6950 flashed to 6970

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apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Can you test the 6950 oc'ed versus the 6950 flashed????
We really need empirical data in this comparison given the flashing rage.

Need to know how much faster is a flashed 6950 over an oc'd 6950.
Can a flashed 6950 be then oc'd and if so by how much.
All vital data that nobody has bother to test.

i can answer most of your questions now.

A HD 6950 flashed into a HD 6970 *is* a HD 6970 .. it is identical in every way except for the "7", the 8-pin PCIe connector and sometimes slower vRAM.

An overclocked HD 6950 will be same as comparing it to a "true" HD 6970.
- the only thing you are doing is putting a higher voltage through your card and perhaps the new flashed card will not be able to use PowerTune as effectively as a HD 6970 that came out of the factory.
- it also depends which BIOS you use; ASUS uses higher voltage and clocks, i believe - you can have real issues with your card if you have the slower DDR5 intended for the HD 6950.

ALSO .. if you brick your card because of the higher voltage - or for any reason - forget about asking for warranty service. You cannot flash a dead card back to HD 6950 .. so beware!!
^_^
 

bargetrav

Banned
Apr 2, 2009
195
0
0
i can answer most of your questions now.

A HD 6950 flashed into a HD 6970 *is* a HD 6970 .. it is identical in every way except for the "7", the 8-pin PCIe connector and sometimes slower vRAM.

An overclocked HD 6950 will be same as comparing it to a "true" HD 6970.
- the only thing you are doing is putting a higher voltage through your card and perhaps the new flashed card will not be able to use PowerTune as effectively as a HD 6970 that came out of the factory.
- it also depends which BIOS you use; ASUS uses higher voltage and clocks, i believe - you can have real issues with your card if you have the slower DDR5 intended for the HD 6950.

ALSO .. if you brick your card because of the higher voltage - or for any reason - forget about asking for warranty service. You cannot flash a dead card back to HD 6950 .. so beware!!
^_^


Well, you CAN'T brick it due to bios problems, it's got dual bios. Even if it just fried and shit the bed they wouldn't be able to tell what bios was on it and still warranty it for you, ethical or not, it would work.
 

evolucion8

Platinum Member
Jun 17, 2005
2,867
3
81
I think that the biggest difference between the HD 6970 and HD 6950 unlocked would be its overclocking potential due to power constraints or the fact that better chips are used for the HD 6970.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Well, you CAN'T brick it due to bios problems, it's got dual bios. Even if it just fried and shit the bed they wouldn't be able to tell what bios was on it and still warranty it for you, ethical or not, it would work.

Don't fool yourself. If you brick one of these upgraded cards for any reason, forget warranty service.

The first thing a vendor is going to do when you send it back is to flip the switch and check the BIOSes; if you have HD 6970 on a HD 6950 card, your RMA will be denied.
^_^
 

Matrices

Golden Member
Aug 9, 2003
1,377
0
0
How are they going to "check BIOS" if the card won't even turn on?

Anyway, what's the story with the Powertuner program and the power limits? Is this some restriction that limits OC by placing a hard limit on TDP? Will it be removed by Afterburner or something similar down the line?
 

Mistwalker

Senior member
Feb 9, 2007
343
0
71
Went ahead and flashed my cards, now running 6970 Crossfire!

The only thing that might bother me is idle temps went up 2-3 degrees Celsius, if higher temps end up meaning noisier cards at load will probably flip the switches back...but the fact that's even an option makes this an easy choice, seriously.
 
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bargetrav

Banned
Apr 2, 2009
195
0
0
Don't fool yourself. If you brick one of these upgraded cards for any reason, forget warranty service.

The first thing a vendor is going to do when you send it back is to flip the switch and check the BIOSes; if you have HD 6970 on a HD 6950 card, your RMA will be denied.
^_^

I'm not fooling anything.


Newflash : If they can flip and switch and reset the bios to factory, SO CAN I, THE CARD HAS A DUAL BIOS SETUP. If you flash the card, and it doens't take, aka "bricks". You flip the switch and it resets the card to factory settings! That is the entire reason this is catching on like fire, and you're missing that point entirely.

Second, if the card is truly stone dead, they would never be able to tell if it had a 6970 bios on it.
 

Alaska Wolf

Member
Dec 18, 2010
67
0
0
I'd be a little surprised to find the vendors or AMD dunning the buyers of these cards for being just the kind of enthusiast's their design and marketing was targeted to attract.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
I'm not fooling anything.


Newflash : If they can flip and switch and reset the bios to factory, SO CAN I, THE CARD HAS A DUAL BIOS SETUP. If you flash the card, and it doens't take, aka "bricks". You flip the switch and it resets the card to factory settings! That is the entire reason this is catching on like fire, and you're missing that point entirely.

Second, if the card is truly stone dead, they would never be able to tell if it had a 6970 bios on it.
Don't be silly. If a HD 6950 dies for ANY reason with a HD 6970 BIOS, you can't reset anything. It is dead. You can flip the switch, but so what?

However, the BIOS you flashed it to is still there for the vendor to check - dead or not, they certainly can tell. And they are not want to give you anything in return as a freebie if you intentionally void their warranty.

It's your card. i really don't care what happens to it. i got my HD 6970
and my HD 6950 directly from AMD as evaluation samples; it is expected that i torture test them. They are working together as HD 6970 Crossfire right now.
 
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Outrage

Senior member
Oct 9, 1999
217
1
0
Don't be silly. If a HD 6950 dies for ANY reason with a HD 6970 BIOS, you can't reset anything. It is dead. You can flip the switch, but so what?

However, the BIOS you flashed it to is still there for the vendor to check - dead or not, they certainly can tell. And they are not want to give you anything in return as a freebie if you intentionally void their warranty.

If the card is dead, how would the vendor be able to read the info from the bios ic ? if the card functions so they can read the bios, you should be able to flash it back, or do you expect the vendors to solder of the chip and put it in a working card? and do that with every rma they get back?
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
If the card is dead, how would the vendor be able to read the info from the bios ic ? if the card functions so they can read the bios, you should be able to flash it back, or do you expect the vendors to solder of the chip and put it in a working card? and do that with every rma they get back?
Are you really kidding? You don't know how it works?

The vendor's RMA techs put the cardss into a dock and they can read the card's functions and ID and everything including the BIOS information. They will track what is happening and why cards are failing. They don't just toss them into the bin and send you a brand new one because you are a customer.

Especially *expensive* new cards and cards that are known to be modified as AMD and every vendor knows by now. Unless their RMA department is sloppy as hell and you get lucky, you are going to be denied warranty.

It's not my worry. i get my cards from AMD directly.
()
 
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bargetrav

Banned
Apr 2, 2009
195
0
0
Are you really kidding? You don't know how it works?

The vendor's RMA techs put the cardss into a dock and they can read the card's functions and ID and everything including the BIOS information. They will track what is happening and why cards are failing. They don't just toss them into the bin and send you a brand new one because you are a customer.

Especially *expensive* new cards and cards that are known to be modified as AMD and every vendor knows by now. Unless their RMA department is sloppy as hell and you get lucky, you are going to be denied warranty.

It's not my worry. i get my cards from AMD directly.
()

If a card is FRIED, IE too much voltage, while anything is possible with enough effort, I'd sure like to see an instance of a warranty voided from that directly.


I have seen RMA departments in the IT world, If you think Sapphire/Asus,etc. has highly qualified tech's actually doing in depth analysys of every dead card they get back, you're DEAD wrong. These companies barely have any US based employees, their offices are tiny, and the RMA department probably consists of 3-4 people.


I do agree, this is to be done at your own risk, but I would definitely bet against them denying a warranty claim even with a 6970 bios on the card.
 

Spike

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2001
6,770
1
81
Dang it, I'm somewhat regretting getting a "regular" 6970 now. Sure, I like the not having to mod it but dang it, where is my sense of adventure!?!?! This is what I get for buying a card the first day it's released...
 

Mistwalker

Senior member
Feb 9, 2007
343
0
71
Flashing to 6970s went perfectly, Furmark stable with temps hitting 90/90 at 880/1375.

Still seemed excessive for my needs at 1920x1080, so instead flashed to my 6950 BIOS modified to unlock just the extra shaders (thus using the 6950 voltage settings, lowers potential overclock but should significantly lower temps and noise as well).

With the modified 6950 running at 840/1325 (max possible in CCC) the cards still manage to hit 87/86C in Furmark, with no noticeable difference in noise. As a 6970 idle temps were 2-3C higher, same 24% auto fan speed.

Think I'll stick with the 6950 + unlocked shaders for now, temp differences are minimal and honestly it's a fantastic 6970 runner...just don't need the extra speed/voltage.

Can always flash it back over in about two minutes, anyway. Hope everyone else has great success with this as well!
 

dangerman1337

Senior member
Sep 16, 2010
333
5
81
What's the conseneus on the chances of flashing, Is it likely that most (if not all) 6950s can be flashed into a 6970?
 

Draax

Junior Member
Dec 30, 2010
16
0
0
I purcased a 6950 yesterday and did this mod. Real simple and it worked fine on my new Sapphire at 880/1375.
 

ader098

Member
Mar 9, 2010
99
3
66
I've decided the the extra heat from 6970 bios unlock wasn't worth the performance gain
it provided considering I'm running crossfire and the cards already ran hot.
However, I did use the unlocked 6950 bios flash so now I have the full shaders of the 6970 with the lower voltage and normal memory timings of the 6950. Overclocking is limited compared to the 6970 bios but the decreased stress I put on the cards makes me feel a little bit better.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
What's the conseneus on the chances of flashing, Is it likely that most (if not all) 6950s can be flashed into a 6970?
Superb. HardOCP forum is keeping track of the flashes and it is overwhelmingly positive.

The issue with some of them appears to be if lesser DDR5 is used on the HD 6950 or the core is simply unable to get 880 MHz.

I've decided the the extra heat from 6970 bios unlock wasn't worth the performance gain
it provided considering I'm running crossfire and the cards already ran hot.
However, I did use the unlocked 6950 bios flash so now I have the full shaders of the 6970 with the lower voltage and normal memory timings of the 6950. Overclocking is limited compared to the 6970 bios but the decreased stress I put on the cards makes me feel a little bit better.
You can also underclock (one or both of) your HD 6970s a bit, or decrease the PowerTune settings. i am running HD 6970 CF now, my flash from HD 6950 > 6970 was successful (and i run the former HD 6950 in the top slot as it is likely to be hotter). i also have great side-case airflow in my Element G with a 240mm fan blowing on them so temps are not too bad; up to mid/upper-80s C for the hotter card in games.

Of course, now it sounds like i have an o/c'd reference GTX 480 in my case.
.. and i can turn my room heater down a notch.
 
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bryanW1995

Lifer
May 22, 2007
11,144
32
91
Well, you CAN'T brick it due to bios problems, it's got dual bios. Even if it just fried and shit the bed they wouldn't be able to tell what bios was on it and still warranty it for you, ethical or not, it would work.

Don't fool yourself. If you brick one of these upgraded cards for any reason, forget warranty service.

The first thing a vendor is going to do when you send it back is to flip the switch and check the BIOSes; if you have HD 6970 on a HD 6950 card, your RMA will be denied.
^_^

@bargetrav: it doesn't matter if you can get away with it or not, it is bad form and possibly even against tos to espouse that type of behavior on this forum. If you want to talk about crap like that go to toms. if you want to OC your merchandise be prepared to accept the consequences.

the only time it is ok to rma a card/cpu/etc that you knowingly oc'd is if the warrantly explicitly ok's this (evga AR cards for example). some of the older board partners even ok'd mods/etc, but most of the dx11 cards from ALL companies are not allowing modding/voltage tweaks/etc to be covered under warranty.

@apoppin: damn you for getting free cards!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ok, I feel better now.
 
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HurleyBird

Platinum Member
Apr 22, 2003
2,726
1,342
136
Success x2

Now running CF 6970's

However, whomever at AMD decided to discontinue the long CF bridges, and whomever decided to make these cards get no airflow when placed together (you thought GeforceFX sounded like a dustbuster? Haw! You should hear the racket 2 6970's make!) please die in a fire.
 

Elfear

Diamond Member
May 30, 2004
7,115
690
126
@bargetrav: it doesn't matter if you can get away with it or not, it is bad form and possibly even against tos to espouse that type of behavior on this forum. If you want to talk about crap like that go to toms. if you want to OC your merchandise be prepared to accept the consequences.

the only time it is ok to rma a card/cpu/etc that you knowingly oc'd is if the warrantly explicitly ok's this (evga AR cards for example). some of the older board partners even ok'd mods/etc, but most of the dx11 cards from ALL companies are not allowing modding/voltage tweaks/etc to be covered under warranty.

+1 for honesty

Success x2

Now running CF 6970's

However, whomever at AMD decided to discontinue the long CF bridges, and whomever decided to make these cards get no airflow when placed together (you thought GeforceFX sounded like a dustbuster? Haw! You should hear the racket 2 6970's make!

Agreed. Long connectors should be the standard with more and more motherboards coming out with three and four PCI-E slots. The 6900 series do not like sitting next to each other.
 
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shangshang

Senior member
May 17, 2008
830
0
0
@bargetrav: it doesn't matter if you can get away with it or not, it is bad form and possibly even against tos to espouse that type of behavior on this forum. If you want to talk about crap like that go to toms. if you want to OC your merchandise be prepared to accept the consequences.

the only time it is ok to rma a card/cpu/etc that you knowingly oc'd is if the warrantly explicitly ok's this (evga AR cards for example). some of the older board partners even ok'd mods/etc, but most of the dx11 cards from ALL companies are not allowing modding/voltage tweaks/etc to be covered under warranty.

@apoppin: damn you for getting free cards!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ok, I feel better now.

That's not how the real world works. Look around you, and name me one corporation who isn't out to fool you. If the tech industry wanted to prevent or discourage customer oc'ing their components, they can. They have many ways to do it. On a technical level, they can easily prevent this. On the retail level, they can put a big red warning label as well. But no. On the contrary, the industry itself play up to the notion of overclocking. They sell products with labels such as "superclocked" and "for the win" and charge you a premium for it. They take the consumers' own home brew hobby (over clocking) and decide to make an extra buck out of it. It works both way eh.

Remind me of the time when hacking Direct TV was the rage. Everyone was doing it. It always made a giggle when the moral cops would say something like "you shouldn't do this, it's illegal, it's dishonest",, yada yada. Eventually, the only thing that stopped the rage was when DTV changed the technology.

I'm not saying you or anyone in here is right or wrong because ethics and morality always depend on where you stand. But let me just say this, in this world, it is up to YOU to protect your interest.
 

HurleyBird

Platinum Member
Apr 22, 2003
2,726
1,342
136
First impressions of my HD '6970' crossfire

Fast. Really fast.
Loud. Really loud. (long CF bridge from Ebay can't get here soon enough!)
Despite what some say, aniso quality looks absolutely perfect to my eyes in the games I've tried. No noticeable noise or 'quality bands' like before. And I'm one of the guys who *immediately* saw a degradation in AF quality when I went from my old 8800GTS to a 5870.
 
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