.

[Starbuck1975]

Yes, you are. This entire debate is an exercise by Republicans to excuse Trump's own cronyism and nepotism, and his quid pro quo demand from the Ukrainian PM. Period.

From where I am standing, Trump’s utter disregard for the rule of law is causing people to look under rocks that the ruling class would prefer we ignore, and its exposing the full extent of nepotism and cronyism that’s infected our government.

How’s the Podesta Group doing these days?

Period.

 

[Vic]

Yet our most wise and munificent president Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place. Is it the chicken or is it the egg?

The left wing reporters at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and even PBS do not care about the corruption of left wing politicians. In fact, they were just fine with it being swept under the rug until Trump made it headline news nationwide.

Now everyone in America knows, including indiferent libs who are now trying to interfere with Trumps re-election efforts with the unhinged inquiry they are proceeding with.

Is this some kind of a joke?

You have ZERO evidence of any dirty dealings by the Bidens, but it is a fact that Trump asking a foreign leader to interfere in our election is a dirty dealing all by itself. There is no chicken or egg here, just gullible people and their childish leader foolishly believing that a claim of "he did it first!" is a valid legal defense in the adult world.

 

[IronWing]

Trump wouldn't have had to dig into stories about corruption in Ukraine if Trump hadn't made up stories about corruption in Ukraine? Felix, I get the sense that you're flailing here.

 

[Vic]

From where I am standing, Trump’s utter disregard for the rule of law is causing people to look under rocks that the ruling class would prefer we ignore, and its exposing the full extent of nepotism and cronyism that’s infected our government.

How’s the Podesta Group doing these days?

Period.

Did you not get the pepperoni pizza you ordered from them?

You and the OP are only here to defend corruption and cronyism, specifically by deflecting against overt acts of such with unproven partisan conspiracy theories. The purpose of which is obviously to ensure that the overt acts are forgotten as soon as the conspiracy theories are shown to be false.
For example, Hillary's emails were more or less forgotten as soon Trump put in his own server.
That's how this works for gullible partisans, always claiming 2 wrongs make a right along partisan lines, and thus our govt and its leaders become more and more corrupt, just so partisans get to keep their egos. Which is by design.

 

[interchange]

Yet our most wise and munificent president Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place. Is it the chicken or is it the egg?

The left wing reporters at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and even PBS do not care about the corruption of left wing politicians. In fact, they were just fine with it being swept under the rug until Trump made it headline news nationwide.

Now everyone in America knows, including indiferent libs who are now trying to interfere with Trumps re-election efforts with the unhinged inquiry they are proceeding with.

You're back. Care to answer my basic question about which investigation into Burisma you were referring to?

 

[Starbuck1975]

Did you not get the pepperoni pizza you ordered from them?

You and the OP are only here to defend corruption and cronyism, specifically by deflecting against overt acts of such with unproven partisan conspiracy theories. The purpose of which is obviously to ensure that the overt acts are forgotten as soon as the conspiracy theories are shown to be false.
For example, Hillary's emails were more or less forgotten as soon Trump put in his own server.
That's how this works for gullible partisans, always claiming 2 wrongs make a right along partisan lines, and thus our govt and its leaders become more and more corrupt, just so partisans get to keep their egos. Which is by design.

I sent it back. They forgot to whisper magic words to the pepperoni.

Is Ukranian and Russian money so sweet that its unreasonable to ask our Presidential candidates, their kids, their campaign managers and their inner circles to not entangle themselves in it?

 

[Matt390]

It is one big boy’s club. What qualifications does Hunter Biden have other than his last name. George W Bush went to Yale too. Lots of people go to Yale. Not all get appointed to the inner circles of international oligarchs.

I am glad Hunter Biden is under scrutiny. If we’re going to lament Trump, we should focus on the excused behaviors that paved the road for him.

Hunter went to Yale LAW. W went to undergrad at Yale.

 

[ElFenix]

Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place

uh, yes, he can, because that's exactly what happened. it's a made up story from russia today. you're literally spouting russian propaganda.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Hunter went to Yale LAW. W went to undergrad at Yale.

Which degree makes him an expert in Ukranian and Chinese markets?

 

[Cogman]

Yet our most wise and munificent president Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place. Is it the chicken or is it the egg?

So, to be clear, you are OK with him withholding military aid during an active war to find dirt on a political opponent. Dirt that has existed for the last 3 years, but only now he looks into.

The problem isn't whether or not biden did something wrong. Fuck biden and his son if they've committed crimes. The problem is that the President used his powers as the president to pressure a foreign government to look into a political rival. It goes further. He not only did that, but then proceeded to hide all records of this (obviously knowing it was wrong). He then calls out the whistle blower as a hack, leftist, whatever that shouldn't be trusted, only to release the transcripts which prove everything the whistle blower said.

This is worse than Nixon's secret tapes in the democrat offices. This is a president using his office to influence a foreign power in the american election system. The "Bu bu Biden!" stuff is a non-sequitur. Biden could have shot someone in ukraine. It still would not have been Trump's role as president to pressure a foreign government to investigate that. That's a job for diplomats and congress.

The left wing reporters at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and even PBS do not care about the corruption of left wing politicians. In fact, they were just fine with it being swept under the rug until Trump made it headline news nationwide.

Now everyone in America knows, including indiferent libs who are now trying to interfere with Trumps re-election efforts with the unhinged inquiry they are proceeding with.

Really not true. When left wing politicians have scandals, they almost all immediately resign or are voted out. Remember Anthony Wiener? Al Franken?

Acting like Biden's son profiting from nepotism is somehow awful while giving Trump a pass for golfing at his own resorts, hiring his family, and pushing diplomats and military officials to stay at his hotels is nuts.

Now, ask yourself, if this was truly an "unhinged" inquiry, then why is trump trying to do everything in his power to obstruct it? Why is Trump instructing everyone to disobey congressional subpoenas? (which is, itself, a crime. Obstructing congress).

And just to tie everything back. Do you remember what Bill Clinton was impeached for? Lying about a BJ in the oval office. The whole inquiry started around him having the BJ in the first place, and ended with him being impeached over "depends on what your definition of sex is". During that entire impeachment inquiry he and his office cooperated with subpoenas. Hell, there was a HUGE amount of "controversy" over him meeting the AG, Loretta Lynch, on the tarmac at an airport.

That is the standard for "unhinged" impeachment. Not looking into actual crimes the president committed. FFS, republicans completely ignore the fact that Bill Barr has basically been Trump's second attorney through all of this. Republicans want to call this some sort of unconstitutional coup while conveniently forgetting that they drummed up impeachment charges for something that is not a crime against Clinton.

This impeachment is about Trump bribing a foreign government by withholding aid to seek out dirt on a political opponent. We have the manuscript where he says just that "Do me a favor though" We have the texts between the diplomats where the say "So, are we saying that Ukraine's aid is dependent on investigating biden's son?". And we have the ongoing effort of the trump administration to subvert the constitutional authority granted to congress to investigate the president.

But somehow, the fact that Biden's son may have done something wrong is more important.

This sort of double think drives me nuts.

 

[ElFenix]

Which degree makes him an expert in Ukranian and Chinese markets?

man who has previous investment fund experience not qualified to be on board of investment fund. you heard it here first.

he wasn't hired to run day to day ops. he's a yale trained lawyer who has been on boards of plenty of companies and NGOs.

 

[dank69]

Which degree makes him an expert in Ukranian and Chinese markets?

Which degree makes anyone an expert in Ukrainian and Chinese markets?

 

[Starbuck1975]

Which degree makes anyone an expert in Ukrainian and Chinese markets?

The one with a powerful daddy behind it apparently.

 

[brycejones]

Yet our most wise and munificent president Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place.

Donald lies constantly.

 

[Starbuck1975]

man who has previous investment fund experience not qualified to be on board of investment fund. you heard it here first.

he wasn't hired to run day to day ops. he's a yale trained lawyer who has been on boards of plenty of companies and NGOs.

Do you really want to go there? His early career path includes MBNA and lobbying experience with enough conflict of interest to raise a few eyebrows.

 

[dank69]

The one with a powerful daddy behind it apparently.

So now you at least realize nobody has a degree in Ukrainian and Chinese economics. I wonder why you think Biden should have had one.

 

[ElFenix]

Do you really want to go there? His early career path includes MBNA and lobbying experience with enough conflict of interest to raise a few eyebrows.

wait, i thought it was lack of experience/expertise that was the problem. is that not the case?

 

[Fanatical Meat]

wait, i thought it was lack of experience/expertise that was the problem. is that not the case?

But #bothsides

 

[Jhhnn]

Yet our most wise and munificent president Donald J. Trump would not have asked Ukraine to look into the dirty dealings of the Bidens in Ukraine had it not occurred in the first place. Is it the chicken or is it the egg?

The left wing reporters at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and even PBS do not care about the corruption of left wing politicians. In fact, they were just fine with it being swept under the rug until Trump made it headline news nationwide.

Now everyone in America knows, including indiferent libs who are now trying to interfere with Trumps re-election efforts with the unhinged inquiry they are proceeding with.

It's conspiracy theory. It doesn't even matter. It's against the law for a political candidate to solicit anything of value for his campaign from a foreign govt, like dirt on a rival. It's an abuse of power to strong arm Zelensky into playing along. It's against the law to block a credible & urgent whistle blower complaint from going to Congress.

And, uhh, anybody who thinks the most corrupt President in history cares about rooting out corruption in Ukraine desperately needs to re-evaluate. Trump just wants a cut of it.

 

[FelixDeCat]

So, to be clear, you are OK with him withholding military aid during an active war to find dirt on a political opponent. Dirt that has existed for the last 3 years, but only now he looks into.

He did not withhold anything. Thats a media misrepsentation and left wing lie. Corruption is rampant in Ukraine. Why are we giving them miiltary aid to begin with? Let them fight their own damn war.

The problem isn't whether or not biden did something wrong. Fuck biden and his son if they've committed crimes. The problem is that the President used his powers as the president to pressure a foreign government to look into a political rival. It goes further. He not only did that, but then proceeded to hide all records of this (obviously knowing it was wrong). He then calls out the whistle blower as a hack, leftist, whatever that shouldn't be trusted, only to release the transcripts which prove everything the whistle blower said.

This is worse than Nixon's secret tapes in the democrat offices. This is a president using his office to influence a foreign power in the american election system. The "Bu bu Biden!" stuff is a non-sequitur. Biden could have shot someone in ukraine. It still would not have been Trump's role as president to pressure a foreign government to investigate that. That's a job for diplomats and congress.

If you remember there was an investigation of Burisma that was called off because of pressure exerted by Vice President Biden. He did not want his son smeared even though he was on the take. If the president wanted the investigation restarted, it was ultimately up to Ukraine.

Really not true. When left wing politicians have scandals, they almost all immediately resign or are voted out. Remember Anthony Wiener? Al Franken?

Acting like Biden's son profiting from nepotism is somehow awful while giving Trump a pass for golfing at his own resorts, hiring his family, and pushing diplomats and military officials to stay at his hotels is nuts.

Now, ask yourself, if this was truly an "unhinged" inquiry, then why is trump trying to do everything in his power to obstruct it? Why is Trump instructing everyone to disobey congressional subpoenas? (which is, itself, a crime. Obstructing congress).

And just to tie everything back. Do you remember what Bill Clinton was impeached for? Lying about a BJ in the oval office. The whole inquiry started around him having the BJ in the first place, and ended with him being impeached over "depends on what your definition of sex is". During that entire impeachment inquiry he and his office cooperated with subpoenas. Hell, there was a HUGE amount of "controversy" over him meeting the AG, Loretta Lynch, on the tarmac at an airport.

A whole bunch of politicians quit from the left and right but it was only because of the "me too" movement, not because the left wing media exposed any democrat scandals. I've been paying attention to politics a long time and know that things happen on the left and right but usually the left gets a pass because the media sympathizes with them.

One that comes to mind is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Rangel . Despite rank corruption and a House censure, he would not resign. He served for 46 years and the media did not "ride him" like they do republicans.

That is the standard for "unhinged" impeachment. Not looking into actual crimes the president committed. FFS, republicans completely ignore the fact that Bill Barr has basically been Trump's second attorney through all of this. Republicans want to call this some sort of unconstitutional coup while conveniently forgetting that they drummed up impeachment charges for something that is not a crime against Clinton.

This impeachment is about Trump bribing a foreign government by withholding aid to seek out dirt on a political opponent. We have the manuscript where he says just that "Do me a favor though" We have the texts between the diplomats where the say "So, are we saying that Ukraine's aid is dependent on investigating biden's son?". And we have the ongoing effort of the trump administration to subvert the constitutional authority granted to congress to investigate the president.

But somehow, the fact that Biden's son may have done something wrong is more important.

It is unhinged because unlike previous impeachment proceedings the democrats are trying something different this time. They are doing everything in secret, and even Schiff had to put on a comical performance of Trumps phone call to make some sort of point. If thats not Saturday Night Live while masquerading as an impeachment, I dont know what is. Furthermore, since there has been no full vote in the House (as has been done in the past) to undertake an impeachment inquiry and its being done behind closed doors it is nothing more than a circus show.

Regarding Bill Clinton, he was impeached for lying under oath during a deposition in a civil trial. Thats called perjury. He was fined and lost his law license as a result. .....and all you could focus on was a blowjob?

This sort of double think drives me nuts.

Me too. And TBH it started down its current path when right wing radio took over the AM dial in the early 1990s. First the right was radicalized, then the left. Now all you have is hate, and it its done so people can get clicks, viewers and listeners.

 

[Vic]

Cognitive dissonance is a helluva drug.

 

[Jhhnn]

Cognitive dissonance is a helluva drug.

Felix is all over the map, huh? At least he hasn't dragged in the Dixiecrats.

 

[hal2kilo]

So now you at least realize nobody has a degree in Ukrainian and Chinese economics. I wonder why you think Biden should have had one.

I can see clearly now that the clouds are gone.

 

[Jhhnn]

I can see clearly now that the clouds are gone.

Nah, man, you're not saying it right-

 

[sandorski]

Which degree makes him an expert in Ukranian and Chinese markets?

Ah yes the labyrinthine complexities of the legendary Ukrainian Markets!