233 Killed In Iraq; Baghdad 'Security Net' Penetrated

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow another Iraq/surge thread! How refreshing and original!

That's what happens when the "surge" allows so many deaths in a single day.

Have you read any of the stories coming out of Iraq about this event?
The Sunni insurgents desperately want to restart the civil war and are trying everything they can. If the US military and Iraqi police can?t do a better job of stopping such event then the mass blood shed will start again at which point we might as well get off the streets and let them go at it.

What is interesting is that the Sunni?s started this whole mess hoping to cower the Shitte?s into their century?s long position of subservience to the Sunni?s. It didn?t work though. And Baghdad has become am almost entirely Shiite city now.

The Sunni?s are fighting a losing battle. The only question is how much blood shed will it take before they realize that the days of Saddam and 20% of the population ruling 80% are over.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow. I think you may be more of a tool than Dave...almost feel sorry for you

That may be your opinion. But what to people think of you, whose best response to something is calling the author a 'tool'?

Yes, it is. And so is what he wrote. Why is one right and the wrong? And for all that is good who ****** cares?

*shrug* I really couldnt care less lol This board is entertainment. There is so little value on it (including my own input) it's like watching a bad train wreck. I just occasionally like to poke sticks at the passionate hacks here. Why come here then? Cuz I love to watch trainwrecks

If that were a true, you wouldn't be posting here. Still waiting for good news that negates 233 deaths in a day. SO many people like you who make claims without backing them up. Nothing new here. Just more liars.

See the bolded part? hahaha you bit!

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Aimster
I am not trying to ruin this thread or get involved in a heated discussion.. I wasted enough of my day doing that.

but I have a question...

After the fall of Saddam, what has been the biggest news headline that has been positive in favor of the Iraqi people?

Good question.

You know the strange thing though is that every poll I have seen says that the Iraqi people think they are better off without Saddam.

It would seem that freedom even with the death and chaos it has brought is far more enjoyable than living under the oppression of Saddam.

Another point, violence has a numbing effect. How many people saw the story about 2 dead at Va Tech that was running around 11am and though, oh well. And then a few hours latter saw the 32 dead and went ?holy ******.? I know I did.

An interesting parallel to Iraq is how Israel deals with suicide bombers. They have a special group that rushes in, cleans up, power washes the street and makes everything like it was before. In essence, they try to make it as if it never happened so that people can go about a ?normal? life. Perhaps the people in Iraq have seen so much death and destruction that they are no longer bothered by it, or at least they are trying to live as normal of lives as they can.

Yeah, those 2 million refugees that left Iraq were thrilled with the "freedom" we brought... Oh, and the U.S. isn't letting them come here.

This is exactly what I meant by getting shat upon when something positive is posted. Sheeple are soooo predictable.

 

[Balt]

So McCain's comments after his escort through Baghdad were wrong?

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Aimster
I am not trying to ruin this thread or get involved in a heated discussion.. I wasted enough of my day doing that.

but I have a question...

After the fall of Saddam, what has been the biggest news headline that has been positive in favor of the Iraqi people?

Good question.

You know the strange thing though is that every poll I have seen says that the Iraqi people think they are better off without Saddam.

It would seem that freedom even with the death and chaos it has brought is far more enjoyable than living under the oppression of Saddam.

Another point, violence has a numbing effect. How many people saw the story about 2 dead at Va Tech that was running around 11am and though, oh well. And then a few hours latter saw the 32 dead and went ?holy ******.? I know I did.

An interesting parallel to Iraq is how Israel deals with suicide bombers. They have a special group that rushes in, cleans up, power washes the street and makes everything like it was before. In essence, they try to make it as if it never happened so that people can go about a ?normal? life. Perhaps the people in Iraq have seen so much death and destruction that they are no longer bothered by it, or at least they are trying to live as normal of lives as they can.

You're wrong. They do it because, according to Jewish laws, they have to gather all of the individual's parts in order to have a proper burial, or something similar to that.

What's sad is that all the death and destruction in Iraq was so avoidable. I think America will pay a high price for this mistake in the future. How? I don't know. But those people over there have long memories and are very unforgaving.

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow another Iraq/surge thread! How refreshing and original!

That's what happens when the "surge" allows so many deaths in a single day.

Have you read any of the stories coming out of Iraq about this event?
The Sunni insurgents desperately want to restart the civil war and are trying everything they can. If the US military and Iraqi police can?t do a better job of stopping such event then the mass blood shed will start again at which point we might as well get off the streets and let them go at it.

What is interesting is that the Sunni?s started this whole mess hoping to cower the Shitte?s into their century?s long position of subservience to the Sunni?s. It didn?t work though. And Baghdad has become am almost entirely Shiite city now.

The Sunni?s are fighting a losing battle. The only question is how much blood shed will it take before they realize that the days of Saddam and 20% of the population ruling 80% are over.

Wrong again. They are fighting for power, pure and simple, and it certainly isn't a losing battle when you have allies in neighboring states. This country is the most complicated in the Middle East, too bad we are only finding out now.

 

[ProfJohn]

Dari, I read an article about a group whose only job is to clean the area in order to return it to normal. It had nothing to do with burial.

It's the same thing as the initial idea to rebuild the WTC towers in the exact same way.
It would have been the equivalent of giving Osama the middle finger.

And you are right in that it is all about power. Shiite's have it now and the Sunni's want it back, very simple.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Here's one I have bookmarked...its got good and bad, but I really like the guy's honesty. Here's a sample:

I?m no better than anyone else. I chose to enlist. I chose to re-enlist. Hell, I volunteered to go to Iraq. Why would I do such a thing? I have a few answers of varying honesty. Mostly I want to expand my human experience and this is an easy way to experience some of the most extreme limits of mortality. I want to contribute to something bigger and more meaningful than myself. I want to give back to my country. I want to physically contribute something positive to solving a problem rather than acting like I can solve all the world?s problems from my couch. I love the guys I work with and I love the comraderie. I want money for school. I want to kill someone just so people will shut up and stop asking me if I have. Regardless of the reasons, I?m here and overall I have been very happy with the time that I?ve served. I?m to the point now that I can?t imagine my life without being a soldier.

edit: oops forgot top post links
http://blog.justanothersoldier.com/

And another of my favorites http://bootsonground.blogspot.com/

psychotic :Q

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
And another of my favorites http://bootsonground.blogspot.com/

Here are some quotes, from your 'favorite':

The New Iraq?
100+ people kidnapped in broad day light from the Ministry of Higher Education and Scientific Research. I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS. This is just so outrageous. Someone needs to do something about this, the situation is TOTALLY out of control. I am so furious about this, is this the kind of crap me and my close buddies put our lives on the line for!? I've lost some of my best friends over there, actually doing their job trying to help the situation get better and this is what all our tears, sweat and blood has gone into? We can defeat any conventional army on the earth, but we can't even stop these militias from pulling these kinds of stunts. The jig is up, it has gotten to the point to where our troops cannot improve the situation anymore by staying there. Hats off to Donald Rumsfeld for completely stealing defeat from the jaws of victory. I feel very depressed for the Iraqi people who have to endure such hard times. Even their own government (Interior Ministry) is deep in this. I can't believe how bad things have gotten, this is just incomprehensible. I think it is time to pull our troops out, they're doing the best damn job they can, but it is incompetence all the way to the top and our presence does not improve things at all.

blackangst1, it seems you are secretly a Bush-basher in disguise, no? Your 'favorite' soldier in Iraq certainly is.

You have constantly railed against people who even suggest "pulling out" in other threads. Is your next move going to be calling out this traitorous soldier?

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1
And another of my favorites http://bootsonground.blogspot.com/

Here are some quotes, from your 'favorite':

The New Iraq?
100+ people kidnapped in broad day light from the Ministry of Higher Education and Scientific Research. I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS. This is just so outrageous. Someone needs to do something about this, the situation is TOTALLY out of control. I am so furious about this, is this the kind of crap me and my close buddies put our lives on the line for!? I've lost some of my best friends over there, actually doing their job trying to help the situation get better and this is what all our tears, sweat and blood has gone into? We can defeat any conventional army on the earth, but we can't even stop these militias from pulling these kinds of stunts. The jig is up, it has gotten to the point to where our troops cannot improve the situation anymore by staying there. Hats off to Donald Rumsfeld for completely stealing defeat from the jaws of victory. I feel very depressed for the Iraqi people who have to endure such hard times. Even their own government (Interior Ministry) is deep in this. I can't believe how bad things have gotten, this is just incomprehensible. I think it is time to pull our troops out, they're doing the best damn job they can, but it is incompetence all the way to the top and our presence does not improve things at all.

blackangst1, it seems you are secretly a Bush-basher in disguise, no? Your 'favorite' soldier in Iraq certainly is.

You have constantly railed against people who even suggest "pulling out" in other threads. Is your next move going to be calling out this traitorous soldier?

Well, Im really a prez basher at all. There are things I loved about Reagan, Bush Sr, Clinton, and Bush part II, and things I dont. I just so happen to support the REASONS we went to war (to bring democracy to Iraq). Im also realistic enough to know form history it will take a decade or more, and all this sh1t bashing doesnt help anyone, including soldiers. *shrug* But its only MHO.

Also I have never, nor will ever, suggest pulling out.

 

[blackllotus]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
I just so happen to support the REASONS we went to war (to bring democracy to Iraq). Im also realistic enough to know form history it will take a decade or more, and all this sh1t bashing doesnt help anyone, including soldiers. *shrug* But its only MHO.

If you were realistic you would realize that history shows us that nation rebuilding is very prone to failure and that there is no way in hell christians are going to be able to solve the sunni shia conflict.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow another Iraq/surge thread! How refreshing and original!

That's what happens when the "surge" allows so many deaths in a single day.

Have you read any of the stories coming out of Iraq about this event?
The Sunni insurgents desperately want to restart the civil war and are trying everything they can. If the US military and Iraqi police can?t do a better job of stopping such event then the mass blood shed will start again at which point we might as well get off the streets and let them go at it.

What is interesting is that the Sunni?s started this whole mess hoping to cower the Shitte?s into their century?s long position of subservience to the Sunni?s. It didn?t work though. And Baghdad has become am almost entirely Shiite city now.

The Sunni?s are fighting a losing battle. The only question is how much blood shed will it take before they realize that the days of Saddam and 20% of the population ruling 80% are over.

What is your point? This is why we don't start invading and occupying foreign countries.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow. I think you may be more of a tool than Dave...almost feel sorry for you

That may be your opinion. But what to people think of you, whose best response to something is calling the author a 'tool'?

Yes, it is. And so is what he wrote. Why is one right and the wrong? And for all that is good who ****** cares?

*shrug* I really couldnt care less lol This board is entertainment. There is so little value on it (including my own input) it's like watching a bad train wreck. I just occasionally like to poke sticks at the passionate hacks here. Why come here then? Cuz I love to watch trainwrecks

If that were a true, you wouldn't be posting here. Still waiting for good news that negates 233 deaths in a day. SO many people like you who make claims without backing them up. Nothing new here. Just more liars.

See the bolded part? hahaha you bit!

Did you see my "If that were a true, you wouldn't be posting here.". Haha, you are a liar.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Aimster
I am not trying to ruin this thread or get involved in a heated discussion.. I wasted enough of my day doing that.

but I have a question...

After the fall of Saddam, what has been the biggest news headline that has been positive in favor of the Iraqi people?

Good question.

You know the strange thing though is that every poll I have seen says that the Iraqi people think they are better off without Saddam.

It would seem that freedom even with the death and chaos it has brought is far more enjoyable than living under the oppression of Saddam.

Another point, violence has a numbing effect. How many people saw the story about 2 dead at Va Tech that was running around 11am and though, oh well. And then a few hours latter saw the 32 dead and went ?holy ******.? I know I did.

An interesting parallel to Iraq is how Israel deals with suicide bombers. They have a special group that rushes in, cleans up, power washes the street and makes everything like it was before. In essence, they try to make it as if it never happened so that people can go about a ?normal? life. Perhaps the people in Iraq have seen so much death and destruction that they are no longer bothered by it, or at least they are trying to live as normal of lives as they can.

Yeah, those 2 million refugees that left Iraq were thrilled with the "freedom" we brought... Oh, and the U.S. isn't letting them come here.

This is exactly what I meant by getting shat upon when something positive is posted. Sheeple are soooo predictable.

Umm, I pointed out that his polls are skewed because it doesn't count the 2 million people that already fled Iraq. Did this go over your head? Talk about sheeple.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: Aimster
Can someone post a credible soldier's blog? I would be interested to see such a blog.

IIRC, I believe all of them are being censored.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Aimster
I am not trying to ruin this thread or get involved in a heated discussion.. I wasted enough of my day doing that.

but I have a question...

After the fall of Saddam, what has been the biggest news headline that has been positive in favor of the Iraqi people?

Good question.

You know the strange thing though is that every poll I have seen says that the Iraqi people think they are better off without Saddam.

It would seem that freedom even with the death and chaos it has brought is far more enjoyable than living under the oppression of Saddam.

Really? I heard differently from Iraqis who are to scared to leave their homes and go to the local market because they fear being blown up by a suicide bomber.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow another Iraq/surge thread! How refreshing and original!

That's what happens when the "surge" allows so many deaths in a single day.

Have you read any of the stories coming out of Iraq about this event?
The Sunni insurgents desperately want to restart the civil war and are trying everything they can. If the US military and Iraqi police can?t do a better job of stopping such event then the mass blood shed will start again at which point we might as well get off the streets and let them go at it.

What is interesting is that the Sunni?s started this whole mess hoping to cower the Shitte?s into their century?s long position of subservience to the Sunni?s. It didn?t work though. And Baghdad has become am almost entirely Shiite city now.

The Sunni?s are fighting a losing battle. The only question is how much blood shed will it take before they realize that the days of Saddam and 20% of the population ruling 80% are over.

Yes... I guess the days of living under a Iranian friendly Iraq has begun. Maybe that is what some Sunnis don't want or like about a Shia dominated political system.

 

[imported_Lothar]

Originally posted by: Balt
So McCain's comments after his escort through Baghdad were wrong?

/walks down the street with 200 troops, snipers posted on the rooftops of the walking route, 2 Blackhawk helicopters patrolling overhead, and a bulletproof Kevlar vest.

Yep, Baghdad is pretty safe to me.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Please show us an example of someone posting something positive from Iraq and being attacked for it? Was it on this forum, or in your imagination?

You already did post positive in the OP. If there is one thing Infidels will come to understand about this Iraq folly is the innate aggression of Muslim peoples and their inability to compromise with each other let alone te Kuffer. That aggression is based on their worldview, which is provided by Qur'an, Hadith, and the example of Mo in the Sira. It leads them to view outcomes of warfare always as a matter of Victor and Vanquished and nothing we can do about it no matter how much welfare we give or how many lives we waste acting as a buffer.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Please show us an example of someone posting something positive from Iraq and being attacked for it? Was it on this forum, or in your imagination?

You already did post positive in the OP. If there is one thing Infidels will come to understand about this Iraq folly is the innate aggression of Muslim peoples and their inability to compromise with each other let alone te Kuffer. That aggression is based on their worldview, which is provided by Qur'an, Hadith, and the example of Mo in the Sira. It leads them to view outcomes of warfare always as a matter of Victor and Vanquished and nothing we can do about it no matter how much welfare we give or how many lives we waste acting as a buffer.

You're right; if Iraq is what we needed to figure out we shouldn't be meddling in others businesses, this exercise in futility might be worth it.

Mighty empires need reminding, every now and then, to keep their egos in check.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Please show us an example of someone posting something positive from Iraq and being attacked for it? Was it on this forum, or in your imagination?

You already did post positive in the OP. If there is one thing Infidels will come to understand about this Iraq folly is the innate aggression of Muslim peoples and their inability to compromise with each other let alone te Kuffer. That aggression is based on their worldview, which is provided by Qur'an, Hadith, and the example of Mo in the Sira. It leads them to view outcomes of warfare always as a matter of Victor and Vanquished and nothing we can do about it no matter how much welfare we give or how many lives we waste acting as a buffer.

Are you being sarcastic ?

 

[trenchfoot]

mr. bush is telling us (not asking us) to be patient so he can win a war of attrition with an insufficient number of heroic but played out troops against an endless supply of IED's and suicide bombers that would gladly blow themselves up to make it to heaven. he sends more troops into the meat grinder; but he can't send enough of them in there to get the job done right due to the wear and tear our troops have suffered from the previous four years of his bungling and mismanaging the occupation/reconstruction phase of the conflict.

thus, he has managed to provide us with a proven, irrefutable four year track record of being incompetent, irresponsibly stubborn, and prone to ignore reasoned and highly qualified advice that does not jive with his neocon fantasies of grandeur.

who benefits from this lunacy? certainly not the troops who are giving their all or their families and loved ones. not the iraqi's themselves. not the average taxpayer who is watching the ever growing debt that mr. bush is burdening them with in financing his personal war with the "terrorists" that weren't in iraq until he decided to invade and colonize with carefully selected non-bid profiteers.

for the rest of us, well, we spoke at the polls and mr. bush being his usual self ain't listening. the guy has an agenda that is not in the best interest of the nation he leads. his agenda is meant to appease a select few at the expense of everyone else.

let the carnage continue and go on and on is his answer to his critics. let it never end until he and his neocon pals own all those things they don't already own. might makes right. take by force what you can't swindle or intimidate. fight wars on the cheap for as long as you can. support the troops by sending them off to a "war" custom made for earning maximum profits off the front and back end of the deal.

some plan alright.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: blackangst1
I just so happen to support the REASONS we went to war (to bring democracy to Iraq). Im also realistic enough to know form history it will take a decade or more, and all this sh1t bashing doesnt help anyone, including soldiers. *shrug* But its only MHO.

If you were realistic you would realize that history shows us that nation rebuilding is very prone to failure and that there is no way in hell christians are going to be able to solve the sunni shia conflict.

Very prone? I suppose. But unlike our attempts in Cuba, Nicaragua, and Guatemala to name a few, Japan, Vietnam, Turkey (with UK also) to some extent after their acceptance into NATO, and South Korea are excellent examples of it WORKING. The great thing is, although all these countries are democracies of one flavor or another, they are NOT molded after the US of A. They built it from a framework we helped with.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Wow. I think you may be more of a tool than Dave...almost feel sorry for you

That may be your opinion. But what to people think of you, whose best response to something is calling the author a 'tool'?

Yes, it is. And so is what he wrote. Why is one right and the wrong? And for all that is good who ****** cares?

*shrug* I really couldnt care less lol This board is entertainment. There is so little value on it (including my own input) it's like watching a bad train wreck. I just occasionally like to poke sticks at the passionate hacks here. Why come here then? Cuz I love to watch trainwrecks

If that were a true, you wouldn't be posting here. Still waiting for good news that negates 233 deaths in a day. SO many people like you who make claims without backing them up. Nothing new here. Just more liars.

See the bolded part? hahaha you bit!

Did you see my "If that were a true, you wouldn't be posting here.". Haha, you are a liar.

Wait, what? If what were true? That I like to poke snakes in a cage or that I like to instigate trainwrecks? eh?

 

[amddude]

Terrorists are getting desperate.

 

[GrGr]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: blackangst1
And another of my favorites http://bootsonground.blogspot.com/

Here are some quotes, from your 'favorite':

The New Iraq?
100+ people kidnapped in broad day light from the Ministry of Higher Education and Scientific Research. I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS. This is just so outrageous. Someone needs to do something about this, the situation is TOTALLY out of control. I am so furious about this, is this the kind of crap me and my close buddies put our lives on the line for!? I've lost some of my best friends over there, actually doing their job trying to help the situation get better and this is what all our tears, sweat and blood has gone into? We can defeat any conventional army on the earth, but we can't even stop these militias from pulling these kinds of stunts. The jig is up, it has gotten to the point to where our troops cannot improve the situation anymore by staying there. Hats off to Donald Rumsfeld for completely stealing defeat from the jaws of victory. I feel very depressed for the Iraqi people who have to endure such hard times. Even their own government (Interior Ministry) is deep in this. I can't believe how bad things have gotten, this is just incomprehensible. I think it is time to pull our troops out, they're doing the best damn job they can, but it is incompetence all the way to the top and our presence does not improve things at all.

blackangst1, it seems you are secretly a Bush-basher in disguise, no? Your 'favorite' soldier in Iraq certainly is.

You have constantly railed against people who even suggest "pulling out" in other threads. Is your next move going to be calling out this traitorous soldier?

Well, Im really a prez basher at all. There are things I loved about Reagan, Bush Sr, Clinton, and Bush part II, and things I dont. I just so happen to support the REASONS we went to war (to bring democracy to Iraq). Im also realistic enough to know form history it will take a decade or more, and all this sh1t bashing doesnt help anyone, including soldiers. *shrug* But its only MHO.

Also I have never, nor will ever, suggest pulling out.

Utter nonsense. Bringing "democracy" to Iraq was NOT the reason Bush invaded Iraq. The "democracy" song and dance was the lipstick the Bush administration reached for AFTER the invasion as a host of other rationalizations failed to stick on that particular pig.

Fact: regime change is illegal under international AND therefore US law. Fact: Bush did not have UN approval for his invasion. If Bush in fact did invade in order to bring regime change then he is a criminal under international law. As international law us the Supreme Law of the land in the US that would make Bush a criminal, no? Now who in their right mind supports a criminal murderous enterprise?


Bush administration has used 27 rationals for war in Iraq

Edit for link