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  1. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    If NV did the same, it wouldn't matter that much. Unless, they get Tegra going quite well and make the API cross it. Which I do believe they might do...when they finish their custom ARM core.(AMD is doing the same too, not custom, but adding ARM to the dGPU also.) But then, console wins do give...
  2. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    Lol, anyone saw this yet? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantle_%28API%29 Look at the disadvantages! Kuajajajaja All true to all API's or work done with GPU's. Dear God! People are so fake. (Well except more Dev time, but then again who really knows?)
  3. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    Well, on one of the slides it said that Mantle would leverage all of the hardware, no? (Going by memory) Maybe that means that Mantle is the one API for GCN. Graphics, Compute and Audio.
  4. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    My comment refers to the fact that none of that was announced when Valve released the "Steam Machines" information. Your link is from January, not a few weeks back. This is from the page --> "Entertainment is not a one-size-fits-all world. We want you to be able to choose the hardware that...
  5. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    But then, they didn't mention the "Steam Box" at all. Let's stay current. And if they release their own with others around... Why would anyone else get one not from Steam!? Pointless. Its an alternative where there are many alternatives to choose from.
  6. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    Here's the conference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xo1jJJGhneg
  7. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    Considering that its Audio...it should take longer to "prove". But, again, considering that its Audio. Most of us, I would expect and understand that realistic audio is awesome. I know, it can be used, but for best results, real results, one would need more speakers, no?
  8. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    The thing about Audio is that you need the hardware, and really, only hardcore people have full audio systems on their setup/room. Go to a movie theater, imagine gaming like that! *drools*
  9. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    Not at all. Valve made a market with Steam. Apple made a market with iOS. "Steam Machines" have no room. They aren't new. Or disruptive. Its a PC. Come on, market it to me. To anyone, really. Can you? If it was a "Steam Box", hey, it could work a bit. But this? Really? How? And why not just...
  10. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    I just don't see it. In any way possible. I find it worse than Android micro-consoles. At least those are truly open. But here, I have to go thru Steam. I just don't see the benefit. Its the same. Its like, "If you hate Microsoft and Apple and Ubuntu, give us a try." What's the benefits...
  11. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    Steam Machines are still going to fail miserably. There's no market for it. IMHO, they should have done two boxes. Or just one. And lock the heck out of it, like a console. They could have gone with an "APU", an Intel GT3 or a Kaveri. And focus on massive optimizations for it. No dGPU's. Less...
  12. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    Mantle is still AMD's API, not DICE's. Something to keep in mind. DICE can make it, but they don't own it. And really, Game Developers should be the ones making this stuff. This might have been shown before...
  13. M

    [fudzilla] The real reason behind apparent lack of Mantle devs

    ..."From next-gen game consoles"... Where are these Docs you speak of? And a reminder that XNA was not there at the start. If DICE is making it, why announce that they will support it? That's Illogical. That they are "making" an API in FB3 that supports Mantle, now that, does make more...
  14. M

    [fudzilla] The real reason behind apparent lack of Mantle devs

    It's on...their slide? Erm...its on the slide? Business? In November. Well, demos and stuff. Not the BF4 patch. You mean DICE? Well, that's what happens in business. Didn't they pay for the game bundles? Hmm...anyways, business. That will always happen and does happen. Oh, nice! You...
  15. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    My thoughts exactly. Its not disruptive in any way, if anything, its plain stupid.
  16. M

    Wii U CPU Espresso can use Latte's eDRAM...

    The X360 has Backwards Compatibility with half its games. And PS3 is still PS1 compatible. Does it matter? A tiny bit. I still like to play Xenogears every few years. And I like MechAssault 2 and Phantom Dust. Tho, there are other ways to play them...
  17. M

    [fudzilla] The real reason behind apparent lack of Mantle devs

    You must have missed the article, here, let me link you: http://www.anandtech.com/show/7371/understanding-amds-mantle-a-lowlevel-graphics-api-for-gcn You see that first slide? Read the 4th bullet. 4th -> "Leverage optimization work from next-gen game consoles to PCs" Erm, obvious? Oh, and...
  18. M

    Valve confirms AMD GPUs will be in pre-built Steam Machines in 2014

    Those are the hurdles of PC's. That would make it a console, which its not. I don't know the demographic either. Everything being off the shelf, means it will cost a similar price. More hardware options means complexity. How will they brand it? "Buy Box#1 and play BF4 at 30FPS, or buy Box#2...
  19. M

    [fudzilla] The real reason behind apparent lack of Mantle devs

    When a game is locked to a certain FPS, its for design decisions. Nothing to do with API. Isn't Doom 4 gonna be a 30 FPS game? Quite sure Carmack said that. Seriously doubt that. But if true, I'm more than amazed then! Think about it, less than two months of work and testing the SDK and you...
  20. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    What mayor engine has just 2 codepaths!? There's at least 3 now a days...and usually 4 or 5. Anyways, I'm pretty sure most engines have their own API on top of it all. EngineDrawSquare = DXDrawSquare, GLDrawSquare , GLESDrawSquare, WGLDrawSquare, FlashDrawSquare, x86DrawSquare, etc...
  21. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Well, I'm gonna guess here. The benefit of GCN in an ARM based SoC? Without Mantle, I guess it would be just like a Tegra, nothing.
  22. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    People and their weird mentality...blackened23 explained it well. Nothing changes, Mantle is simply another option, one that supposedly beats the others, on GCN technology. More work? Yeah. Worth it? If it works better, then totally. If it works as advertised, dear god!
  23. M

    The AMD Mantle Thread

    I'm guessing that the improvement could/should be about the penalty you get from using DX or OGL instead of the actual metal, plus, the less amount of draw calls. I'd say 10-20% by just using Mantle instead of DX/OGL in the same GCN GPU. Max, 50%. IMHO, I just don't think DX and OGL have that...
  24. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Yup, I agree with this and this is even more true for OpenGL, yeah, they extend it, but mayor versions with similar functionality took awhile to catch up to DX. But, this is not about other API's, this is about an API from the vendor, this is even better! Another thing that could happen is for...
  25. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    But isn't that like everything else? How is that any different than needing OGL 4 when you have OGL 3? Or DX 11.1 when you have 11? Or when you are running Flash 10 and you need 11.8? Or Java 7? Or Android 4? Or iOS 7? What is this "patch", why is it different? How is it different than what we...
  26. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Erm...why? How does that make it different from, say, CUDA? Well no, cause console games use different versions of those API's or console only Extensions and/or along with possible lower level API's. That's what Mantle is "fixing", its the whole basis for Mantle(!).
  27. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    What is stopping AMD from doing Mantle 2 on GCN++? That's my logic. Its an API! Look at the other API's. ISA's have changed thru the years, yet API's keep getting updated to run in them. What is the difference? Its just an API made by AMD which promises support for all GCN ISA's, which by...
  28. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Yes, but that is still of a total of 56 million. Nothing, compared to the Sony and MS market that there will be. Consider that both Sony and MS would have to lose about 60% of their current market for them to be at Steams level, still making GCN/Mantle more relevant than any other gaming tech...
  29. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Because the people that care about graphics are gamers or professionals. Yes, its niche, but compared to what? Like everything else, its relevancy and value depends on the size of its market. And Mantle's market, GCN's market, is big and will be huge. Or in another way, how is judging a gaming...
  30. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    I know, was adding a different perspective. More, specific and with current numbers. :twisted:
  31. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    That's another thing, if consoles are niche, imagine PC gaming, where Steam is "only" about 10-15% the current size of the console market. People really don't see the numbers. Putting the numbers, 360 and PS3 are at 78 million each, and the Wii is at 100 Million. How many Steam accounts...
  32. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    It is still a market and that's just the console side of things. Proof? Also, there's a product using it, so, it "works" and is "usable", but, its understandable to think that it will be "locked" until finished or simply add it by an update. It is an API, once again. Which is something that the...
  33. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    So? Its still the same as CUDA, DX and OGL. An API on top of an architecture. GCN is a niche market? Well, if you consider PS4 and X1 and every GPU GCN sold by AMD an insignificant number... then why does the iPhone sells numbers even matter to anyone? In the console market alone, if it does...
  34. M

    Revenge of the 8 core CPU - Watch Dogs

    Aren't OS's async and/or multithreaded now a days? If I remember correctly, the 360 did not have any locked cores for the OS. The PS3 did, tho. I could be wrong tho. I find it weird that the 8 cores won't be able to be used. Any actual proof of that?
  35. M

    [sweclockers] AMD coming out with ARM soc for tablets with GCN graphics

    Its GCN, by the way. And how is an Architecture of any importance? Intel x86 has lasted how many years now? And Mantle is just an API, which both Direct X and OpenGL are, and those have been available on the always changing architecture of GPU's. In essence, Mantle can and will be improved and...
  36. M

    Impications of Mantle and AMD's slower per core but more core strategy...

    Actually, aren't AMD cards more "compute performant" than other GPU's? Wouldn't less usage of the CPU make AMD cpu's and apu's more desirable for gaming? Which would mean the obvious move for AMD. The less important a CPU becomes for gaming, the lower the value of it.
  37. M

    Impications of Mantle and AMD's slower per core but more core strategy...

    Beginning Side Note Rant: I don't see how SteamOS isn't fragmented in itself, really? There will be "Steam Machines", not A "Steam Machine". SteamOS already feels like Android...moving on. (IMHO, SteamOS is truly pointless.) Looking at the PC segment, it used to be more fragmented. Microsoft...
  38. M

    Impications of Mantle and AMD's slower per core but more core strategy...

    Maybe they specifically tuned it for 8 cores? That should be easier than for X cores.(This is DICE "specific" tho) And less time drawing means more time on other stuff. I see this as a good thing tho. It is the "right" time. And the right setting. This will be used. Just how WebGL IS the 3D API...
  39. M

    Impications of Mantle and AMD's slower per core but more core strategy...

    Draw call complains are "openly", at least 3 years old. Still not sure why "everyone" keeps mentioning AMD CPU's when this is a GCN technology. Maybe its not obvious by this slide...
  40. M

    Impications of Mantle and AMD's slower per core but more core strategy...

    1- "Hardcore" Gamers will go for the best hardware to run their favorite games. 2- Most PC consumers won't care, as long as it runs. 3- Mantle is just another option. 4- As much as OpenGL(OGL ES is another story) is defended, where are the "everywhere running" games for it? The biggest...
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