Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

Tigerick · Aug 22, 2022

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

Comparison of upcoming Intel's U-series CPU: Core Ultra 100U, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

Model	Code-Name	Date	TDP	Node	Tiles	Main Tile	CPU	LP E-Core	LLC	GPU	Xe-cores
Core Ultra 100U	Meteor Lake	Q4 2023	15 - 57 W	Intel 4 + N5 + N6	4	tCPU	2P + 8E	2	12 MB	Intel Graphics	4
?	Lunar Lake	Q4 2024	17 - 30 W	N3B + N6	2	CPU + GPU & IMC	4P + 4E	0	12 MB	Arc	8
?	Panther Lake	Q1 2026 ?	?	Intel 18A + N3E	3	CPU + MC	4P + 8E	4	?	Arc	12

Comparison of die size of Each Tile of Meteor Lake, Arrow Lake, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

	Meteor Lake	Arrow Lake (N3B)	Lunar Lake	Panther Lake
Platform	Mobile H/U Only	Desktop & Mobile H&HX	Mobile U Only	Mobile H
Process Node	Intel 4	TSMC N3B	TSMC N3B	Intel 18A
Date	Q4 2023	Desktop-Q4-2024 H&HX-Q1-2025	Q4 2024	Q1 2026 ?
Full Die	6P + 8P	8P + 16E	4P + 4E	4P + 8E
LLC	24 MB	36 MB ?	12 MB	?
tCPU	66.48
tGPU	44.45
SoC	96.77
IOE	44.45
Total	252.15

Intel Core Ultra 100 - Meteor Lake

As mentioned by Tomshardware, TSMC will manufacture the I/O, SoC, and GPU tiles. That means Intel will manufacture only the CPU and Foveros tiles. (Notably, Intel calls the I/O tile an 'I/O Expander,' hence the IOE moniker.)

511 · Jan 6, 2025

So MTL-H vs ARL-H is 15% ST and 15% MT perf at iso power I pressume

SiliconFly · Jan 6, 2025

511 said:
All the heavy lifting was done by Brian kranzich and bunch of other dudes company destroyed and Brain rotted from the most innovative company to most brain rotted one.
And the dudes left after mission accomplished

Don’t worry. There is a new heavy weight champ in the driving seat now. Did anyone watch Intel’s 2025 CES keynote? If not, pls don’t.

Holthaus is probably the most uninspiring person I’ve seen. With the kinda charisma, I feel she’ll take Intel places, where no company should ever go. Not much faith left in me anymore.

dttprofessor · Jan 6, 2025

SiliconFly said:
Don’t worry. There is new heavy weight champ in the driving seat now. Did anyone watch Intel’s 2025 CES keynote? If not, pls don’t.

Holthaus is probably the most uninspiring person I’ve seen. With the kinda charisma, I feel she’ll take Intel places, where no company should ever go. Not much faith left in me anymore.

She has GNR/SRF/LNL/MTL/ARL/PTL/18A/FAB34/FAB42&52&62，What Pat has ?

511 · Jan 6, 2025

dttprofessor said:
She has GNR/SRF/LNL/MTL/ARL/PTL/18A/FAB34/FAB42&52&62，What Pat has ?

IMO we don't give Pat enough credit for putting Intel back on track with Node and improving GNR and enough blame of over spending

SiliconFly · Jan 6, 2025

dttprofessor said:
She has GNR/SRF/LNL/MTL/ARL/PTL/18A/FAB34/FAB42&52&62，What Pat has ?

Oh god! Nothing belongs to her. She's specializes in finance, sales & marketing! She's Bob Swan 2.0

Also, like Swan, she's now a temp CEO & I think she'll be actual CEO soon (like Swan).

Intel board needs to be fired immediately.

dttprofessor · Jan 6, 2025

SiliconFly said:
Oh god! Nothing belongs to her. She's specializes in finance, sales & marketing! She's Bob Swan 2.0

Also, like Swan, she's now a temp CEO & I think she'll be actual CEO soon (like Swan).

Intel board needs to be fired immediately.

agree totaly

del42sa · Jan 6, 2025

https://wccftech.com/intel-showcases-panther-lake-tile-with-the-18a-process/

511 · Jan 6, 2025

SiliconFly said:
Oh god! Nothing belongs to her. She's specializes in finance, sales & marketing! She's Bob Swan 2.0

Also, like Swan, she's now a temp CEO & I think she'll be actual CEO soon (like Swan).

Intel board needs to be fired immediately.

Hope she doesn't make a TSMC 2.0 deal cause this time she doesn't have excuses

adroc_thurston · Jan 6, 2025

511 said:
Hope she doesn't make a TSMC 2.0 deal cause this time she doesn't have excuses

?
They're still making all the graphics there plus some of Novalake.

Hulk · Jan 6, 2025

Read my lips.

5 nodes in 4 years.

Or was it 3 nodes in 7 years? Or almost 4 nodes in 5 years? Or 7 nodes in 3 years, including in-house testing. Or 4 nodes in 4 years if we include 20A. Oh forget-about-it, we're dying over here, give us a break!

With the new leadership we (Intel) have a new market position philosophy. We have decided that will will firmly remain in AMD's rearview mirror. This way they will get the speeding ticket or hit the deer, not us! So far so good. They seem to be quite far ahead but we can just make them out if we squint.

DavidC1 · Jan 6, 2025

511 said:
So MTL-H vs ARL-H is 15% ST and 15% MT perf at iso power I pressumeView attachment 114313

Max Turbo P core: +300MHz(5.9%)
Max Turbo E core: +700MHz(18.4%)
Base P core: +600MHz(26%)
Base E core: +900MHz(50%)

Identical max and base TDP levels. The clock speed increase on the E cores are impressive, although it is less so compared to Raptorlake, because Meteorlake had a regression.

Base frequency increase being great doesn't really contribute to performance nowadays, but it's an indication the power profile has improved. Skymont's 50% gain over Crestmont is impressive, so the combined process + uarch has improved power efficiency greatly.

The overall clock has not regressed either so it'll do relatively much better too.

DavidC1 · Jan 6, 2025

dttprofessor said:
She has GNR/SRF/LNL/MTL/ARL/PTL/18A/FAB34/FAB42&52&62，What Pat has ?

Please tell me you are joking? Do you think these products are made in 3 months? No, it takes 3+ years. The new processes are entirely up to Pat, and most of the products you listed is also thanks to him.

dttprofessor · Jan 6, 2025

DavidC1 said:
请告诉我你在开玩笑？您认为这些产品是在 3 个月内完成的吗？不，需要 3+ 年。新流程完全取决于 Pat，您列出的大部分产品也都归功于他。

That‘s what i means.
She is lucky.

511 · Jan 6, 2025

Panther Lake live and running it is a big achievement if they already have designs and laptop running this soon means Q3 target

Harry_Wild · Jan 6, 2025

As long as Intel mobile CPUs require a fan to operate, I stick with Apple M series MacBook Air! Qualcomm Arms based are not completely compatible with Microsoft based third party software. Intel has no way to get rid of the built-in fan since it still stuck at 7 nm.

gdansk · Jan 7, 2025

Harry_Wild said:
As long as Intel mobile CPUs require a fan to operate

I have a fanless Intel laptop. It's on 14nm too! i5-7200U. I find it usable but of course it's so, so slow compared to even M1.

511 · Jan 7, 2025

Harry_Wild said:
As long as Intel mobile CPUs require a fan to operate, I stick with Apple M series MacBook Air! Qualcomm Arms based are not completely compatible with Microsoft based third party software. Intel has no way to get rid of the built-in fan since it still stuck at 7 nm.

Its not 2019

igor_kavinski · Jan 7, 2025

511 said:
Its not 2019

That's the least of his problems. Trust me.

Meteor Late · Jan 7, 2025

511 said:
Its not 2019

In fact, even in 2019 Intel didn't have 7nm CPU!

511 · Jan 7, 2025

Meteor Late said:
In fact, even in 2019 Intel didn't have 7nm CPU!

They were at 10nm than

igor_kavinski · Jan 7, 2025

Meteor Late said:
In fact, even in 2019 Intel didn't have 7nm CPU!

They did: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13405/intel-10nm-cannon-lake-and-core-i3-8121u-deep-dive-review (enhanced version of this 10nm process was later renamed to Intel 7 because Intel insists their 10nm is as good as TSMC N7)

511 · Jan 7, 2025

igor_kavinski said:
They did: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13405/intel-10nm-cannon-lake-and-core-i3-8121u-deep-dive-review (enhanced version of this 10nm process was later renamed to Intel 7 because Intel insists their 10nm is as good as TSMC N7)

Well it is true though you can see the fin pitch all they did was to better align with what TSMC/Samsung did with marketing

7 nm process - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

It's you who believes I7 is not a 7nm process

dttprofessor · Jan 7, 2025

igor_kavinski said:
They did: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13405/intel-10nm-cannon-lake-and-core-i3-8121u-deep-dive-review (enhanced version of this 10nm process was later renamed to Intel 7 because Intel insists their 10nm is as good as TSMC N7)

If you say performance,it's right more.

SiliconFly · Jan 7, 2025

Intel co-CEO Michelle Johnston Holthaus just reiterated on X/Twitter what she said during the CES keynote, that Panther Lake is a follow up to Lunar Lake (not ARL-H).

dullard · Jan 7, 2025

SiliconFly said:
Intel co-CEO Michelle Johnston Holthaus just reiterated on X/Twitter what she said during the CES keynote, that Panther Lake is a follow up to Lunar Lake (not ARL-H).

I'm sorry, but Anandtech has spoken. Holthaus is incorrect. There is absolutely no way that an ultra-low power 4+4 Panther Lake can be a successor to an ultra-low power 4+4 Lunar Lake. Memory is different thus they are not related at all, no follow up, Lunar Lake is a one off. See below for proof (And this is just from the first page of a search).

SiliconFly said:
Ian Cutress just posted this on X/Twitter. It says Lunar Lake is a one-off & no follow ups in the foreseeable future.

cebri1 said:
LNL may be a one off according to some people.

MarkizSchnitzel said:
Lunar Lake is a one-off

poke01 said:
Panther Lake U won’t be like Lunar Lake sadly.

DavidC1 said:
Lunarlake might be a one off thing just to fend off ARM.

DavidC1 said:
Will Lunarlake be a one-hit wonder with no successor like many previous Intel products that was supposed to be great?

Are they so cautious that they can't dedicate a Lunarlake successor?

SpudLobby said:
So lunar as it’s won deal is probably kind of a one-off

adroc_thurston said:
It's a one-off and for a good reason.

Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

Senior member

Attachments

Golden Member

Golden Member

Member

Golden Member

Golden Member

Member

Member

Golden Member

Diamond Member

Diamond Member

Golden Member

Golden Member

Member

Golden Member

Senior member

Diamond Member

Golden Member

Lifer

Senior member

Golden Member

Lifer

Golden Member

Member

Golden Member

Elite Member