Discussion Nvidia Blackwell in Q1-2025

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Win2012R2

Senior member
Dec 5, 2024
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Yeah, but that requires also custom made GPUs - will only work if everybody starts making them, otherwise resell value might plummet if it requires custom motherboard.
 

Saylick

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2012
3,798
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Honestly, the fact that we have >500W GPUs in desktops is the main problem. 450W, which can be supported via 3x8 pin, wasn’t good enough for peeps?
 
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Win2012R2

Senior member
Dec 5, 2024
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Honestly, the fact that we have >500W GPUs in desktops is the main problem.
It's the end user problem, like fuel consumption of V12. As long as people want 'em and pay for 'em it's ok...

Now what's bad and should not be happening is allowing wattage go 50% up for a minor 10%-ish overlock, that stuff should stop but I can't see it happening without legislation, which will never happen in the US.

If it was 600w but with optimal clocking, then it would be fine to get more perf - only minor problem in this otherwise fine plan: it will require wider bigger chips, so more expensive to produce in the first place.
 

Saylick

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2012
3,798
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It's the end user problem, like fuel consumption of V12. As long as people want 'em and pay for 'em it's ok...

Now what's bad and should not be happening is allowing wattage go 50% up for a minor 10%-ish overlock, that stuff should stop but I can't see it happening without legislation, which will never happen in the US.

If it was 600w but with optimal clocking, then it would be fine to get more perf - only minor problem in this otherwise fine plan: it will require wider bigger chips, so more expensive to produce in the first place.
That analogy works, but it’s more like if the V12 supercar had a special high-flow fuel nozzle that sometimes would overflow the tank and spill out if it was not properly inserted into the fuel tank, and the manufacturer of that car then decided to use that same nozzle for the rest of their lineup, including more economical cars which don’t need a high-flow nozzle to begin with. Nor did any other car that came before it.
 
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Win2012R2

Senior member
Dec 5, 2024
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if the V12 supercar had a special high-flow fuel nozzle that sometimes would overflow the tank and spill out if it was not properly inserted
Supercars especially, got a lot of special very expensive non-standard stuff that can go wrong if not "properly inserted"
 
Jul 27, 2020
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I'm guessing they have a glut of unsold 4090s. Hence the gaping VRAM hole between 5080 16GB and 5090 32GB. Or they plan to release a 5080 Super 24GB later.
 
Jul 27, 2020
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Still $2000 for a 2 year+ old card about to be replaced.
That's the retailers themselves holding onto stock in their warehouses. They have gotten clever. Remember how Newegg was selling some brand new RX 5600s just a year ago? There are retailers in UAE holding onto even RX 6800 XT, 6900 XT and 6700 XT stock and trying to sell them at launch prices instead of facing reality. And 3090 Ti selling for over $1000.
 

Tuna-Fish

Golden Member
Mar 4, 2011
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it's not fine PCI-SIG literally had to amend the POS.
But "we're gonna pump a zillion amps over tiny ass pins on a microscopic connector" is truly one for the road.
They could've just opted for 48V rails but noooo.
Everybody knows that 48V DC would be better for both GPU and CPU VRMs. There is just a serious transition problem here. NV could introduce the 12-pin connector by putting an adapter that eats 8-pin connectors in the box. You can't do the same for 48V, everyone would have to switch PSUs and GPUs at the same time.
These guys seem to be on the right track:

That's still just 12V, on very thick copper.
 
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Heartbreaker

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2006
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Everybody knows that 48V DC would be better for both GPU and CPU VRMs.

Everything I read, said the opposite. It more difficult to do the DC-DC conversion on 48V to ~1V range of ICs, than it is to go from 12V.

For DC Downconverter spec sheets I have seen, the larger the delta between Vin and Vout, the lower the efficiency.

So if you ran 48V DC to a GPU, you would end up with much more waste heat. That would make GPU power problem worse, not better.
 
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Win2012R2

Senior member
Dec 5, 2024
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Less than 24 hours left till CES and still ZERO leaks on 5080/5090 perf???

You can't do the same for 48V, everyone would have to switch PSUs and GPUs at the same time.
Perhaps Nvidia could bundle new PSU with 2 grand cards? If that makes them perform better (even if it's just lower power) than what's the problem? Get top models on board of thise - whoever is buying 5090 will be ok with it, as long as it brings real benefits though
 

xnery007

Junior Member
Dec 25, 2024
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I'm not surprised at all that there are no leaks; it was enough for me to read on Guru3D years ago about how Nvidia treats its AIB partners.

Guru3D: "I'll let you in on that secret. The AIB partners have all been prepping their cards for months now. They have the products, engineering boards for a while. NVIDIA however, has not released a driver that works with anything other than the test software they supply. So get this, I am writing this article on September 1st, hours before the presentation, and still, the board partners have no idea what the performance is going to be like. We need to advance on that as the board partners even do not know the thermal capacity effect of their products. NVIDIA has provided them with test software that will work with the driver. Basically, these are DOS-like applications that run stress tests. No output is given other than PASS or FAIL. We know the names of these test applications: NVfulcrum test and NVUberstress test. For thermals, there is another unnamed stress test, but here again, the board partners can only see PASS or FAIL. Well, we assume they have tested with thermal probes. What this paragraph, well, to show you the secrecy that NVIDIA applied for this Ampere project."
 

adroc_thurston

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2023
4,714
6,503
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Powercolor!
not a box! just a teaser.
I'm not surprised at all that there are no leaks; it was enough for me to read on Guru3D years ago about how Nvidia treats its AIB partners.

Guru3D: "I'll let you in on that secret. The AIB partners have all been prepping their cards for months now. They have the products, engineering boards for a while. NVIDIA however, has not released a driver that works with anything other than the test software they supply. So get this, I am writing this article on September 1st, hours before the presentation, and still, the board partners have no idea what the performance is going to be like. We need to advance on that as the board partners even do not know the thermal capacity effect of their products. NVIDIA has provided them with test software that will work with the driver. Basically, these are DOS-like applications that run stress tests. No output is given other than PASS or FAIL. We know the names of these test applications: NVfulcrum test and NVUberstress test. For thermals, there is another unnamed stress test, but here again, the board partners can only see PASS or FAIL. Well, we assume they have tested with thermal probes. What this paragraph, well, to show you the secrecy that NVIDIA applied for this Ampere project."
AMD doe the exact same thing, except worse (signed PSP blobs).
 
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