$.75/gallon gas? Wait for it... /EDIT: COLLAPSE of global oil industry

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Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,897
12,365
126
www.anyf.ca
Wait, what?

What I hate about all this is it shows how gas prices is just a huge game, it has nothing to do with the actual cost of producing it but what the game players choose to set the prices to in order to play with the world economy. It's just a huge scam. We need to get off oil for energy, for the sake of the planet, and for sake of having a more stable and self reliant system for energy and economy.

It *IS* a game but never said I would refuse to play it. I would rather see oil go away completely other than being treated as a material mineral (plastic, rubber etc) but not like that is going to happen any time soon. The governments won't allow it.

But no, it's not really realistic for me to actually buy and store oil. Even if I had room to store vast amounts, the potential risk of a leak is not worth it. I don't even know if you can. When they talk about the price of a barrel I think that's practically like a stock, you can't actually go on some store and have them fill a bunch of tanks in the back of your pickup and get paid for it.
 

Miramonti

Lifer
Aug 26, 2000
28,651
100
91
Delivering in June is now down to under $17. June could be headed negative too.
It traded down to $11.78 and is now $14.40. Complete collapse of the oil markets on underway. This does not bode well for the world economy...nor world peace.
 

Miramonti

Lifer
Aug 26, 2000
28,651
100
91
I'm going to go out on a limb here and ask...can the collapse of the oil industry lead to a collapse of the global banking system? There is a whole lot more going on here than just cheap gas.
 

ponyo

Lifer
Feb 14, 2002
19,689
2,811
126
I'm going to go out on a limb here and ask...can the collapse of the oil industry lead to a collapse of the global banking system? There is a whole lot more going on here than just cheap gas.
From my limited reading and understanding, it looks like USO ETF is the main reason for the collapse as they're the one holding these short term WTI crude oil futures and getting killed unable to roll at decent price. Collapse of USO is not collapse of the oil industry. It's just collapse of poorly designed ETF.
 

Miramonti

Lifer
Aug 26, 2000
28,651
100
91
From my limited reading and understanding, it looks like USO ETF is the main reason for the collapse as they're the one holding these short term WTI crude oil futures and getting killed unable to roll at decent price. Collapse of USO is not collapse of the oil industry. It's just collapse of poorly designed ETF.
That would be nice but its deeper than that imo. June futures are at $15 now, and the ramifications if it stays here or goes lower are pretty extensive. It might become a very large domino.
 
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nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
58,537
12,844
136
I just hope all this along with the pandemic does not pave the way to UN's 2030 agenda. Read up on that, it's some scary shit.
The Sustainable Development Goals are:
  1. No Poverty
  2. Zero Hunger
  3. Good Health and Well-being
  4. Quality Education
  5. Gender Equality
  6. Clean Water and Sanitation
  7. Affordable and Clean Energy
  8. Decent Work and Economic Growth
  9. Industry, Innovation, and Infrastructure
  10. Reducing Inequality
  11. Sustainable Cities and Communities
  12. Responsible Consumption and Production
  13. Climate Action
  14. Life Below Water
  15. Life On Land
  16. Peace, Justice, and Strong Institutions
  17. Partnerships for the Goals
Oh my stars and garters, it sounds horrific
 

ponyo

Lifer
Feb 14, 2002
19,689
2,811
126
That would be nice but its deeper than that imo. June futures are at $15 now, and the ramifications if it stays here or goes lower are pretty extensive. Its going to be more than cheap gas, and might become a very large domino.
USO is holding June futures now. People are just frontrunning because they know USO has to roll those as well.
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,828
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Check the link

PA taxes are 2nd highest & prices here are around $1.97 (NW PA).
Typically we're about 15-20 cents above the national average here. Not sure what that is now.

Just to clarify here as well... that link doesn't seem to be accounting for local jurisdictions - only the state itself. Places like New York can be a huge PITA with local jurisdictions as well.

Also how complex the tax structure is can also have a direct effect on the price. Places like NY are notorious for having over 200 types of licenses that oil companies are required to have (and pay for) that a part of their tax compliance process. The tax returns themselves also aren't easy... That has a direct effect on the price you see at the pump.


I mean - just take a fucking look at this return from NY: https://www.tax.ny.gov/pdf/current_forms/st/ft945_1045.pdf

Tax returns in many states for motor fuels is as simple as a few lines such as:

1. Opening Inventory
2. Gallons Imported
3. Gallons Exported
4. Gallons Sold
5. Gallons sold to qualifying entities (e.g. government - non-taxed)
6. Closing Inventory
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,897
12,365
126
www.anyf.ca
Meanwhile with all this, gas is still at 80 cents per litre here. That's cheap sure, but it's still way higher than it should be given the price of crude.
 

Miramonti

Lifer
Aug 26, 2000
28,651
100
91
USO is holding June futures now. People are just frontrunning because they know USO has to roll those as well.
Brutal. I hope so, but seriously, who's going to short oil to $15, down $11 from Friday, $4 from yesterday, to front run, and to that scale? That's optimistic thinking imo. I think there are certainly concerns for getting stuck holding the bag for June now, after what happened to May.

Worlds Biggest Oil Storage Firm Says Almost All Space Sold
 
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Nov 8, 2012
20,828
4,777
146
Meanwhile with all this, gas is still at 80 cents per litre here. That's cheap sure, but it's still way higher than it should be given the price of crude.

Dude, we have been over this. Try putting crude oil into your car. Go for it. You're saying A = C cost, therefore B should = C cost as well.

The crude oil then has to be transported to a refinery.
Then it has to have the gasoline refined out (amount of gasoline varies by crude location by location)
Then they have to send it to a terminal for it to be distributed.
Then it's loaded on a truck
Then the truck takes it to a gas station where you fill up

I also mentioned other costs such as tax and tax compliance. Each of those companies I listed above have employees, accounting departments, etc..
 
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Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,897
12,365
126
www.anyf.ca
Dude, we have been over this. Try putting crude oil into your car. Go for it. You're saying A = C cost, therefore B should = C cost as well.

The crude oil then has to be transported to a refinery.
Then it has to have the gasoline refined out (amount of gasoline varies by
Then they have to send it to a terminal for it to be distributed.
Then it's loaded on a truck
Then the truck takes it to a gas station where you fill up

I also mentioned other costs such as tax and tax compliance. Each of those companies I listed above have employees, accounting departments, etc..

The thing is, it should still follow price of oil, and it does not really. It only follows it when the price of oil goes up. The oil is still a major part of the cost. and if all of this is based on lack of demand well guess what there is also lack of demand on gas right now.

Guarantee when price of oil goes back up to normal the gas prices will skyrocket higher than what they were when oil was already at that price. It always does that. It's all a big scam.
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,420
1,047
126
The thing is, it should still follow price of oil, and it does not. It only follows it when the price of oil goes up. The oil is still a major part of the cost.

all of those things are fixed costs, and the oil is a variable cost.


or every gas station has a dinosaur shaped cave full of oil under it. believe what you want.
 
Reactions: s0me0nesmind1

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
30,305
10,804
136
Crazy ... Unfortunately it would only help me if I actually had someplace to drive further then a couple miles.

Threw $5 gas in my Honda yesterday ... first time I bought any in 3 weeks and I anticipate it lasting quite awhile.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
57,653
7,882
126
I'm hoping I need small engine fuel before prices go up. I'd like to get at least two 5G cans. I have one empty can, and another that's 30% full, but all my tanks and mixing cans are topped up. Not like it matters that much, but it feels like getting one over one the system when you save a decent percentage on fuel. I usually have to pay ~30% more for my small engine fuel. Costs more due to higher octane, PA taxes, and the fuck you for not wanting corn in the gas.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
63,353
11,725
136
Crazy ... Unfortunately it would only help me if I actually had someplace to drive further then a couple miles.

Threw $5 gas in my Honda yesterday ... first time I bought any in 3 weeks and I anticipate it lasting quite awhile.
I filled up the F150 yesterday. $2.29/gallon, ~32 gallons, $72. Not wonderful...but around $1/gallon cheaper than last fall.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
I'm all for an economical renewable green energy source alternative, but as for commodities, they've been gamed since time began, and if it isn't oil, it will be something else (and often is.) The world economy didn't start it, it just brought it to scale.

Sunlight is a commodity that isn't gamed when people collect it themselves.
 
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