rock solid stable. Previous to that, the install went back to ~2009. I switched to very different hardware, and it didn't like the drives being swapped over. Instead of dicking around with it to fix it, I did a fresh install, but it could've been fixed if I put the time in. My systems have never been anything but stable.

Code:
DISTRIB_ID=Debian
DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Debian GNU/Linux installer"
DISTRIB_RELEASE="9 (stretch) - installer build 20170615+deb9u4"
X_INSTALLATION_MEDIUM=cdrom
 
Reactions: Indus

Indus

Lifer
May 11, 2002
14,004
9,790
136
I installed my home debian system(stretch) in 2017, and have updated it in place every ~2 years since. It's never been anything but rock solid stable. Previous to that, the install went back to ~2009. I switched to very different hardware, and it didn't like the drives being swapped over. Instead of dicking around with it to fix it, I did a fresh install, but it could've been fixed if I put the time in. My systems have never been anything but stable.

Code:
DISTRIB_ID=Debian
DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Debian GNU/Linux installer"
DISTRIB_RELEASE="9 (stretch) - installer build 20170615+deb9u4"
X_INSTALLATION_MEDIUM=cdrom

I like and use LMDE personally but they're both debian.. I just prefer the Cinnamon flavor of it.
 
Reactions: lxskllr

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
58,896
9,236
126
I kind of had an interest in Mate(gnome2 continuation) when it was released, but I had my doubts about it being a viable project over time, so I went with xfce. Turns out they've done a good job keeping Mate going, and it would've been a solid choice, but I'm used to xfce now, and it's basically an uglier version of Mate. Does what I need.

Every once in awhile I consider switching to plasma on my home machine, but having that at work, and xfce at home keeps my feet in the qt and gtk worlds so I can see what's going on. I have been increasingly unhappy with gtk though. It's fine right now, but it's mainly developed for gnome, and they don't care about anyone else. I can imagine the day coming when I get tired of it, and go completely qt.
 
Dec 10, 2005
27,211
11,352
136
I use Ubuntu full time at work and it absolutely does the job and does it well. Ironically Microsoft enables it with solid browser versions of Office.
I want to pull my hair out at work, at least what is left of it, whenever I have to edit a slide deck in the browser version of PowerPoint (usually because it's on another company's SharePoint, and you can't use the desktop version to open live copies of those).
 

repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
5,048
4,274
136
I want to pull my hair out at work, at least what is left of it, whenever I have to edit a slide deck in the browser version of PowerPoint (usually because it's on another company's SharePoint, and you can't use the desktop version to open live copies of those).
Well, who knows, maybe the browser versions aren’t actually solid, but they do the job well for my limited usage. I spend the vast majority of time in VS code and about ten terminator windows.
 

manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
12,780
3,571
136
Well, who knows, maybe the browser versions aren’t actually solid, but they do the job well for my limited usage. I spend the vast majority of time in VS code and about ten terminator windows.
That's a lot of assassinations.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
19,743
13,675
136
I use Ubuntu full time at work and it absolutely does the job and does it well. Ironically Microsoft enables it with solid browser versions of Office.
Chromium only I assume? That's the experience I've had with browser-based Teams IIRC.

The browser version of MSO mandates everything being saved in OneDrive, is that correct?
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
19,307
6,321
136
Yea, subscription software is bullshit. It can sometimes make sense in the enterprise market, and especially for higher end niche software, but even in enterprise, I doubt there's many that are chomping at the bit for all the great new features being released in Office.
I mostly agree, but I have an Microsoft365 family subscription, for the storage, where it makes sense to have a subscription based model though.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
19,307
6,321
136
Also living in EU our windows 11 experience differ from yours, for instance I always wonder why you are annoyed by ads in your OS.

According to Microsoft, Windows 11 users in the European Economic Area (EEA) will have the ability to deactivate the built-in Bing search, disable the Microsoft News feed and ads in the Widgets pane, remove Microsoft Edge, and add third-party search engines, including Google. The changes are part of reforms the company is making to its operating system to comply with the EU Digital Markets Act, which comes into force in 2024. Under the new rules, Microsoft will be required to comply with many regulations, including making it easy to remove pre-installed apps and change default settings.

Microsoft will allow removing the following inbox apps:


  • Camera
  • Cortana
  • Web Search from Microsoft Bing, in the EEA
  • Microsoft Edge, in the EEA
  • Photos


 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
49,806
6,150
136
Huh, isn't Google nuking ChromeOS because it's a failure outside of selling a bunch of units to schools that were largely misused and abused?

For the home users you're talking about, a good iPad is fine. Making that into a mini PC format doesn't add anything for them. It does tie them to sitting at a desk.

I realize we're a niche case, but the real complaint of geeks over these years is that iPadOS continues to limit the true usefulness of the hardware*. Geeks actually want convergence in the other direction: make iPadOS more like macOS so that you get real desktop-class apps. But convergence means Apple sells fewer devices, so why would they ever do that?

* All recent iPad Pros are basically Mac minis now, without the external ports. But most often they are used as media consumption devices. A couple years back, they did make it possible to connect an iPad Pro to a display, KB+mouse but you're still stuck with a bunch of "mobile" apps.

Quite the opposite, ChromeOS was a HUGE success! Over 30 million Chromebooks were shipped in 2020 alone. More recently, they released ChromeOS Flex as a free way to keep older x86 devices alive:


I HATE throwing away or recycling older, functional hardware when it can be upcycled! I'm nuking about 50 old Dell C2D towers right now on a client upgrade (just load up a Ventoy stick with Memtest86+, DBAN, and Flex) to be repurposed as donation hardware. We have a place here that handles distribution to good causes & even offers tax deductions:


Google is in a pickle because:

1. iPad owns the tablet market
2. Android & ChromeOS overlap
3. Everything is going ARM

Consolidating platforms for new hardware architectures makes sense at this point in time. For home users, Chromebooks were mismarketed & got huge returns because people thought they were cheap Windows laptops, but then couldn't run standard home, school, or work applications. Microsoft swooped in with cheap Windows S-mode laptops & web-based Office 365 apps that Chromebooks could use.

However:

1. Most people just use their phones these days
2. The rest mostly use basic laptops, as they are so cheap these days
3. Non-gamers & non-nerds (mom, grandma, etc.) mostly need a Chromebox, but better. An iPad Mac "Micro" desktop with apps & a secure app store would be 10/10! Easy browsing, social media apps, simple Capcut to edit videos, etc.

Personally, I live on my iPad:


Easy to use a desktop with a Bluetooth keyboard & mouse, big screen, and RDP into a real PC. Or use with a docking station, USB keyboard & mouse. The iPad Pro, iPad Air (5th generation), and iPad mini (A17 Pro) can output 4K@60Hz over HDMI 2.0. They have really fantastic cloud PC's to rent now too:





 

manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
12,780
3,571
136
Quite the opposite, ChromeOS was a HUGE success! Over 30 million Chromebooks were shipped in 2020 alone. More recently, they released ChromeOS Flex as a free way to keep older x86 devices alive:
Chrome OS was so successful that Google is basically tossing it aside and promoting Android instead!
Like I said, a bunch of the 2020 sales were in the midst of Covid, kids pretending to do "remote learning," and urban school districts buying up Chromebooks en masse because it made sense to service low-income folks. What actually happened is it turned into a bunch of e-waste within a couple years.

Also, remember it's Google we're talking about here. Outside of its sacred cows that generate massive profits, any product can be cancelled when it's not making enough pure profit. Not that I care, but what happens to Chrome OS Flex now?
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
60,759
16,007
136
I HATE throwing away or recycling older, functional hardware when it can be upcycled! I'm nuking about 50 old Dell C2D towers right now on a client upgrade (just load up a Ventoy stick with Memtest86+, DBAN, and Flex) to be repurposed as donation hardware. We have a place here that handles distribution to good causes & even offers tax deductions:
I'm still using an Asus Eee netbook for my NAS needs (running Linux)
It consumes like ~16 watts/hour according to my Kill-a-watt.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
60,759
16,007
136
Microsoft is killing windows slowly. Getting worse and worse as the years progress.
The enshitification of windows is slow though. So many people eat the shit they are given (aka windows 11)
The Win11 UI is soooo fucking shit I'm thinking of actually paying for Start11.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
49,806
6,150
136
Chrome OS was so successful that Google is basically tossing it aside and promoting Android instead!
Like I said, a bunch of the 2020 sales were in the midst of Covid, kids pretending to do "remote learning," and urban school districts buying up Chromebooks en masse because it made sense to service low-income folks. What actually happened is it turned into a bunch of e-waste within a couple years.

Also, remember it's Google we're talking about here. Outside of its sacred cows that generate massive profits, any product can be cancelled when it's not making enough pure profit. Not that I care, but what happens to Chrome OS Flex now?

The global Chromebook market size was USD $30 billion in 2023. Chromebooks actually have 10 years of automatic updates!


Android was released in 2008 & ChromeOS was released 13 years ago, back in 2011. They added the Google Play Store to Chromebooks around 2016, as the laptops got more powerful:


Unifying both mature mobile systems onto ARM architecture makes a lot of sense, as Android is 16 years old & certain Chromebooks have been able to run Android apps for at least 8 years now (note that Flex doesn't support the Play Store or Android). Having cheap, good hardware available is great for developments like this! You can buy a decent Android tablet for $55 on Amazon these days, haha! AI is taking everything over now:


It will happen...eventually, lol:

These improvements in the tech stack are starting now but won’t be ready for consumers for quite some time. When they are, we’ll provide a seamless transition to the updated experience. In the meantime, we continue to be extremely excited about our continued progress on ChromeOS without any change to our regular software updates and new innovations.

To me, it makes sense to merge the systems at this point:

1. Better, cheaper hardware with faster, cooler ARM support
2. Add Android apps
3. Add AI capabilities
 
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