3900x x570 ATX

[mundane]

(Original post has largely been superseded by the discussion below Comment 9)


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Hi All,

I'm trying to assemble a build around the following requirements:
* 3900x
* 32 GB RAM
* Small(ish) footprint (home office)
* $1200 - $1500

It's primarily to run some simulation software - very CPU demanding, but there are some synthetic video requirements. I was starting with the 3600x, but if I am going to the trouble to assemble this, I might as well make it worthwhile.

I came up with the following, but I'm a bit lost w.r.t. whether I'll need additional cooling, or whether I can get better bang-for-the-buck with an improved GPU, etc. I believe I could go with an older motherboard (risking BIOS compatibility, lower DRAM speed), but I'd like something I can reuse in the future.

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/s74B8Y
AMD - Ryzen 9 3900X 3.8 GHz 12-Core Processor
ASRock - X570M Pro4 Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard
G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory
Samsung - 970 Evo 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive
MSI - Radeon RX 580 8 GB ARMOR OC Video Card
NZXT - H400i MicroATX Mini Tower Case
EVGA - SuperNOVA G3 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply

Where should I be paying more attention? I've pasted in my answers to the standard Blane Build Questions below.

I also looked at the ASRock A300 as a sort of NUC approach, but the 3400G isn't going to be adequate.

Thanks in advance!

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1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.
For at least the next half year or so, running some heavily threaded simulation software (Ubuntu). When my current desktop starts to show age I'd like the opportunity to repurpose this host for my workstation, probably by putting in a new GPU.

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread
$1200-$1500.

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.
US.

4. IF you're buying parts OUTSIDE the US, please post a link to the vendor you'll be buying from.
We can't be expected to scour the internet on your behalf, chasing down deals in your specific country... Again, help us, help YOU.

5. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.
Going in position is a small(ish?) footprint 3900x.

6. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.
No

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
Default

8. What resolution, not monitor size, will you be using?
Mostly headless at this time.

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
I'd love to start tomorrow, but realistically, within the next month or so.

10. Do you need to purchase any software to go with the system, such as Windows or Blu Ray playback software?
No.

 

[Flayed]

The Vega gpu's are much better at compute if that is part of your simulation software

 

[DrMrLordX]

@mundane

@Flayed makes a good point, you might get more GPGPU performance stepping up to a Vega product. Not sure how the extra dGPU heat in your small case will work out for you though. Is GPGPU an issue for you?

Another thing to think about is case airflow. 3900x + stock cooler + tiny case = possible heat nightmare. You can sort-of overcome that by using an AiO since you're going to be setting it up to either blow into or out of the case. You can front-mount a 280mm rad. Matisse likes to be kept cool in general. Not sure if your budget allows for one though. With your current config, I'm thinking not. If the case ships with decent 140mm intake fans then you should not be in too much trouble. Otherwise you will have to get some of your own.

Yet another thing to think about is VRM airflow. The stock cooler provides some. Switch to an AiO or to any HSF that isn't top-down and you lose that.

edit: if you want some better cooling AND you make sure you have some good case intake fans then consider this HSF:

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/Y27CmG/be-quiet-cpu-cooler-bk020

It should outperform the Wraith Prism and buy you a little extra boost headroom while still moving air over the board around the socket.

As far as motherboard re-usability is concerned, we don't know if AM4 is at the end of the line or not. Zen3 is a mystery. You don't really "need" x570 since it doesn't look like you're overclocking and you aren't using any PCIe 4.0 devices . . . I just can't promise you that UEFI support on older boards will be 100% to your liking. You may lose RAM speed for awhile (or forever), or you may run into other odd quirks. It seems to vary from OEM to OEM, and even from board to board. If you were looking at ATX, I could recommend something like X470 Taichi with some confidence, but mATX cuts down on your options and cuts down on the likelihood of OEMs providing future support. They pay the most attention to former halo products and/or former high-volume products . . . usually.

 

[mundane]

Thank you for the inputs, @Flayed and @DrMrLordX.

The current simulation environment is very CPU intensive, and won't take advantage of GPUs. Having said that, I wouldn't want to box myself out room for additional (or appropriate) GPU(s) in the future if projects required those.

If I give up on Micro ATX, does it makes this problem tractable? I have to read up on AiO - back when I started building PCs, anything beyond air cooling was the realm of dedicated enthusiasts, and I had assumed it still was.

 

[DrMrLordX]

The current simulation environment is very CPU intensive, and won't take advantage of GPUs. Having said that, I wouldn't want to box myself out room for additional (or appropriate) GPU(s) in the future if projects required those.

Okay, Vega might not offer you too much then. At least not today anyway. A 580 is cheap enough that you can replace it later if/when funds become available.

If I give up on Micro ATX, does it makes this problem tractable?

Depends. ATX cases can be a). cheaper and b). have tons of airflow. They can also be heavy, gaudy, and obstructive. People pay top dollar for well-laid-out mATX cases for a reason. It's really a matter of what you find tolerable.

Theoretically-speaking, you could get a cheaper ATX case and a potentially-cheaper ATX X470 motherboard, and get better airflow to boot. Whether or not you will like the end result is a different matter entirely. More airflow often means more noise. And it could be bigger and heavier.

For example, you could run this motherboard:

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/NGbwrH/asrock-x470-taichi-atx-am4-motherboard-x470-taichi

which is cheaper than the mATX x570 board you wanted (and is in stock!), and then pick a case that you like that might come in at less than the $160+ for that H400i. You could then spend the difference on a better cooler, pocket the difference, or do something else entirely. A possible case recommendation:

https://www.newegg.com/matte-black-nzxt-h700-atx-mid-tower/p/N82E16811146308?Description=nzxt h700&cm_re=nzxt_h700-_-11-146-308-_-Product

Also from NZXT. Tons of airflow options, tons of radiator options (if you want to go AiO), etc. But again . . . bigger, heavier. Also on sale right now.

I have to read up on AiO - back when I started building PCs, anything beyond air cooling was the realm of dedicated enthusiasts, and I had assumed it still was.

AiO (all-in-one) units are "closed-loop coolers" (CLCs). They are easy to install and operate. No muss, no fuss. If you have a defective unit, it might leak . . . but that is rare. In my opinion, 280mm AiOs offer the best bang/buck. 360mm and larger AiOs have never significantly outperformed 280mm units in my opinion. Usually due to weak pumps not being enough to accommodate the larger rads. They are a bit expensive.

edit: also, before you try ordering any non-x570 motherboard, make sure the vendor is shipping you a board with the latest UEFI. Ask them, call them, get them in chat, whatever you have to do.

 

[Flayed]

The H400i isn't so bad for cooling is it? If you tricked it out with high performance fans it would be pretty good I reckon.

 

[DrMrLordX]

The H400i isn't so bad for cooling is it? If you tricked it out with high performance fans it would be pretty good I reckon.

It would be decent. It has is 2 intake fan slots and three exhaust. Compare to the H700, which has 4 exhaust and 3 intake. It ships with 4 fans (H400i ships with 3) and costs less than the H400i. It also allows you to use an ATX motherboard, like the X470 Taichi (which, admittedly, has terrible UEFI support right now, but then the ASRock x570 mATX board is completely unavailable at the moment sooooo yeah gj ASRock).

 

[mundane]

Thank you. I'll take a closer look at thermal considerations (especially case size, number of fans slot, and air flow) and watch the other Ryzen threads on this board.I really think an AiO would be neat, and I will make sure to check with a vendor about firmware support if I purchase an older chipset MB.

 

[mundane]

Given the feedback here, I've pivoted to a larger budget, larger form factor, and [hopefully] better thermal management.
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.8 GHz 12-Core Processor
Corsair H100i PRO 75 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler
ASRock X570 Taichi ATX AM4 Motherboard
Corsair Vengeance LPX 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory
Samsung 970 Evo 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive
Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 8 GB Video Card
NZXT H700 ATX Mid Tower Case
EVGA SuperNOVA G3 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply

Any criticisms are welcome. Otherwise, I'll eventually spot a 3900x in stock and begin the process.

Thanks.

 

[ubern00b]

You could go with a B450 board and save $100, any board that's rated at 105w which is pretty much most of them will run your 3900x at default settings with 0 issues (if you care there is a well known reddit document that lists the VRM's of most of the different vendors in details and ranks them accordingly) Why a radeon 5700 GPU? when you specified you don't need much GPU/compute power to begin with, when you replace your current workstation then look at the current price of GPU's. You could throw a RX 570 in there for $100 and call it a day, that's another $250, the upgraded cooling is fine and everything else though.

 

[Flayed]

Looks pretty decent to me.

 

[DrMrLordX]

You could go with a B450 board and save $100

He might actually lose some boost headroom on B450 unless it has amazing VRMs. Also, some users are having issues with proper UEFI support on older chipsets. Not that x570 is perfect.

Seeing at least one 3900x on B350 throttle to 3.7 GHz while running Prime95 small FFTs was an eye-opener. Might have been the undersized cooler, might have been the VRMs, but . . . either way, not good. 3900x shouldn't run that slow in an AVX2 workload.

 

[mundane]

Thanks.

re: board, on recommendation I explicitly chatted w/ Newegg service about firmware for the Ryzen 3xxx series on an x470 board (Taichi). They couldn't offer me any assurances and told me to contact the manufacturer. I don't have a spare older processor to install firmware updates, and want to avoid the hassle of a loaner.

re: GPU, good point. I'm probably getting ahead of myself.

 

[mundane]

Thanks for the inputs. Found the CPU in stock, have ordered it and the above with some slight modifications (drop down from the 5700, slightly different PSU).