Question 12th gen build

[hlexe]

Hi
Can't decide between 12400f vs 12600kf because getting 12600kf with a cooler is costing me almost double price of the 12400f. İf it was only for gaming, i would get 12400f but i will also use it for photoshop and premiere (not heavily but daily). i will use the computer for %50 gaming, %50 for photoshop and editing. İ read some amazon reviews saying that 12400 is getting too hot with stock cooler when using for rendering etc.
Should i get 12400f or pay almost double and get 12600k? Can't decide if it is worth that much price difference. Also, will getting any of those effect windows 11 performance in the long run?

 

[igor_kavinski]

Depends on what you are currently using for photoshop and premiere. If it's older than 10th gen, you will likely see a great performance boost with i5-12400F. You may also consider the plain i5-12600.

 

[hlexe]

Yes but i have concerns about the windows 11. How much enough are these non K processors enough to drive both windows 11 and these programs at the same time? Because both w11 and 12th cpu's are too new, it is completely unknown for me. What do you think?

 

[igor_kavinski]

Windows 11 is just Windows 10 with a new CPU scheduler and new GUI paint. No E-cores with non-K versions mean less chances of Windows 11 scheduling some important task on the slower E-cores. Don't worry. My friend with i5-12400 is playing Shadow of Tomb Raider on Windows 11 these past few days. He's perfectly happy.

 

[Tech Junky]

I built a new server from the ground up using a 12700K running Linux and it's a good performer coming from 8700K.

W11 invokes additional benefits to ADL though but, I can't accomplish things in windows that I'm doing in Linux.

You don't need some $100+ cooler for ADL though if you have good airflow / fans to push the hot air out of the case. I went with a $50 air tower and a graphite pad instead of paste and my temps stick to ~+5F over room temp when it's not being pushed and when it is being pushed it hits a max of 130F/54C.

If you're looking at F versions then I'm assuming you have a GPU you're wanting to use instead of relying on the iGPU on the CPU. For the $20 difference in price having the iGPU is a good backup if the GPU fails down the road.

Here's my build if you want to play around with configurations a bit - https://pcpartpicker.com/list/bKYwGq

I took the air cooler and put the Arctic P12 PST fans on push/pull instead of using what came in the box. I put 3 P14 PST's on the front, 2 more on the top, and 1 in the back for exhaust. I like the PST's because they conserve the headers on the MOBO and also make for a clean wiring / routing solution to keep things out of the way.

Putting it into this Meshify case guarantees great airflow since if you're at certain angles you can see through to the other side I went with this case for airflow but more so for the ability to load it up with drives for the NAS portion of the build. I have enough room to stagger the drives and allow space between them to keep them properly cooled or if you want to pack it full it will hold ~13 3.5" drives and then some more in different mounting spaces around the case.

If I were debating between 2 or 3 CPU's I would go for the highest option within budgetary reasons even if it's a bit more. You'll feel less constrained for a longer period of time w/o having to upgrade again as quickly. I personally though upgrade quite often to keep on the edge of new tech and its possibilities. If i had dug in deeper i would have went with a different MOBO that has a native Gen 5 M2 slot on it but, the price difference was considerable.

 

[hlexe]

Having a good airflow case to reduce the disadvantage of the weaker cooler is a good idea. İ will consider this. Although the case i decided to buy is closed front.
About the cpu's, i would go with the best one between choices, but when 12600kf costs double price(with the cooler) of the 12400f, i couldn't decide .İf the price difference was lower, i wouldn't even think. Thanks for your suggestions and sharing the experiance

 

[lakedude]

Based on the 970 incompatibility thread we are now looking at non "f" models, correct?

 

[hlexe]

Actually no. Because i will have gtx970 as a backup gpu when i got higher end gpu. İ think i will get 12600kf. But again there is a problem. The problem is there is no compatible cooler with lga1700 where i live. Need to contact with brands and order mounting parts for it. And i don't want to do that.

 

[Tech Junky]

Order the one I used in the link prior -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09FDXJV3M
It has the brackets you need and it clamps down tight on the processor. One note you'll need a 6" screwdriver to get to the screws to clamp it down.

 

[hlexe]

Yes i checked that cooler from your list before. But its "currently unavailable" Maybe out of stock, or maybe does not ship where i live. Even if it is available, i do not live in us, so the delivery can take up to 20 25 days

 

[Tech Junky]

I just took that screenshot and you see you can get it tomorrow with Prime.

Well, if you're not in the US then that info would help in finding he right cooler in your local shops.

 

[hlexe]

There is no way i can find here any lga1700 cooler. İt is hard to find even worldwide. Only few brands like your cooler. This is really so stupid. You release new gen processors, but there are no coolers available for it.

 

[Tech Junky]

i agree. I contemplated getting the adapter for my Fuma cooler but, they wanted another $8 for it and just switched gears from upgrading in my Node 804 mATX to a full ATX rebuild instead and sell the complete 8700K.

The cooler makers really fumbled this bracket thing pretty good. Either you can get one like mine for $50 or less or you pay through the nose $100+ or go water cooled. Even if they says it's compatible there's a chance of old stock that doesn't have the right bracket.

CPU coolers for Intel socket LGA 1700: Everything you need to know

We're coming up to the end of the LGA 1700 socket's life cycle, but there's still some life to be had

www.xda-developers.com

 

[lakedude]

Actually no. Because i will have gtx970 as a backup gpu when i got higher end gpu. İ think i will get 12600kf. But again there is a problem. The problem is there is no compatible cooler with lga1700 where i live. Need to contact with brands and order mounting parts for it. And i don't want to do that.

So you were actually able to find a decent newer GPU in stock somewhere?

If you don't already have a modern replacement for your 970 you might be in for a shock.

These days hunting for a GPU is going to make finding a heatsink look like a cakewalk.

 

[lakedude]

Been sold out forever...

 

[hlexe]

i agree. I contemplated getting the adapter for my Fuma cooler but, they wanted another $8 for it and just switched gears from upgrading in my Node 804 mATX to a full ATX rebuild instead and sell the complete 8700K.

The cooler makers really fumbled this bracket thing pretty good. Either you can get one like mine for $50 or less or you pay through the nose $100+ or go water cooled. Even if they says it's compatible there's a chance of old stock that doesn't have the right bracket.

CPU coolers for Intel socket LGA 1700: Everything you need to know

We're coming up to the end of the LGA 1700 socket's life cycle, but there's still some life to be had

www.xda-developers.com

Yes thats why i dont want to get in that trouble. İ decided to raise budget more and get 12700f with a stock cooler. So when a good tower air cooler will be available for socket 1700, i will buy and use it. Seems most logical for me now. Thanks.

So you were actually able to find a decent newer GPU in stock somewhere?

If you don't already have a modern replacement for your 970 you might be in for a shock.

These days hunting for a GPU is going to make finding a heatsink look like a cakewalk.

İ am not in a hurry for gpu. İ will get when i get a good deal. İ can live with a good cpu and ram + low graphic card for few months.

 

[Tech Junky]

12700f with a stock cooler.

Shouldn't be too much of an issue considering the pre-release hype about needing to water cool them but, if you're building into a decent case with good air flow it should keep it from hitting high temps / throttling.

If you really push it though for an extended period of time it might become an issue and that's when you know it's time to upgrade the cooler. The most I peg mine for is a couple of minutes when Pelx gets done recording and it scans / removes commercials and it might hit 50-55C for a minute or so and then drops back down into the 20's.

 

[lakedude]

Sorry, not trying to cause trouble, just trying to be helpful but last I understood your 970 was not going to work with Windows 11 because UEFI or something.

Did you get that sorted out?

Igor's method was to buy a CPU with integrated graphics, so not one of the"F" cards which lack integrated graphics...

 

[hlexe]

Sorry, not trying to cause trouble, just trying to be helpful but last I understood your 970 was not going to work with Windows 11 because UEFI or something.

Did you get that sorted out?

Igor's method was to buy a CPU with integrated graphics, so not one of the"F" cards which lack integrated graphics...

Yes you are right. But from what i understand ( i may not have understand well) secure boot is the problem and i can use gtx 970 if i disable it or something?
To be honest i didn't spend time to understand it well because i don't know the details and i was busy with searching other things like psu cpu. So isn't it possible to use?

Shouldn't be too much of an issue considering the pre-release hype about needing to water cool them but, if you're building into a decent case with good air flow it should keep it from hitting high temps / throttling.

If you really push it though for an extended period of time it might become an issue and that's when you know it's time to upgrade the cooler. The most I peg mine for is a couple of minutes when Pelx gets done recording and it scans / removes commercials and it might hit 50-55C for a minute or so and then drops back down into the 20's.

i will use it carefully until i get a cooler. also i am planning to use closed front case. But i think with a good air cooler like yours, it will be ok i guess.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Yes you are right. But from what i understand ( i may not have understand well) secure boot is the problem and i can use gtx 970 if i disable it or something?

That depends if 970 shows the boot screen, allowing you to go into UEFI. If there is no display, you won't be able to go into UEFI and disable secure boot.

 

[igor_kavinski]

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/geforce-graphics-cards/5/229546/installed-gtx-970-computer-wont-even-boot-to-bios/

So good info in that link. Two new options depending on your luck:

1) Update the 970's BIOS. Newer BIOS may add support for secure boot.

2) Put 970 into second PCIe slot. But the user reports he got blue screen of death before Windows could load.

Due to these potential issues, I would strongly advise you to go with a non-F part, otherwise you might have a very bad time troubleshooting. Also, I really hate suggesting this but is it possible that you could sell your 970 and upgrade to 6500 XT? Or dial back to 12600K instead of 12700K and get Geforce 3050 8GB?

 

[hlexe]

That's risky then. Thanks. İ did not want to buy a gpu because they are way too overpriced. They do not deserve those prices. Was planning to wait for a potential price drop this year if it happens.

 

[Tech Junky]

I just read something about prices dropping on average 20% on the last few months. We're still talking $2000 but, they are coming down.

 

[hlexe]

Yes i have been following the prices worldwide since maybe 2 months. And there is a little bit drop in prices. Also for example in the country where i live, there have been big increase in electricity costs. İt should effect miners no doubt, but it may take some time to see the effects. Even this raise in energy cost can mean tens of thousands of new graphics card on the shelves. And + many used cards on second hand market. Not sure of course, other factors can change and it can still be impossible to buy a graphic card, but for now it is slightly going better. Hope it keeps going on.

 

[lakedude]

Just some general building advice, stay off the bleeding edge unless you are a skilled builder with a lot of patience.

I've spent 10s of thousands on systems over the years. I always had to have the latest thing, especially GPUs. Trouble is the stinking things rarely ever worked properly out of the box. Eventually after enough driver updates and game patches they would finally work as intended but by the time that happened the next shiny new thing would be about ready to come out and the stuff I paid full price for was on the discount rack.

Mixing new cutting edge stuff like W11 and Intel's 12th gen with older stuff is just asking for trouble. I'm sure it will be possible to get it all sorted out but your shiny new system could have you frustrated for a spell.