48÷2(9+3) =

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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,031
29,917
146
I watched today the game show 1 against 100 aired in my home country (for the reasons below, I'm ashamed of naming it).
The first qualifying question was: what is 1/2 divided by 1/2. The choices were:
A) 1
B) 1/2
C) 1/4

I know that I'm no average person when it comes to math, but I was shocked that 38 out of 100 people answered incorrectly. Sure they had only 6s to answer, but this is like elementary school math, about 5th grade if that. And these aren't stupid people, most of them compete at multiple game shows in my country and know a lot of s*it, like way more people knew what plant Monet liked to paint ffs... 48/2(9+3) is like renormalizing the Standard Model for them.

so...the answer is C, right?

:hmm:
 

M0RPH

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,305
1
0
48÷2(9+3) = X ....... solve for X.

24(9+3) = X
24*9 + 24*3 = X
216+72= X
288 = X

Not sure how it's not clear enough......

You may have gotten the correct answer but the way you did it is WRONG. Anything inside brackets always comes first, therefore your first step should have been:

48 ÷ 2(12)
 

Juddog

Diamond Member
Dec 11, 2006
7,852
6
81
You may have gotten the correct answer but the way you did it is WRONG. Anything inside brackets always comes first, therefore your first step should have been:

48 ÷ 2(12)

48 ÷ 2 x 12.
48 ÷ 2 = 24
24 x 12 = 288
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,441
9,666
146
Wow. This actually the first time I've looked into this thread. It seemed pretty damn clear to me that the answer was 288, so imagine my surprise when I clicked on the poll results and saw that the obviously (to me) wrong answer was ahead, and that 338 OT'ers had voted for it.

There's one ton of intellectual fail on OT, the logic fail in argument is legion, but I would have thought that, collectively, basic math was in the OT demographic's wheelhouse.

OT's English language fail, I more or less understand. I've developed a lot more sympathy for it than I previously had.

The way you were raised and the way you (weren't) taught, I get it. English can be tough if you don't read much and aren't taught proper grammar when young. And in our "close enough, Do0d" culture so many of you just aren't motivated to learn.

But . . . basic math? D:

I then kinda skimmed some of the first page and most of the last page. My head assplodes at the contention that many "math experts" say the answer is 2. I suspect misattribution, but I don't have the energy to prove this, so I'll just amend the quote below to include matlab and leave it at that:

Google: 288
Wolfram Alpha: 288
Excel: 288
[Also matlab]

/thread

I can only conclude that THIS is why so many of you are up shit's creek without a paddle as regards the English language -- you depend on your peers for guidance and, as proved here, your peers are largely fucked in the head, Ted. :'(







Coda: I also saw while skimming that some posters whom I know not to be dummies or trolls were passionately defending 2 as the correct answer, so I suspect (hope?) that there are parts of this controversy which have eluded my cursory investigation. It's just that the way I was taught, 288 is unambiguously the right answer. <shrug>
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,441
9,666
146
Coda: I also saw while skimming that some posters whom I know not to be dummies or trolls were passionately defending 2 as the correct answer, so I suspect (hope?) that there are parts of this controversy which have eluded my cursory investigation. It's just that the way I was taught, 288 is unambiguously the right answer. <shrug>

Lol, this thread is fascinating in a "stupid human tricks" kind of way. I'm now through the first 3 pages (@100 posts per), plus page 7, and I'd like to amend my initial impression that some posters' claims (I'm looking at you Locut0s ) that "many math majors and math professors" went for 2 as the answer is actually correct.

Not true. Only NuclearNed and spidey's wife (no comment, I'm being nice) have so far had their "credentialed" heads that far up their ass, and Nuke has been thorougly schooled by numerous other posters.

My faith in my fellow man is semi-restored. The 340 OT idiots who voted for '2' are just that . . . idiots.

I'd like to add these post quotes:

And I can assure you that the TI-89, mathematica, matlab, maple, and every other up to date mathematics software or calculator or device agrees with this. [288]

THE ULTIMATE CALCULATOR PIC.

I believe I have a TI-83 Plus and a TI-86 somewhere also. I like how I have two TI-89s. This is ridiculous.





 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
Again it's usually comp sci people / programmers and the like who deal with order of operation on a day in and day out basis. Even if you study math for a living you could easily mess that up.

I think being a developer and doing if-statements with logical operators on a daily basis saved me from being quite embarrassed and giving the wrong answer. Phew.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,441
9,666
146
Ok, basically add Matthisa and DrPizza to the "it's ambiguous and could be 2" group. I'm still not buying it.

Lol, I might be on shaky ground going up against anyone with "Math" right in his user name, and I would readily concede that the esteemed Doctor is, in general, 1000 times the mathelete that I am or ever was, but, HEY DOC! RESPOND TO THESE:

The problem is because you're using variables, and 2x is accepted as a term 2x. No one has to write it as (2x).

When you start writing the original problem as is, you treat 2(9+3) as 2*(9+3). This is independent of the division that's present. Even with the division, the lack of sufficient parenthesis implies that you convert 2(9+3) into 2*(9+3).

If you wanted to be cool with implied multiplication YET wanted to make sure that the whole term went under the fraction, you would've written it 48÷(2(9+3)). But since it's not, 288 is clearly correct.

You're using 2x, 3x, 5x^2 or whatever as examples, but it's clear that we treat them as one term. 2x. 3x. 5x^2.

Do you treat 2(9+3) as one whole term? It's more like (x+1)(x+2) than it is x^2.

The other thing about x^2 is it's an implied (x*x). 1/x^2 is not 1/x*x. It's
1/(x*x). I'd interpret 1/x*x as 1 and not 1/x^2

More pithily:

This is not comparable because 4x² and 2x are functions. Dividing a function by another function would yield a new function, NOT a finite value.

f(x)/g(x) = f/g(x)

<-------------- Runs and hides. Though he did quite well in math on his SAT's, has never had a math class above HS calculus, which I somehow got a A in even while still employing my standard HS method of not doing homework and just cramming before each exam. Calc was BY FAR the hardest HS subject to do this for. I'm still amazed my approach worked. It almost literally hurt my head, and I promptly forgot EVERYTHING!

As for Matthisa, I have seen you try to overgeneralize from ONE failed calculator (TI85), even after TI's own bulletin explaining their FAILURE was posted, plus many references to the rarified math circles in which you circulate.

Ok, how 'bout posting links with quotes from recognized and credentialed math mavens on this crucial, crucial subject.
 

tokie

Golden Member
Jun 1, 2006
1,491
0
0
HAHAHAHAH. This thread is amazing, how did I miss it.

I don't understand the people who say B-E-DM-AS. It is B-E-D-M-A-S.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,441
9,666
146
I think being a developer and doing if-statements with logical operators on a daily basis saved me from being quite embarrassed and giving the wrong answer. Phew.

For me, it was just having a good 9th grade algebra teacher many, many moons ago. That's all, that's it.

Her name was Wilma Sunflower Flaig. She was a full blooded Indian, and built like a brick shit-house, to boot. She was tough, but fair. She loved me because, you know, I was really, really smart.

How tough was she? These were the days of corporeal punishment, when parents sided with the damn teacher in any dispute. I saw teachers take down kids and pin them to the ground, challenge some to fights, choke the living shit out of some.

Once, a girl said something like "Fuck you" to Mr. Pentimall. He started THROWING her down the long hallway to the Principal's office. With one throw, he threw her into me and I went down like a bowling pin. As he went by, inflamed but without breaking stride, he grabbed me by the back with one hand and deposited me upright, saying, "Sorry Dave" as he swept by, continuing to throw that girl further down the hall.

Nobody said anything like that to a teacher and got away with it.

And he was FAR from the toughest hard ass teacher in our school.

Well, in this school full of, well, "old school" teachers, it was Wilma Flaig's room that got the new desks, the only one.

All the other rooms had these decade old wooden desks that had been carved into numerous times. Hers were pristine and stayed that way! And she never came CLOSE to having to hit someone or even threaten to -- she ruled naturally through discipline and RESPECT.

On the very first day, she knew EVERY STUDENTS NAME in each class. She could also read your papers on your desk upside down. She was AWESOME.

I found out years later that she lived on a old, broken-down farm property THAT DIDN'T HAVE RUNNING WATER OR CENTRAL HEAT, alone.

Mine was in many ways an undistinguished, public school education, but it was a solid one, due to the good teachers I was privileged to have. :thumbsup:
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally

Parenthesis
Exponents
Multiplication
Division
Addition
Subtraction

Answer = 2
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,441
9,666
146
Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally

Parenthesis
Exponents
Multiplication
Division
Addition
Subtraction

Answer = 2

You should really read through the thread to see and understand just how wrong you are, and why.
 

SparkyJJO

Lifer
May 16, 2002
13,357
7
81
Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally

Parenthesis
Exponents
Multiplication
Division
Addition
Subtraction

Answer = 2

P E M D A S is to remember the main order, but M and D are a pair with priority given by reading left to right, and same goes with A and S.

So:

48 / 2 * 12 = 24 * 12 = 288

I'll admit at first glance and thinking of PEMDAS I came up with 2, then realized my mistake /facepalm
 

SSSnail

Lifer
Nov 29, 2006
17,461
82
86
Except that multiplications and divisions have the same precedence. The stupid acronym was made up so that stupid kids would remember, apparently they failed to remember that division and multiplication are calculated in order of appearance.
 
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