Meh 970, 1070, 3070 were big successes, with demand so high it was next to impossible to get them at launch. Are you predicting that with the 4070 too?
The only good thing about that card is it's power efficiency. Everything else is just a pure scam, especially pricing. You can get a 6950XT for slightly more or a 6800XT for even less than the 4070 MSRP. Even RDNA2 is a better choice than the 4070 - at least as long as it stays above like $450. That's where this GPU does belong at best.
12GB are a joke and that will cause problems in the future. Hell that's the case already as of today (see one of the latest HWUB videos).
The only good thing about that card is it's power efficiency. Everything else is just a pure scam, especially pricing. You can get a 6950XT for slightly more or a 6800XT for even less than the 4070 MSRP. Even RDNA2 is a better choice than the 4070 - at least as long as it stays above like $450. That's where this GPU does belong at best.
You think this tread calling the 4070 a reasonable card that nobody gets excited about is good for laughs?!This forums opinions are always good for laughs.
Again forum declares, another total NVida failure, that back in the real world will be a big success.
A little different now that the gains in price to performance are tiny when 970, 1070, and even 3070 were enormous gains. Though at least this one has sufficient VRAM to be ok for 1440p for a while as long as you don't crank up RT.A little different right now as PC sales have crashed as we navigate high inflation and massive interest rate hikes aimed at taming that inflation. Plus worries that inflation battle will lead to recession. It's significant damper on a lot of discretionary spending.
So probably not crushing demand like some previous releases, but still a large success that will quickly rise up the Steam HW survey, and it will probably kill 6800XT sales.
So some really good 6800 XT prices might be coming for value buyers.
If I had to choose today between the 4070 and 6800XT, the lower power consumption of the 4070 would carry a lot of weight. If I'm fine with not having RT on 6800XT then I'm fine with not having RT on 4070 either if that means compensating for the lower VRAM buffer.I am big fan of the 6800 series from AMD but they are “old” even if they will likely age better. AMD just needs to refresh asap.
What a joke, the 4070 is weaker than the 3080 10GB. Techpowerup has the 3080 10GB ahead 5% at 4k vs the 4070.
It is a good thing the 70 class are 1440p cards then.
Pretty much the way I look at it.Which makes them tomorrows 1080p cards, which is a might bit silly at $600 even in 2023.
The implication being that 4K results today are more indicative of performance in a couple of years than current games usually predict.
I'm going to guess most people will only play couple of hours a day at the most, so higher power consumption on 6800XT at load is not much of an issue. Honestly, I have serious doubts about 12GB longevity, as such I'd go with 6800XT.If I had to choose today between the 4070 and 6800XT, the lower power consumption of the 4070 would carry a lot of weight. If I'm fine with not having RT on 6800XT then I'm fine with not having RT on 4070 either if that means compensating for the lower VRAM buffer.
Ehhh, I wouldn't trust Steam hardware numbers as evidence that 12 GB is now the magic number. If I'm not mistaken, internet cafes can show up on that chart, which if true means that RTX 3060 spike in popularity doesn't correlate with consumer tastes.To follow up my other post: We know 12GB is the magic number for Nvidia shoppers. The 3060 rocketing to number one on Steam demonstrated that. The card has good performance per watt. It brings support for the new software features. It is the only current generation GPU at the price point. This is positioned to be the new GTX 970 IMO.
Valid criticisms aren't going to change anything as I see it. This is another example of Nvidia understanding the market and the customers. I would welcome being wrong.
I have my own issues with the survey. Anecdotally, it hasn't ask me to submit it on an AMD build in the last 8 or more tries. On Nvidia builds I am now 2 for 3. As I have joked before, it's enough to put on my tinfoil hat.Ehhh, I wouldn't trust Steam hardware numbers as evidence that 12 GB is now the magic number. If I'm not mistaken, internet cafes can show up on that chart, which if true means that RTX 3060 spike in popularity doesn't correlate with consumer tastes.
Personally, I would say that 12 GB is the absolute minimum if you want to buy a graphics card today, with the assumption that it's good for 3 years max. 16 GB should last at least 3 years, and 20 GB+ will last the realistic lifetime of the card.
I don't see that at all. People were falling all over themselves to buy the 970, and rightfully so as it was a really nice card for $330 even with the half a GB of gimped VRAM we didn't learn about until ~6 months later. And it came with Far Cry 4 either at launch or only a couple of months later. I don't see anyone very excited about the 4070. I think it would take 4070 Ti for sub $500 today to generate the kind of excitement the 970 did in PC gamers in 2014.To follow up my other post: We know 12GB is the magic number for Nvidia shoppers. The 3060 rocketing to number one on Steam demonstrated that. The card has good performance per watt. It brings support for the new software features. It is the only current generation GPU at the price point. This is positioned to be the new GTX 970 IMO.
Valid criticisms aren't going to change anything as I see it. This is another example of Nvidia understanding the market and the customers. I would welcome being wrong.
Ain't about excitement. Again, only time will tell. I am going with current market conditions which only exist because of 2yrs of absolute madness. The information level and proclivities of the average GPU shopper. And the features that are shoved down their throats, or those of whomever is advising them on their purchase. DLSS, ray tracing, frame generation, broadcast, NVENC, etc. For me, it all adds up to Nvidia doing the market research and executing on the timing the way they have for a long time now. No matter what smack everyone talks, the cards sell. I never seen more push back from gamers than the 20 series, it still sold great, and crushed AMD sales yeah?I don't see that at all. People were falling all over themselves to buy the 970, and rightfully so as it was a really nice card for $330 even with the half a GB of gimped VRAM we didn't learn about until ~6 months later. And it came with Far Cry 4 either at launch or only a couple of months later. I don't see anyone very excited about the 4070. I think it would take 4070 Ti for sub $500 today to generate the kind of excitement the 970 did in PC gamers in 2014.
Yeah, that's why Steam HW survey is hit or miss.I have my own issues with the survey. Anecdotally, it hasn't ask me to submit it on an AMD build in the last 8 or more tries. On Nvidia builds I am now 2 for 3. As I have joked before, it's enough to put on my tinfoil hat.
Most of us agree what VRAM requirements will be moving forward. It doesn't matter. This 12GB model will be the new hotness IMO. Only time will tell, but unless gamers suddenly became more discriminating in their purchasing habits...
Crushing AMD is different from selling great though. I remember the 970 being hard to find for like three months after launch and they were still wildly popular until the 1070 announcement. 4070 at $600 (or if that's a fake MSRP and AIB 4070 are really $650) is going to be a hard sell and isn't going to motivate people to upgrade if they're not on really outdated cards already.Ain't about excitement. Again, only time will tell. I am going with current market conditions which only exist because of 2yrs of absolute madness. The information level and proclivities of the average GPU shopper. And the features that are shoved down their throats, or those of whomever is advising them on their purchase. DLSS, ray tracing, frame generation, broadcast, NVENC, etc. For me, it all adds up to Nvidia doing the market research and executing on the timing the way they have for a long time now. No matter what smack everyone talks, the cards sell. I never seen more push back from gamers than the 20 series, it still sold great, and crushed AMD sales yeah?
When there are 2 vendors and one is getting 3 of 4 sales or more, the rest is semantics. If the market contracts you are still making most of the money to be made. If it expands, you proft far more than your competitor does. I am not interested in manipulating statistics to say what I want, or any of that jazz. I am simply prognosticating based on precedence, and consumer behavior, that the 4070 is going to be the sweet spot this gen. I have you on record as disagreeing. Like I said, I'll be happy to be wrong, Time will tell.Crushing AMD is different from selling great though.
Precisely. They do the market research. They have an effective strategy. Most importantly they have indoctrinated a large segment of PC gamers already. Winning the information war has paid big dividends for them. Unless gamers punish them for charging the "Nvidia tax" and planned obsolescence, the vicious cycle will continue.Yeah, that's why Steam HW survey is hit or miss.
Regarding VRAM demands moving forward, I can't help but think that this will be leveraged by Nvidia when they release Blackwell, a la another "My [insert 2 generation old Nvidia architecture] friends, it is safe to upgrade now." Nvidia are so good at giving their consumers just enough to entice them to upgrade, yet leaving plenty of margin for themselves in the short and long term via planned obsolescence.
Again forum declares, another total NVida failure, that back in the real world will be a big success.