I'm prejudiced against Chevy.
They treated me like crap over the years. Unlikely I ever buy any GM product again.
Ditto Sprint.
They treated me like crap over the years. Unlikely I ever buy any GM product again.
Ditto Sprint.
Congrats! That's pretty good trade. People say once you drive a Tesla, it's hard to go back to anything else.So I had a Mid Range Model 3, then sold it after the big price drops came in 2019.
I just bought a used Long Range AWD Model 3 for ~$6k less then I paid for that Mid Range, and this one came with Autopilot.
So, so happy to be back in a Model 3! Greatest car ever.
the porche rep said on tv that their electric cars are a good value.So Porsche unveiled their Taycan. Car looks nice and is typical Porsche expensive. But the range is disappointing. Taycan Turbo and Taycan Turbo S have 200 miles and 193 miles of range. Another Tesla killer released with subpar range like the E-Tron and the iPace. I guess there is more to it than just putting motor with battery when making EV.
The range data is supposedly from Porsche of China website ordering page.EPA numbers haven't been released yet but I haven't seen any estimates that guess that low yet, most I've seen say 220-250ish. Still not great but it does make up for it somewhat with the charging speed.
"Turbo models will wear 20-inch turbine-style wheels with 245/45 front and 285/40 rear tires. There are optional 21-inch wheels in a five-spoke design borrowed from the Mission E concept the Taycan is based on, or optional aerodynamically optimized five-spoke wheels with carbon-fiber blades. Either will be wrapped in 265/35 front and 305/30 rear tires."
I'd say that has something to do with the range on the taycan.
So Porsche unveiled their Taycan. Car looks nice and is typical Porsche expensive. But the range is disappointing. Taycan Turbo and Taycan Turbo S have 200 miles and 193 miles of range. Another Tesla killer released with subpar range like the E-Tron and the iPace. I guess there is more to it than just putting motor with battery when making EV.
I used to love "just" the idea of an electric car, but Tesla has been extremely competitive:
I feel like with a Porsche EV, all you're getting is a slick body on top of, well, a battery sled. If you really love Porsches & also want to go fast & go electric, then cool! But as a competitor...eh...you're missing out on so many neat things!
- Nationwide Supercharging network
- OTA updates with not just bug-fixes but performance enhancements...my buddy just got Chess on his Tesla, lol
- WIP self-driving
- Best-of-class range & performance options
So Porsche unveiled their Taycan. Car looks nice and is typical Porsche expensive. But the range is disappointing. Taycan Turbo and Taycan Turbo S have 200 miles and 193 miles of range. Another Tesla killer released with subpar range like the E-Tron and the iPace. I guess there is more to it than just putting motor with battery when making EV.
That chart doesn't tell the whole story -- the Taycan does have a huge advantage in sustainable performance. You can go all-out for more than short bursts. Only so useful on typical roads, but this is a performance comparison.
Nice thing about the release of Taycan and all these "Tesla killers" is it legitimizes EV cars and proves Tesla does really have solid 3-5 years tech lead on everyone else. Problem for other automakers is that Tesla is not standing still and the pace of innovation at Tesla is insane compared to legacy autos. I expect Tesla lead to increase dramatically once they incorporate Maxwell battery tech into their cars along with full self driving.I used to love "just" the idea of an electric car, but Tesla has been extremely competitive:
I feel like with a Porsche EV, all you're getting is a slick body on top of, well, a battery sled. If you really love Porsches & also want to go fast & go electric, then cool! But as a competitor...eh...you're missing out on so many neat things!
- Nationwide Supercharging network
- OTA updates with not just bug-fixes but performance enhancements...my buddy just got Chess on his Tesla, lol
- WIP self-driving
- Best-of-class range & performance options
We shall see. Elon tweeted Model S will hit Nurburgring next week. Let's see what the new Raven can do. I expect the new Raven motor in Model S will do very well.That chart doesn't tell the whole story -- the Taycan does have a huge advantage in sustainable performance. You can go all-out for more than short bursts. Only so useful on typical roads, but this is a performance comparison.
Based on specs, 2020 Porsche Taycan is no match for 2020 Tesla Roadster. Hopefully we'll see the Roadster next year but it could be 2021 before we see it. Tesla has lot on their plate right now.I'd be surprised if they're that low, but yeah still a big disappointment.
Which, WTF at the pricing. I thought the Taycan was supposed to be much closer to the Model S, like more like ~$100k. I'm not even a huge Tesla fan and the Model S is looking a bit long in the tooth, but even the design of the Taycan is leaving me a bit disappointed and wouldn't be enough to win me over. The pricing simply doesn't seem warranted compared to the Model S.
I hope Tesla considers a 4 door coupe version of the new Roadster. I think it looks fairly similar to the Taycan in many respects (I'd actually say a bit better even). Cut the power back and the battery some even (aim for double the range of the Taycan still though) and sell it for what Porsche is selling the Taycan ($150-200k; maybe have a 375 mile range for the base and 450 mile range for the higher spec version).
Yeah I'd guess the Porsche should do better around a track, and the fast charging is nice. Its still tough to see where they're justifying their price otherwise though. Its not awful, it might even be good, but its still disappointing. At least I think so. It just seems solid all around, but doesn't really standout particularly in any area.
I can understand that. Leaf is a nice car, just make sure you research what it is capable of. I'm not sure i'm satisfied with Nissans response to rapidgate.I'm prejudiced against Chevy.
They treated me like crap over the years. Unlikely I ever buy any GM product again.
Ditto Sprint.
That seems like a weird article. Only one word dedicated to probably the biggest factor in range difference, drag. Comparing the S to the E-tron? Why not X?Very interesting article on Audi's battery pack tech:
https://jalopnik.com/why-no-one-is-beating-teslas-range-1837952903
Honda announced a new Honda E electric car recently. It starts at $32,000, and only has a 137 mile range. It also looks like a sub-compact piece of junk, and it's not even available in the US. Grr.
I'm still waiting for that new sub $30,000 electric car that gets more than 200 miles of range and doesn't look like a shitbox. I guess that I will need to wait awhile longer.
I'm still waiting for that new sub $30,000 electric car that gets more than 200 miles of range and doesn't look like a shitbox. I guess that I will need to wait awhile longer.
CHEVY BOLT. you can find one slightly used easily under 30k, and new when the 2020 comes out with the larger battery and they still have a few 2019s on the lot.
rode in one last week for a lyft. seems like a good small car. the driver loves it, he makes way more on the trips than other drivers. he said he paid 75 bucks for the previous months electricity, just charging at home and drove over 2000 miles.
There's unconfirmed report the new prototype Tesla Model S Plaid edition was 20 seconds faster than Porsche Taycan around Nürburgring.
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de...enzeit-elektroauto/?shop_return=1568712509272
Tesla is scheduled for their first reserved track time tomorrow so we might know for sure after tomorrow's run. But if the Plaid numbers are true, I expect the Raven Model S to come close or beat Taycan's track time as well. I'm glad Tesla is doing this so they can finally end the FUD about Tesla cars can only go fast in straight line and can't sustain performance on the race track. Model 3 Performance should've proved the naysayers wrong but so many people want to see Tesla fail, they're blind or don't want to believe. Model S was designed as highway cruiser built for the American roads. Now with Raven and Plaid, Tesla will prove Model S can also be tracked and keep up or beat the very best, ICE or BV.
I agree Model S wasn't built with racing in mind. When Tesla released the Model S in 2012, it was designed to be comfortable highway cruiser for the American roads. Tesla was focused on battery range and motor efficiency. You can see how good the 2012 Model S design was considering cars released today by other automakers are struggling to match 2012 Model S performance and range. Porsche took and studied the Model S and used 2015 Model S as the baseline car to beat. Porsche knew they couldn't beat Tesla in battery range efficiency so they tried to match or beat Tesla in everything else and focused on racing where they had more experience and Model S only major weak point. So Porsche built Taycan with racing in mind to beat Tesla. And Porsche did a good job with Taycan minus the price and range. But it's foolish to think Tesla couldn't design fast race car if they wanted to. Tesla lead in EV is unmatched. All these "Tesla killers" coming out now are just confirming what Tesla fans already knew. Tesla has 3-5 years technology lead on everyone. So while Porsche may tout Taycan fast Nürburgring time, Tesla was prepared for Taycan's arrival. Tesla knows better than Porsche the weak points of the Model S. It's why they updated the Model S to Raven motor and cooling in May and Tesla brought Model S Plaid to Nürburgring. The Model S Plaid is actually 2017 Model S buyback lemon car Tesla have been doing testing and development work on. It's 7 seats passenger car. So the Plaid edition is not something Elon and Tesla just dreamed up last week. Tesla have been working on Plaid and was just waiting for Porsche to unveil the Taycan so they could show it off to the world.No, that's not it. Model S and earlier just weren't built with racing in mind. They are only fast at straight line because they were only given HPs and Torques, which is only part of the battle. From what I've read, the chassis have never been stiff and I don't recall them having all the current expected bits of real performance vehicles, like locked differentials and such.
If people make those comments, it's because the cars weren't designed to compete in those scenarios, and there is just no way around that. Now, if that's what they're doing with Raven and Plaid, it's a different ballgame (article suggests the P100D sent to test may have stiffened anti-roll bar, among other things--but not that it does. So, not sure). The performance models are certainly bonkers off the line, so it's really just a matter of putting together an actual performance chassis and drivetrain that can handle the beatdown that extended track runs will do.
Fast in the corners > fast in a line on the Nurburgring. Torque isn't good for anything if the chassis can't keep you on line there and instead sends you into a concrete wall.