19 Year Old Girl Shot Looking for Help

[nehalem256]

So the girl scout selling cookies is fair game? Just open up on her?

You NRA types can be quite scary....

Just protecting myself from the dangers of obesity :sneaky:

 

[ElFenix]

Evidence of rainisha being a girl scout?

how is that at all germane to the issue at hand?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

evidence of ripping through screens?

There's zero evidence of this occurring however, the police report describes a tear in the screen and the screen was dislodged.

Now this leads to several questions.

1) Was the tear in the screen there before the incident occurred?
2) Did the tear occur from the girl putting force against the screen?
3) Did the tear occur due to the shotgun blast?

1) Was the screen dislodged from the girl beating or pushing on the screen door?
2) Was screen dislodged by the shotgun blast.

The screens are held by internal screws placed in intervals and the screen is removed inward.

 

[ElFenix]

Yes - some states define laws that involve entry without force. KY does not, and is explicit on when lethal force may be used. My arguement has remained the same the whole time.

ah, i see, you were talking about KY, which has no breaking requirement for burglary (iow, no force required in kentucky for burglary).

michigan still has the breaking requirement, but that is satisfied by using any minimal force (further opening an open window).

 

[werepossum]

Wow you people, must I do all the *(&$%ing work here? Lazy people.

I just got through the door without intent. Can't shoot me. This protects some poor sod who is lost from entering the wrong house, being confused and then dying. Do some god damn research and come back at me with actual case studies or don't come back.

Sounds reasonable, although Londo points out, determining intent can be difficult when awakened at 3AM. Still, not really an issue here. Clearly the homeowner opened the door or she would have been shot inside the dwelling, or at worst shot in the back while fleeing.

Also, maybe I dreamed it but isn't there also a charge for unlawful entry that is intermediate between criminal trespass and breaking & entering?

Evidence of rainisha being a girl scout?

She was brutally gunned down valiantly working on her public inebriation badge, only hours after her pursuit of her driving while intoxicated badge went horribly wrong.

Honestly, while bshole's point is obviously intentionally taken to the point of absurdity, it doesn't require this girl to be a girl scout for the point to be valid. If anyone entering your home without your permission can lawfully be gunned down, then it is in effect open season on girl scouts, or at least those raised without manners and caution. If a girl scout entering your home without your permission cannot lawfully be gunned down, then obviously some discretion must be used. If that is the case, then it's difficult to see how an unarmed, extremely drunk, short, fat teenage girl should make it onto the "gun down on sight" list.

This is all a side show anyway, arguing over Spidey's point for argument's sake. The homeowner's claim is that he accidentally shot her, not that she was coming right at him and he had to fire in self defense or be assaulted by the human version of a couch cushion.

Just protecting myself from the dangers of obesity :sneaky:

LOL

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Since when do girl scouts enter a home without permission?

 

[schmuckley]

Since when do girl scouts enter a home without permission?

When the molesterer drags them in.
On a serious note;I had almost the same exact thing happen to me.Around 4AM a drunk black girl came pounding on my front door.She was extremely distressed..and yes..she almost got shot through the door.She wanted me to call the police so I did..then i opened the door..round in chamber;and looked around .She was running from someone I guess;drunk..maybe drugged up.Police came and I think they arrested her.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Sounds reasonable, although Londo points out, determining intent can be difficult when awakened at 3AM. Still, not really an issue here. Clearly the homeowner opened the door or she would have been shot inside the dwelling, or at worst shot in the back while fleeing.

Could you point to the homeowner's statement where he says he opened the door? It's still very possible that the storm door was open and the screen door was locked.

 

[RampantAndroid]

ah, i see, you were talking about KY, which has no breaking requirement for burglary (iow, no force required in kentucky for burglary).

michigan still has the breaking requirement, but that is satisfied by using any minimal force (further opening an open window).

Exactly. We're talking about KY because Spidey lives there and seems to think that simply crossing the boundary into his home is enough to kill. It all comes down to the situation or course, I have to imagine that even in Michigan if someone was just standing inside your door doing nothing that you'd be charged (maybe not convicted) if you shot and killed.

 

[werepossum]

Could you point to the homeowner's statement where he says he opened the door? It's still very possible that the storm door was open and the screen door was locked.

Maybe, but I have a veeeery hard time believing that a man who answers the door at 3AM with shotgun pointed at a teenage girl's head goes to sleep with the door open and only a locked storm door protecting him from, well, drunk teenage girls. Also, I don't think there are three doors, just the main door (substantial wood, fiberglass or steel) and the screen door/storm door with screen. Storm doors are there to keep blown rain from entering under/around the door; very few can stop even a drunk 5'-4" teenage girl, much less a burglar or home invader.

 

[shira]

Sure there is. Screen towards inward = her pushing through trying to get in.

No. The police report specifically says the screen was "popped out." And a little further on it says

I popped screen back in place (held loosely by one screwed-in tab at the top and rested in the channel at the bottom of the storm door) so Cpl. Zawacki could photograph it in place with a tape measure, as shotgun blast could have blown screen out of place.

Why are you trying so hard to create a self-defense shooting? Why aren't you willing to just let the facts fall where they may? Do you have some hidden motive for wanting this to be a break-in as opposed to a "bad" shooting?

 

[schmuckley]

I'd say it was a not-so-good shooting.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

No. The police report specifically says the screen was "popped out." And a little further on it says



Why are you trying so hard to create a self-defense shooting? Why aren't you willing to just let the facts fall where they may? Do you have some hidden motive for wanting this to be a break-in as opposed to a "bad" shooting?

Could have been popped out of the slot from someone pushing on it as well. The screen would have to move inward to pop out of the slot.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Could you point to the homeowner's statement where he says he opened the door? It's still very possible that the storm door was open and the screen door was locked.

Not at those temps at night.

If there is only a screen; you are opening the house to the external temps by leaving the solid door open.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Could have been popped out of the slot from someone pushing on it as well. The screen would have to move inward to pop out of the slot.

As stated, the screen is replaced from the inside.

The shotgun blast would have ripped the screen outward; there should not be enough resistance to pull the screen frame out of the channel.

IF this goes to trial; the defense will be able to perform such a test.
IF the blast does not pop the screen; there is reasonable doubt created w/ regard to the girl pushing in on the screen

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Not at those temps at night.

If there is only a screen; you are opening the house to the external temps by leaving the solid door open.

The temperature that day was in the 60's and it dropped down to the upper 40's so it's very possible someone who lives there would not deem it to be cold.

 

[nixium]

The temperature that day was in the 60's and it dropped down to the upper 40's so it's very possible someone who lives there would not deem it to be cold.

God you and eaglekeeper above are really clutching at straws.

Why are you so eager to defend a killer? Do you think someone pushing a screen door to the point that its dislodged deserves to be shot in the face? Keeping your door open when it's 40* outside? LOL.

WTF is wrong with you people? Don't you have empathy or compassion? Why not wait for the facts to be revealed instead of clutching at straws to defend this gun nut?

Fucking psychopaths. Go get yourself checked by a psychologist proto.

 

[nixium]

And all this is after the guy himself admitted it was an accidental shoot. LOL!

Your fucking braveheart hero admitted he didn't mean to shoot the girl and you assholes are defending him.

 

[LTC8K6]

The screen will have a hole in it and residue on it that proves that he shot through it.

So all this talk about the screen being popped is really irrelevant.

It will be very obvious that he shot through the closed screen door.

I think he should go back to his original claim of accidentally firing the shotgun, since the evidence seems to fit that a lot better.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

God you and eaglekeeper above are really clutching at straws.

Why are you so eager to defend a killer? Do you think someone pushing a screen door to the point that its dislodged deserves to be shot in the face? Keeping your door open when it's 40* outside? LOL.

WTF is wrong with you people? Don't you have empathy or compassion? Why not wait for the facts to be revealed instead of clutching at straws to defend this gun nut?

Fucking psychopaths. Go get yourself checked by a psychologist proto.

So questioning what has been reported and trying to make sense of this make one a pyschopath. Looks like you have already made up your mind based on what the media is feeding/has fed to you.

And all this is after the guy himself admitted it was an accidental shoot. LOL!

Your fucking braveheart hero admitted he didn't mean to shoot the girl and you assholes are defending him.

So can you please link us to the homeowners statement so we can understand what he actually said and not what the media is reporting.

As with many cases what the media reports normally is no where close to being the truth as that doesn't generate hits or interest.

 

[classy]

The temperature that day was in the 60's and it dropped down to the upper 40's so it's very possible someone who lives there would not deem it to be cold.

Let me say this loud and clear. If the guy comes to the door with a shotgun because he heard banging, what in sam hill's name would you cause you to think this person would ever sleep with the door open?

 

[tgferg67]

Let me say this loud and clear. If the guy comes to the door with a shotgun because he heard banging, what in sam hill's name would you cause you to think this person would ever sleep with the door open?

Logic would dictate it was not open. Also the prosecutor did state evidence suggested Wafer opened the door.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Let me say this loud and clear. If the guy comes to the door with a shotgun because he heard banging, what in sam hill's name would you cause you to think this person would ever sleep with the door open?

Ever think that based on the banging/noises he heard that he realized that he left the front door open/ajar and that's why he grabbed his shotgun?

 

[EagleKeeper]

And all this is after the guy himself admitted it was an accidental shoot. LOL!

Your fucking braveheart hero admitted he didn't mean to shoot the girl and you assholes are defending him.

God you and eaglekeeper above are really clutching at straws.

Why are you so eager to defend a killer? Do you think someone pushing a screen door to the point that its dislodged deserves to be shot in the face? Keeping your door open when it's 40* outside? LOL.

WTF is wrong with you people? Don't you have empathy or compassion? Why not wait for the facts to be revealed instead of clutching at straws to defend this gun nut?

Fucking psychopaths. Go get yourself checked by a psychologist proto.

I am not defending him.

I attempt to point out to some assholes, how the facts as we know it could match a scenario.

People do not leave a door open at 40 degrees. Maybe at 60.

As to clutching at straws, those that come to crucify the homeowner are doing the same as those that want to defend him. Taking their opinion and trying to make the facts fit.

 

[classy]

Ever think that based on the banging/noises he heard that he realized that he left the front door open/ajar and that's why he grabbed his shotgun?

Guy you are not making sense here. It makes no reasonable sense to believe he went to bed with his front door open. Why are you and EK even putting forth this idea?