If you can get through a big repack/decompressing data installation, your cpu is doing well. I had a 100% fail rate before RMA, and now a 100% success rate since RMA. When it hits all 24 cores at 100% for max power, eventually I started failing at 80% and eventually couldn't get beyond 10% without a BSOD. My CPU was so baked that at a 400a core cache current, my CPU couldn't even pull more than 160w on all core workloads.
These CPUs, while great, had more issues outside of the microcode updates. The unlimited power limits among ICC, its just crazy seeing how differently my CPU operates now vs at launch. I use to hit 100 C on a 420mm AIO, and now nothing over 75 C on the same AIO, doing the same things that use to bring it to 100 C.
Shader comp hits the CPU pretty hard too, I use to have to limit my first CPU below 160w just to finish shader comp without crashing. When they sent me a new 13900k, it's been an absolute champ.
If your CPU is rapidly degrading, you'll know it. Fastest BSOD shut downs I ever seen, sometimes the damn thing would just shut off completely.
Hopefully all of the mitigations work and there will be no need for another RMA. Even then, the CPUs being slower than the day they released is a big L in my book. Particularly seeing as at least 3 generations of Ryzen saw more significant performance uplifts than Intel from windows updates.Hmm, wonder how long that new 13900k will last?
Yes, the sooner it is a skeleton in the closet the happier they'll be. However, support demand says the users have not forgotten yet.Regardless, it's unsurprising to see Intel moving past Raptor Lake.
I don't remember them promising any such tool. In fact all I ever remember is reports that no, such tool is not planned. So it's silly to hold them accountable for "promise" they never made.As many of us anticipated, they are trying to bury this as fast as possible. They have not followed through on providing a testing tool -
They have not caught up with demand for tech support either - https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support.html
One commenter's experience is how we got here -
Your memory is failing you on this one. As of October Intel told Tom's they were still efforting a tool - LINKI don't remember them promising any such tool. In fact all I ever remember is reports that no, such tool is not planned. So it's silly to hold them accountable for "promise" they never made.
Testing tool? What should it test? How many combinations of motherboards, bioses and settings are possible? I cannot imagine any voltage testing would bring reliable results in such situation.They have not followed through on providing a testing tool.
Don't ask me these questions, ask Intel. It's their BBQ that's burnt, not mine.Testing tool? What should it test? How many combinations of motherboards, bioses and settings are possible? I cannot imagine any voltage testing would bring reliable results in such situation.
See above.For testing stability of the CPUs the users already have the applications they need to run and other stability testing tools availale. There is an official Intel CPU stability testing tool, which runs a few short loads - how could that be better than what people already have?
That certainly seems to be the case with rapture lake lol. I have serviced 15yr old daily drivers where components failed, but the CPU was chugging right along.There is a problem here: extensive stability testing itself can lead to CPU degradation. Somebody can have a CPU which could last him a few years with his use case with no problem, but he could substantially shorten its life if he tested it for stability too much.
Are you sure that even the modern TSMC processes are so robust and long lasting as the 15 year old tech used to be? It would be nice if somebody could find a compaison of size of the transistors in CPUs of today and past.That certainly seems to be the case with rapture lake lol. I have serviced 15yr old daily drivers where components failed, but the CPU was chugging right along.
There is a major problem with a lot of this logic. Read below.Testing tool? What should it test? How many combinations of motherboards, bioses and settings are possible? I cannot imagine any voltage testing would bring reliable results in such situation.
For testing stability of the CPUs users already have the applications they need to run and other stability testing tools available. There is an official Intel CPU stability testing tool, which runs a few short loads - how could that be better than what people already have?
There is a problem here: extensive stability testing itself can lead to CPU degradation. Somebody can have a CPU which could last him a few years with his use case with no problem, but he could substantially shorten its life if he tested it for stability too much.
That is true......
Way too many questions, but the bottom line is Intel made a bad product and handled the case badly.
Almost 80% of the target market isn't gonna be that. Pareto Principle.So for knowledgeable people
Why should it be the responsibility of the end-user of their product to do that? My 4790k is happily running internet and office apps.That is true.
The other point of view is that now you can get 20 or 24 core CPUs for very good price, which will serve you well, once you understand their limitation and set the power draw and frequency limits so that the CPUs cannot damage themselves.
So for knowledgeable people these CPUs are a great deal.
It should not be. But in spite of what should or should not be, the situation now is that the CPUs are still sold with those mad settings. If you buy a new 13900KS today, it will still default to 320W power limit. That is insane.Why should it be the responsibility of the end-user of their product to do that?
Again, why should this be the responsibility of the end-user? You seem to be arguing this isn’t a major issue of defective cpus being knowingly sold because a tiny fraction of people know enough about computers to “maybe” mitigate the issued. The 13900k and 14900k should never been released it seems. I find it odd to state these are good values over AMD even if you know how to mitigate the issues wither failure rate.It should not be. But in spite of what should or shouild not be, the situation now is that the CPUs are still sold with those mad settings. If you buy a new 13900KS today, it will still default to 320W power limit. That is insane.
If you know what is happening and you can make a few basic settings in BIOS, you can get a great value product.
I wrote already: It should not be. I will write it again: IT SHOULD NOT BE!!!Again, why should this be the responsibility of the end-user?
A great deal everyone! I think not. Only way I would EVER consider using one of these chips is if you sent me the rest of the parts for the build and I used it for something I don't need to rely on.That is true.
The other point of view is that now you can get 20 or 24 core CPUs for very good price, which will serve you well, once you understand their limitation and set the power draw and frequency limits so that the CPUs cannot damage themselves.
So for knowledgeable people these CPUs are a great deal.
Running a 14700K at reduced settings is probably still slower than the AMD 8 core version. And it's end of life. Still don't want it. Quit trying to justify these chips. They will likely go down as one of the worst CPUs of all time.It should not be. But in spite of what should or should not be, the situation now is that the CPUs are still sold with those mad settings. If you buy a new 13900KS today, it will still default to 320W power limit. That is insane.
If you know what is happening and you can make a few basic settings in BIOS, you can get a great value product. 14700K is a 20 core CPU and the closest AMD price competitor from AMD has 8 cores.
Buying a CPU that could STILL degrade and reboot is not a great deal. Not to mention, you have to turn down the wattage a lot, and then the performance BITES.That is true.
The other point of view is that now you can get 20 or 24 core CPUs for very good price, which will serve you well, once you understand their limitation and set the power draw and frequency limits so that the CPUs cannot damage themselves.
So for knowledgeable people these CPUs are a great deal.
That's plain FUDAre you sure that even the modern TSMC processes are so robust and long lasting as the 15 year old tech used to be? It would be nice if somebody could find a compaison of size of the transistors in CPUs of today and past.
It should not be. But in spite of what should or should not be, the situation now is that the CPUs are still sold with those mad settings. If you buy a new 13900KS today, it will still default to 320W power limit. That is insane.
If you know what is happening and you can make a few basic settings in BIOS, you can get a great value product. 14700K is a 20 core CPU and the closest AMD price competitor from AMD has 8 cores.
If they are going to keep dying despite the mitigations, that's the only way I'd take one. It'd be fun to use it on games with long shader compiles or lots of asset streaming like the Spiderman games and see if it 💩 the bed. And if so, how long it takes. Because I can go 6-8hrs straight on a game; sometime longer. Last of Us 4K max settings had my PC throwing out the warmest air I've ever felt from it after a session that long. 7800X3D+7900XTX runs perfectly of course.Even for free, I wouldn't touch it.
Read that again. The replacement for the first CPU came BEFORE the BIOS update and has been used heavily before the BIOS update.If you ever doubted it's Stockholm Syndrome -
The 2nd one died despite an up to date bios. This is the first report I've read of that happening.
Read that again. The replacement for the first CPU came BEFORE the BIOS update and has been used heavily before the BIOS update.
has been used heavily
Technically I think he's correct. The reddit user had a bum 13700k, got a replacement, ran it before updating his UEFI, scorched it too, and got a replacement 14700k because Intel has probably run out of 13-series chips and has no choice in the matter.
Speaking of Stockholm Syndrome...
My comment was about the post mitigations failure. Had you read my post correctly.
"Unfortunately, I started experiencing stability issues a bit recently despite update-to-date bios which prompted a second ticket. Intel both times has responded well"
This has been a drum you keep beating. If I can't use my CPU heavily for fear of failure, it's broken.