*** 2016 NBA Playoff thread ***

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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
37,852
8,314
136
David Thompson should be considered the greatest ever by the standards of you and Sp33dy. 2 phenomenal seasons are all that matter, right? Well, Thompson had more than 2 phenomenal seasons and he was the "best in the league" his first 2-4 seasons or so. It didn't take him 6 seasons to get above-average. (Fair Consideration going to 'Nique and Kareem, of course)--but Thompson was the first "should never have gone to college" type of phenom, as the Lakers were trying to get him to de-commit and flee the JV team at NC State his freshman year (JV was a freshman requirement in those days)

How about Pistol Pete? certainly the greatest ever by the same small window within a career.

Steph is playing lights out right now and certainly no one in the league can compare; but you guys have tunnel vision. You also ignore the fact that it took Steph some 6-7? seasons to get to these last 2 seasons. Why wasn't he GOAT then? Was it because Lebron was GOAT? I thought Lebron was the obvious GOAT now?

Steph certainly can be if he has another 5-9 years in his tank and continues to perform at this level. But that's a huge if. Thompson was taken out by his knees (....oh and the coke, too). Pistol was taken out, literally, by an undiagnosed hypertrophy. Steph's already-substantial injury history doesn't bode well for him, but I do like seeing phenomenal talents continue to be phenomenal so I'm pulling for that, but history leaves me skeptical.

If Steph falls off a plateau due to injury or fatigue, no one will ever remember him as GOAT because of these 2 seasons. No one. The discussion will continue to be if Lebron legitimately challenges Jordan for that honor.
TBH, I'd never heard of David Thompson.

Steph was slow to develop for a few reasons. Firstly, he went to Davidson, a hole in the wall school, wasn't a lottery pick with huge expectations. He had bad injury issues early in his NBA career, plus he had to at best share the spotlight with Monte Ellis, a spotlight hog who wasn't amenable to sharing the spotlight with Curry. To Joe Lacob's credit, he traded Ellis, got roundly booed by the fans for doing so.

Since Ellis was traded, Steph has come into his own, and how. Chris Weber said recently that as a repeating MVP Steph stands alone in the degree to which he improved.

I can't say Steph is the best ever. Yes I did. I'll rephrase that: he impresses me as the best I've ever seen. I didn't really pick up on Kobe in his day, I did see Jordan at his best. Personally, I think Steph at his best is better than Jordan was at his best. Their styles aren't the same at all, though.

Lebron, he's great and dominating, the GOAT? If he and Steph make it to the finals this year and there are no major surprises in terms of injuries, it will be interesting. Lebron will face Iguodala (like last year), Green and Bogut in the paint, so he's not just going to have his way inside.

To me, GOAT isn't a career thing, it's how well did the player play at his best. I've never been as impressed by any basketball player as much as Steph Curry this season.
 
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manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
11,367
2,375
136
Warning: I don't really watch basketball. If what I ask sounds stupid, it probably is.

I read that the Cavs set a record (77 of 152) for most 3-pointers in a 6-games-or-fewer series as well as most 3-point attempts in a series when shooting at least 50% (the previous record was 39 of 75 by Utah against the Spurs in 1996).

Have the Cavs always been 3-point monsters, or have they been adjusting their offensive game plan in preparation for a finals matchup with Curry and Golden State?
This is just the Cavs 2nd season together, and the first under new head coach Tyronn Lue. If you look at the roster, they were constructed to be a 3pt shooting team (Love, Irving, JR Smith and LeBron et al) but I don't believe they played that way last season. The 3pt game is a league-wide phenomenon, so I wouldn't directly relate the Cavs offense to the Dubs. Having Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson puts the Warriors on a different plane than other volume 3pt shooting teams.

JR Smith had a lousy 2015 NBA Finals, or else the Cavs could've pushed that series to 6 or even 7 games. It's cool to see him light up the Hawks, but if you're Lue or another NBA head coach, how much do you trust that JR Smith will perform in the next rounds? Shooters are infamously feast or famine, but Smith has been particularly mercurial throughout his career.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
37,852
8,314
136
TBH, I'd never heard of David Thompson.
OK, I just found this on David Thompson:

This 6'4" sky walking player is who I think could have had one of the brightest careers in NBA history.

David Thompson was an absolute force wherever he was, whether it be on the court where he would walk in the sky, shoot, and all that, or off the court where he would do things that would bring shame to the Denver Nuggets uniform.

If this force of dominance had played longer in the NBA, he would be second to none.

You are all sitting there reading this, getting ready to type “Are you stupid? How can you put him in the same sentence as Black Jesus?"

I didn’t want to have to break this to you, but Black Jesus did that himself saying “David Thompson would have been probably the best scorer ever to play in his era if he was to stay in the NBA longer.” The great Dan Issel said: “If David played until he couldn’t play any longer, he would be mentioned in the same breath as Michael Jordan.”

Looks like he wasn't the greatest anything in the NBA except maybe the greatest disappointment.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,575
146
OK, I just found this on David Thompson:



Looks like he wasn't the greatest anything in the NBA except maybe the greatest disappointment.

um, clearly you didn't read that statement if that is what you took from it. You guys are calling Steph the greatest ever for two current oulier seasons. It's preposterous.

Thompson was better than Steph over 7 seasons. He was consistent. There are tons of players like that.

Steph has put together an unreal series of 2 seasons and I'm not taking anything away from that. But what I do see is a sudden flurry GS fans that don't seem to know much about basketball or its history (how the eff do you not know D Thomspson? I mean, if you weren't alive them, maybe...but I wasn't either) claiming that this guy's 2 outlier seasons makes him the greatest shit ever.

That's preposterous. You state that you believe GOAT is not a career achievement. Talk about moving goal boasts to suit your argument.

I like Steph--always have. I know Davidson because it's my neighborhood. Being from NC, basketball is my blood. This is also why I can barely tolerate the NBA these days. It isn't basketball. I've seen Steph do phenomenal things in college and I always wondered what happened to him when he trotted off to the NBA, then he suddenly became the greatest thing ever after some black hole of 5 seasons? No sorry, that isn't any other player's fault for hogging the spotlight.

Steph is certainly legit and will be remembered as being legit--but he needs to prove consistency before this current performance is recognized as more than an outlier in a disappointing career.

Also consider that he is nowhere near the scorer DT was over that same 7 years. How many 3s did David hit? something like 27 his entire career, and scored more than 3x the points than Steph?

lmao.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,575
146
So, if Steph has a career-ending injury next year or his knees or ankles give out hobbling him into mediocrity for 3 pathetic seasons....he will also be the greatest disappointment too, right? (I hope not)

Because if that happens, he will finish as half the talent DT was. ...and that's real numbers.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
37,852
8,314
136
So, if Steph has a career-ending injury next year or his knees or ankles give out hobbling him into mediocrity for 3 pathetic seasons....he will also be the greatest disappointment too, right? (I hope not)

Because if that happens, he will finish as half the talent DT was. ...and that's real numbers.
I wasn't aware of DT because in those days I paid no attention to the NBA, in fact not only didn't I go to any games, I didn't have a TV, hadn't had one for over 15 years.

The quote in my last post said that DT was a considerable embarrassment to the Denver Nuggets due to his off court behavior. Also that he didn't live up to his great potential, even close. Curry may not have reached his full potential but I don't think it can be said that he's fallen a whole lot short of it by virtue of what he's done this year.

Obviously the only thing that can keep Steph from having a great career overall is injuries. If you judge a player by career production instead of having played at a high level, well that's you. It's not me.
 
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thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
Blazers are straight balling and Klay is carrying the Warriors. One possession in the 3rd, back and forth. lol nice flop on a guy half your size Anderson.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,366
740
126
Officiating in NBA has always been #2 right behind WWE. last year was a little better, made it look like a real sport, this year again we are back to WWE standards... It's a shame how they are destroying basketball
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,575
146
I wasn't aware of DT because in those days I paid no attention to the NBA, in fact not only didn't I go to any games, I didn't have a TV, hadn't had one for over 15 years.

The quote in my last post said that DT was a considerable embarrassment to the Denver Nuggets due to his off court behavior. Also that he didn't live up to his great potential, even close. Curry may not have reached his full potential but I don't think it can be said that he's fallen a whole lot short of it by virtue of what he's done this year.

Obviously the only thing that can keep Steph from having a great career overall is injuries. If you judge a player by career production instead of having played at a high level, well that's you. It's not me.

actually, that's how everyone judges, and that is the entire point. You and Sp33dy are arguing to change that standard for no real reason. None of this is to detract how awesome Steph has been--everyone agrees with that--it's just that you guys need to expand the tiny windows of reality that you are using to judge these things.

You're still ignoring my larger point here with the comparison (Steph isn't yet better than someone like David Thompson, who casual basketball fans like yourself have never heard of; but that doesn't mean he isn't going to be), so I assume it will continue to be that way and there is no more need to repeat this a 3rd time.
 

SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,929
142
106
Steph was incredible last night in the 4th as usual. Willed his team to victory when they were having an off night and the Blazers were having an above average night. He is the difference-maker.
 

Majes

Golden Member
Apr 8, 2008
1,164
148
106
um, clearly you didn't read that statement if that is what you took from it. You guys are calling Steph the greatest ever for two current oulier seasons. It's preposterous.

Thompson was better than Steph over 7 seasons. He was consistent. There are tons of players like that.

Steph has put together an unreal series of 2 seasons and I'm not taking anything away from that. But what I do see is a sudden flurry GS fans that don't seem to know much about basketball or its history (how the eff do you not know D Thomspson? I mean, if you weren't alive them, maybe...but I wasn't either) claiming that this guy's 2 outlier seasons makes him the greatest shit ever.

That's preposterous. You state that you believe GOAT is not a career achievement. Talk about moving goal boasts to suit your argument.

I like Steph--always have. I know Davidson because it's my neighborhood. Being from NC, basketball is my blood. This is also why I can barely tolerate the NBA these days. It isn't basketball. I've seen Steph do phenomenal things in college and I always wondered what happened to him when he trotted off to the NBA, then he suddenly became the greatest thing ever after some black hole of 5 seasons? No sorry, that isn't any other player's fault for hogging the spotlight.

Steph is certainly legit and will be remembered as being legit--but he needs to prove consistency before this current performance is recognized as more than an outlier in a disappointing career.

Also consider that he is nowhere near the scorer DT was over that same 7 years. How many 3s did David hit? something like 27 his entire career, and scored more than 3x the points than Steph?

lmao.

I don't think there are tons of players like David Thompson... His all too short career was spectacular. But if you're comparing his career to Steph's you're missing some important qualifiers and awards like MVPs and Championship(s?).

Your arguments are all over the map. You called Steph's early career disappointing when he was projected as only a "potential starter". I would have said he was surpassing expectations from year one if you asked me. He is so far from what was expected now it's almost in "Tom Brady" territory. Thompson on the other hand was asked to carry the scoring load for his team from year one. Of course he has better early career stats.

Also your point about 3 pointers is strange... While Thompson clearly shot FAR fewer, he was nowhere near as good at them... One of the upsides of Curry in his first seasons was he was a great sharpshooter from 3. Now he is destroying records from behind the arc. You're comparing two players who played not only different positions, but also two extremely different games of basketball. The NBA is a completely different game these days...

So while I agree with your original point that Steph definitely needs to continue this and actually needs to improve a lot to reach "best player ever" consideration I disagree with a lot of the assertions in the post above.

I for one hope these two seasons (particularly this one) are not outliers. I love watching Curry play, and the impact he has on games and the NBA is astounding for a 6 foot 3 guard...
 

marincounty

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2005
3,227
5
76
A few haters on here. Steph is the best right now, just sit back and enjoy the show.
Lebron is still very good, but his reign as the greatest is over.
Just shutup about David Thompson, a good player but not even in the conversation about the best ever.
I heard all of the flack about Steph winning the MVP last year, Lebron and James Harden were whining about it. I haven't heard a peep from anyone questioning the MVP this year. Just shut up before you make yourself look like a fool.
I heard Shaq and Kenny Smith agree last night that Steph is the best shooter- ever.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
A few haters on here. Steph is the best right now, just sit back and enjoy the show.
Lebron is still very good, but his reign as the greatest is over.
Just shutup about David Thompson, a good player but not even in the conversation about the best ever.
I heard all of the flack about Steph winning the MVP last year, Lebron and James Harden were whining about it. I haven't heard a peep from anyone questioning the MVP this year. Just shut up before you make yourself look like a fool.
I heard Shaq and Kenny Smith agree last night that Steph is the best shooter- ever.


I don't think anyone is hating on Steph. What you have are some posters going from Steph is the best shooter ever to being the GOAT. Obviously Steph is a few rings short and a lot of years away from even getting close to that sort of talk, but it doesn't stop these few posters and their hyperbole train.

And here is what they were saying about Steph in that regard to being the GOAT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjbhZbVxLlk
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
"He's Bruce Leroy! He got the glow!"

Freaking Dwight lol, but he does have the glow. I admit, he's glowing.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
It's hard *not* to like Curry. He's charismatic, humble, has no off court drama, lets his game do the talking and has an adorable kid that takes over press conferences.

Guy is a franchise goldmine.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
It's hard *not* to like Curry. He's charismatic, humble, has no off court drama, lets his game do the talking and has an adorable kid that takes over press conferences.

Guy is a franchise goldmine.


He would be my #1 all time PG, no doubt. You'd have to be off your rocker not to pick him.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,366
740
126
Oh btw, in cease you missed it, there is a whole entire thread dedicated for curry circle jerk. No need to spam here
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
After taking the first game off, OKC looks to be putting out back to back smack downs to end this series.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
After taking the first game off, OKC looks to be putting out back to back smack downs to end this series.


It's about freaking time. That duo are perennial underachievers. Plus SA is getting real old real fast and they won't last vs GS.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,366
740
126
yeah, once Westbrook came to his senses and started sharing the ball, being a team player, their true potential came out. San Antonio has never been a playoff team, they always choke but I too never saw this coming. I am happy for OKC.

San Antonio never had a chance against GSW, I always though that it would be a 4-0 deal. With OKC I have better hope, they can play the fast game like GSW and have young talented defenders who can reach Curry in time and smack him down. Should be interesting conference finals, I hope they make GSW hurt and tired before the finals.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,575
146
I don't think there are tons of players like David Thompson... His all too short career was spectacular. But if you're comparing his career to Steph's you're missing some important qualifiers and awards like MVPs and Championship(s?).

Your arguments are all over the map. You called Steph's early career disappointing when he was projected as only a "potential starter". I would have said he was surpassing expectations from year one if you asked me. He is so far from what was expected now it's almost in "Tom Brady" territory. Thompson on the other hand was asked to carry the scoring load for his team from year one. Of course he has better early career stats.

Also your point about 3 pointers is strange... While Thompson clearly shot FAR fewer, he was nowhere near as good at them... One of the upsides of Curry in his first seasons was he was a great sharpshooter from 3. Now he is destroying records from behind the arc. You're comparing two players who played not only different positions, but also two extremely different games of basketball. The NBA is a completely different game these days...

So while I agree with your original point that Steph definitely needs to continue this and actually needs to improve a lot to reach "best player ever" consideration I disagree with a lot of the assertions in the post above.

I for one hope these two seasons (particularly this one) are not outliers. I love watching Curry play, and the impact he has on games and the NBA is astounding for a 6 foot 3 guard...

Obviously there are huge differences between the eras and the two players and their specific talents--Thompson, like the game at the time, played at the rim...well, he played above the rim. He was the first, really. The alley-oop was invented by Monte Towe and Thompson because dunking was illegal in college at the time. Since Thompson could play above anyone else in the world that played the game, they figured why not just lob the ball up to where only he could capture it?

The 3 simply wasn't a significant part of the game at the time (it didn't even enter college until he was more or less out of the NBA). But that was just one example that came to mind. I went to dig up raw numbers and was personally surprised at how comparable they were offensively over that same period of time. You could probably do the same with a significant number of players. (as far as MVP and Championships go...most of those years Denver was in the ABA, so...)

I'm only saying that when comparing real numbers--the only metric that matters--you can't really say all that much about Steph (Career-wise) beyond these two unprecedented and phenomenal seasons. And they truly are and I really do hope he keeps doing this for years and years and years. Assuming anything beyond that, because of funny numbers, is just silly.

I love the dude and I think he is certainly the only good thing about the game since Jordan (I always hated Jordan, by the way, because he was Carolina...Carolina is a piece of shit . but still respect, because that guy is undeniably unique).

To the others--never once have I hated on Steph. I think he's the shit and really hope that he's more for years to come. Only calling out the usual suspect that famously uses funny bullshit numbers in various other topics in these forums to make horseshit claims over and over again. Nothing more.
 
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thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
yeah, once Westbrook came to his senses and started sharing the ball, being a team player, their true potential came out. San Antonio has never been a playoff team, they always choke but I too never saw this coming. I am happy for OKC.

San Antonio never had a chance against GSW, I always though that it would be a 4-0 deal. With OKC I have better hope, they can play the fast game like GSW and have young talented defenders who can reach Curry in time and smack him down. Should be interesting conference finals, I hope they make GSW hurt and tired before the finals.


They should put Durant on him and not switch, like say fu I'm not switching, lockdown baby. Then GS would run picks/screens after screens to try and force the switch lol.
 
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