3,500 dollar budget, what to do?

[piasabird]

Well if you are going to build a $3,500 computer you have to concentrate on what you are going to do with it. You could buy a twin pair of 24" Monitors, or a digital TV to go with it, wireless, nice printer, digital camera, etc. Might also consider extra hard drives, backup external hard drive, 100GB Flash Drive, etc.

 

[General Kenobi]

It's much cheaper than a few builds I've seen on this forum.

Which still doesn't make it cheap or even reasonable for its intended purpose.

Well if you are going to build a $3,500 computer you have to concentrate on what you are going to do with it. You could buy a twin pair of 24" Monitors, or a digital TV to go with it, wireless, nice printer, digital camera, etc. Might also consider extra hard drives, backup external hard drive, 100GB Flash Drive, etc.

The monitors aren't included in the budget.

 

[Zap]

It totally depends on the user whether they are capable of managing and maintaining their rig properly.

Right... and for someone paying someone else to build them a system, I'd say keep it simple.

I'm being commissioned by a client to build a high end gaming unit. The budget of 3500 is by far the most any client has ever given me. I'm usually lucky to get close to 2000. I'd like some advice items I could use to make the best machine possible.

Okay.

You were given a $3500 budget. Is that with your profit included? Or do you work for free?

You can start with a bottom up way to calculate things, such as:
$3500
-$profit
-$190 for Win7 Ult
-$ for optical drive(s)
-$ for case choice
-$ for PSU choice
-$ for RAM choice
...
Eventually you'll narrow down to the budget left for the "main" components of CPU, GPU, mobo, SSD.

Here are some other, generic suggestions.

Get a nicer looking case. Most women care about that, and the Antec 1200 is just a huge black thing... nevermind. :whiste: I'm talking about looking at Lian Li or Silverstone for something that doesn't scream "wind tunnel gamer."

In a related thought, except for gamers/overclockers who equate HUGE CASE with "OMG MY MACHINE ROX!" most people would rather have a smaller case.

Even if not specified, pay some attention to noise output. Most people don't know or care how quiet their computer is, until it is too noisy.

BTW, knowing WHICH GAMES will she play can be helpful, as can WHEN she wants it.

Gotta run right now, but I'll check back to see if the which/when gets answered, and maybe I can start pointing out specific parts.

 

[mfenn]

Perhaps you could spec out 2 builds, i7-2700K against 2011, and print out some gaming benchmarks to show what you (don't) get for the extra $700+.

With the 2700K you should be able to afford intel 510 SSD(s) (single or separate OS and data) for reliability. Air cooling is fine for i7 and is more customer-proof.

Buying all of the most expensive parts could be fun, but if you want to help them make the best choice it's usually the much cheaper parts with 90% of the same performance.

This is an excellent suggestion. Spec out the $3500 build (LGA 2011, 16GB of RAM, 2x 7970, RAID SSD) then show a $1500 build (LGA 2011, 8GB of RAM, 2x 6950 2GB, single SSD) that has 80% of the performance.

 

[sandorski]

Pre-Overclocked to 4.2ghz system, $3300

Could use it as a guide.

 

[Zap]

Alright, without knowing anything more about what she plays, here's my suggestion.

Core i7-2700K $370 (same speed and Turbo as fastest socket 2011 CPUs)
2x8GB 1.5v DDR3-1600 $130 (nice to see price come down on 8GB sticks)
Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z Gen3 $190 (one of the best boards on market, and it is mATX and affordable)
random aftermarket top-down CPU cooler $50 or so (anything better than stock, drop fan speed low)
1GHz Radeon 7970 $600 (fastest single card, no SLI/CFX profile madness or micro stutter)
550W modular 80Plus Platinum PSU $160 (oh yeah, Platinum)
Lian Li mATX case $100 (small and attractive, like a woman I know)
Blu-Ray burner $80 (why not?)
3TB data drive $210 (got data? use for backups?)
256GB SSD Windows/applications drive $330 (fast Marvell controller, 5 year warranty)
512GB SSD games drive $650 (fast Marvell controller, 5 year warranty)
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit $190 (because Home Premium limited to 16GB, leaves room for upgrading RAM)
=$3060

This gives you some leeway in pricing/sourcing plus some profit. The purpose of the parts choices listed after the part.

The overall philosophy of the build is to be small and attractive, with reasonably low noise and great performance/Watt. With all the SSD space, only backups and data will not reside on SSD, so everything should be super snappy.

This is not a "how much gaming performance can I get" build (for that you will need to overclock CPU at least). However, it is a monster in its own right. Can easily spec twin Radeon 6950 in SLI with higher wattage PSU and normal ATX case/mobo, but that's not the point of this build.

It also avoids possible pitfalls by not doing RAID or SLI/CFX and choosing the more reliable Marvell controller for the SSDs instead of the popular Sandforce.

Possible changes: If data drive not needed, drop the HDD. If Blu-Ray not needed, step down to $20 DVD writer. If not that many games will be installed at one time, drop the 256GB SSD and run everything off one 512GB SSD. Can probably knock $80 off the cost by going with an FSP Aurum 80Plus Gold PSU instead of an 80Plus Platinum. Since not overclocking, can easily go with a full featured ASRock Z68 Pro3-M board and save $70. Alternately, bite the bullet and overclock that biatch! Heck, with Sandy Bridge most people would be confident enough to overclock for customer's systems. Heck, there are a few boutique builders who offer AND GUARANTEE the 2700K at 5GHz overclocks! I think 4-4.5GHz is a shoe-in for years of reliable operation. If no overclocking and noise really not an issue then can save $50 (give or take) and just use stock cooler since it really is sufficient for stock clocks. Here is the build taking these suggestions into consideration:

Core i7-2700K $370
2x8GB 1.5v DDR3-1600 $130
ASRock Z68 Pro3-M $120
1GHz Radeon 7970 $600
cheaper 80Plus Gold PSU $80
Lian Li mATX case $100
DVD writer $20
512GB SSD $650 (fast Marvell controller, 5 year warranty)
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit $190 (because Home Premium limited to 16GB, leaves room for upgrading RAM)
=$2260

Of course just add $70 for the better motherboard and $50+/- for aftermarket CPU cooler to OC the CPU.

 

[TidusZ]

If I gave someone $3500 to build me the best pc possible and they gave me a microatx case with microatx motherboard I would be extremely pissed off... I definitely wouldn't go that route without asking about client's preferences. Then again, I'd also be pretty pissed off to only have 1 7970 in my pc on a $3500 budget. You really need more information about preferences and what the cpu is used for before anyone can give any advice. She might be a hardcore fps player using 3 x 30" setup and 1 7970 isn't enough. Surely with that budget you can build a much more powerful machine for gaming.

On the other hand it might just be an office computer for someone with too much money in which case that build might be reasonable for that budget.

 

[NTMBK]

I fail to understand the anti mATX snobbery on this and other forums sometimes. Unless you want to run Crossfire/SLI, why do you need such a huge mobo and case?

You really need to be more specific about what your customer wants, I agree. Does she want a Crysis-crushing behemoth with tri-SLI, LED lights and anti-ghosting keyboard? Or does she want a machine that will run quiet, actually fit under a desk, look tasteful and attractive, but still pack massive power? Have you considered an mATX LGA 2011 motherboard like the ASRock X79 Extreme4-M S2011? Six Sandy-Bridge E cores and quad channel memory, paired with a strong GPU like a 7970, a nice discrete sounds card like a Xonar DG put into that legacy PCI slot, and a GOOD wifi card installed in the remaining PCIe slot, and I'd say that would be one hell of a machine to find in an mATX box.

 

[Dallascisco]

Thank you all who have shared their opinions. I agree that I didn't give specific info in the beginning but that was all I had. This kind of build is new for me so I apologize beforehand for anything noobish.

As far as the case goes she chose it so that is what I'm going with. Believe it or not it is actually smaller than her current machine which she bought from Digital Storm and absolutely hated. How does an EVGA motherboard and WD Green hdd's end up in a gaming build? Anyways.......

She has decided to go with the lga 2011 platform for best performance and potential for future upgrades.

I'm trying to decide between the asus sabertooth x79 and the rampage IV motherboards. She won't be overclocking so I'm leaning towards the Sabertooth for the stability and warranty but would appreciate other opinions.

For hard drives she is going with a 512 gb ssd as a main drive and a 600 gb velciraptor as a data drive. She has decided to drop RAID since this machine isn't going to store critical data.

For a cooler I'm thinking about using the Thermaltake Contac30 as an upgrade from stock. I'd like to use the Frio but many have said it blocks ram slots. I plan on using 32 gb of ram in quad channel so slot blockage is an issue.

She already has a license of Win7 Ult so will be using that.

She mainly plays SWTOR right now.

 

[tynopik]

which she bought from Digital Storm and absolutely hated

What exactly did she hate about it?

 

[Dallascisco]

It started blue screening within 2 weeks of buying it and after having it "fixed" multiple times the issue never went away. She brought it to me and I found that one of her hdd's had failed and after a fresh install of windows still had blue screens that pointed towards the mb as an issue. Thus we are building anew machine.

What exactly did she hate about it?

 

[DaveSimmons]

Was the WD green the boot drive or only for extra storage? It's fine for backups.

If she wasn't able to get a refund:

You could just spend $200 on a new motherboard, $100-350 on a SSD boot drive, and run the CPU at stock speed

 

[RavenSEAL]

Throw a 512GB SSD in there, SB E on Noctua 14, xFire 7970s, 16GB RAM and a corsair 800D.

 

[Dallascisco]

They had them in raid 0 which I found amusing.....

The entire system is dated so she decided to just scrap it and start fresh. She's got to part the old guy and sell\distribute to other machines she has.

Was the WD green the boot drive or only for extra storage? It's fine for backups.

If she wasn't able to get a refund:

You could just spend $200 on a new motherboard, $100-350 on a SSD boot drive, and run the CPU at stock speed

 

[Zap]

If I gave someone $3500 to build me the best pc possible and they gave me a microatx case with microatx motherboard I would be extremely pissed off...

Well, women already are accustomed to paying higher prices for skimpier swimwear, so who knows what she would think?

If everyone only thought "bigger is better" then why aren't we all still using CRT monitors? I mean srsly, my 21" Nokia from BITD was a monster, and I really felt manly for being able to move it myself without assistance.

You really need more information about preferences and what the cpu is used for before anyone can give any advice.

I inquired about the preferences twice. I was giving "generic" advice in lieu of that.

I'm trying to decide between the asus sabertooth x79 and the rampage IV motherboards. She won't be overclocking so I'm leaning towards the Sabertooth for the stability and warranty but would appreciate other opinions.

Overclocking is a feature, just like a second Ethernet port or an extra SATA controller. Buy for the features she needs or wants. If she doesn't need or want a feature, don't pay extra for it. Regarding warranty, would she really keep this rig 5 years? That's the Sabertooth warranty, right? I'd think someone who drops serious coin into their computers because they want the best would not go 5 years without a platform upgrade.

She mainly plays SWTOR right now.

Now we're getting somewhere. AFAIK SWTOR does NOT support SLI or Crossfire, so my recommendation on getting the fastest single GPU card stands.

They had them in raid 0 which I found amusing.....

Wow, so the only drives in the system were two WD Green in RAID? Fail.

 

[Dallascisco]

Yeah, I lol'd.............


I wasn't even aware EVGA even made motherboards. I was disappointed to find that the drivers for it were all dated to 2009, even for Win 7. I understand it was a nvidia 790 board but update your drivers once in awhile.......

Wow, so the only drives in the system were two WD Green in RAID? Fail.

 

[Dallascisco]

ok, here is my rough draft of a parts list.


antec 1200 case
intel 3930k sandy bridge cpu
asus sabertooth x79motherboard
32 gb crucial ballistix ram
thermaltake contac30 cooler
512 gb crucial ssd OS\App drive
600 gb western digital velciraptor data drive
amd 7970 video card
dvd burner
media drive

 

[birthdaymonkey]

ok, here is my rough draft of a parts list.


antec 1200 case
intel 3930k sandy bridge cpu
asus sabertooth x79motherboard
32 gb crucial ballistix ram
thermaltake contac30 cooler
512 gb crucial ssd OS\App drive
600 gb western digital velciraptor data drive
amd 7970 video card
dvd burner
media drive

IMO, the build lacks refinement. It's got tons of power where it counts but seems to skimp on fit and finish. If I were spending that kind of money, I'd want my system to be solid as a tank and silent.

Has she considered a different case? I guess there's no accounting for taste, but the Antec 1200 is big, flashy, and noisy.

The Silverstone FT02 is a decent size, well built, classy, very quiet, and offers the most innovative air cooling design around... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163161

The Raptor is rarely recommended nowadays because it's no faster than a normal WD Black 7200 rpm drive while being louder and much more expensive per GB. The raptor does have slightly lower access times, but that's sort of meaningless for a storage drive.

The Thermaltake Contac 30 is not really a CPU cooler of repute. In a $3500 build, I'd want something solid and silent like a Noctua or one of the newer Thermalrights.

Has she given any thought to the human interface aspect of the build (mouse, keyboard)? What is the current monitor setup?

 

[Dallascisco]

Not sure if she has considered a different case. Will that silver stone hold a 15 inch video card?

I could swap the raptor drive for a caviar black.

I'd like to use the thermaltake frio but many say it blocks ram slots.

She is keeping her kb\mouse\monitor

IMO, the build lacks refinement. It's got tons of power where it counts but seems to skimp on fit and finish. If I were spending that kind of money, I'd want my system to be solid as a tank and silent.

Has she considered a different case? I guess there's no accounting for taste, but the Antec 1200 is big, flashy, and noisy.

The Silverstone FT02 is a decent size, well built, classy, very quiet, and offers the most innovative air cooling design around... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163161

The Raptor is rarely recommended nowadays because it's no faster than a normal WD Black 7200 rpm drive while being louder and much more expensive per GB. The raptor does have slightly lower access times, but that's sort of meaningless for a storage drive.

The Thermaltake Contac 30 is not really a CPU cooler of repute. In a $3500 build, I'd want something solid and silent like a Noctua or one of the newer Thermalrights.

Has she given any thought to the human interface aspect of the build (mouse, keyboard)? What is the current monitor setup?

 

[birthdaymonkey]

Not sure if she has considered a different case. Will that silver stone hold a 15 inch video card?

I could swap the raptor drive for a caviar black.

I'd like to use the thermaltake frio but many say it blocks ram slots.

She is keeping her kb\mouse\monitor

It will fit dual 5970s, which are pretty large... like 12" or so. I don't think I've ever heard of a 15" video card before. The Reference 7970 is 10.5".

I'd definitely swap the raptor for a Black.

The best value heatsink around is probably the Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO, which is 2011 compatible. I doubt you'd have RAM clearance issues as long as you get low profile RAM. (Heatspreaders are useless anyway)

 

[Kristijonas]

Alright, without knowing anything more about what she plays, here's my suggestion.

Core i7-2700K $370 (same speed and Turbo as fastest socket 2011 CPUs)
2x8GB 1.5v DDR3-1600 $130 (nice to see price come down on 8GB sticks)
Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z Gen3 $190 (one of the best boards on market, and it is mATX and affordable)
random aftermarket top-down CPU cooler $50 or so (anything better than stock, drop fan speed low)
1GHz Radeon 7970 $600 (fastest single card, no SLI/CFX profile madness or micro stutter)
550W modular 80Plus Platinum PSU $160 (oh yeah, Platinum)
Lian Li mATX case $100 (small and attractive, like a woman I know)
Blu-Ray burner $80 (why not?)
3TB data drive $210 (got data? use for backups?)
256GB SSD Windows/applications drive $330 (fast Marvell controller, 5 year warranty)
512GB SSD games drive $650 (fast Marvell controller, 5 year warranty)
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit $190 (because Home Premium limited to 16GB, leaves room for upgrading RAM)
=$3060

So far, I like this the best. Except I would skip on the 256gb SSD and only put in a really good 512gb SSD. Also I'd add a soundcard. Probably something from ASUS. Then take a good profit for yourself and hand what's left back to the lady, telling her that you've built the best optimized PC. Oh, and just make sure the case is really good-looking. Ask friend artists/designers to help in making a choice if you you must

 

[Dallascisco]

what ram would you suggest?

It will fit dual 5970s, which are pretty large... like 12" or so. I don't think I've ever heard of a 15" video card before. The Reference 7970 is 10.5".

I'd definitely swap the raptor for a Black.

The best value heatsink around is probably the Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO, which is 2011 compatible. I doubt you'd have RAM clearance issues as long as you get low profile RAM. (Heatspreaders are useless anyway)

 

[mfenn]

ga 2011 platform ... asus sabertooth x79 and the rampage IV ... 512 gb ... 600 gb velciraptor ... Thermaltake Contac30 .... 32 gb of ram in quad channel

....

She mainly plays SWTOR right now.

I admit, I LOL'ed.

OP, while you could keep your mouth shut and build your client a ridiculous $3500 machine, I don't think that is the most moral/ethical choice. IMHO it is your duty as a trusted adviser to point out how much of a ridiculous waste of money this machine is for someone whose goal is to play SWTOR. That task can be handled even at 2560x1600 with a $1500 machine. Just because your client has been ripped off by boutiques in the past and has a whacked out view of what a gaming machine should cost doesn't mean that you have to be a part of perpetuating that.

 

[birthdaymonkey]

what ram would you suggest?

There are numerous 4x4 (16GB) 1600MHz Corsair Vengeance low profile kits on Newegg for $95. You can even get a low latency cas7 kit for $150 if you insist on spending the extra money for a couple % performance.

32 GB is really really unnecessary for any contemporary gaming scenario (as is 16 GB TBH).

EDIT: Your rough draft is also missing a power supply. If you want the best, Seasonic Gold or Platinum. 560W is fine for single GPU, 750 for xfire 7970s.

 

[vailr]

For that kind of budget, you could just get a pre-built Alienware gaming machine. Throw in an HDTV tuner card and an external USB 3.0/eSATA 3 TB hard drive for backup.
Let Alienware handle the customer support.
And maybe: make it dual-boot Windows 7 64-bit and OSX Lion?