7700k + CM 212 + Prime95 = 90C :(

[imported_JohnJohn]

Thank you all for the pearls of wisdom some bossy than other The case was on sale and is a silent one so took a chance with it, sadly cant return it since it was a "On Sale" item.

Returning to the topic I have ordered 4 more 120mm fans to populate the case, lets see what added fans will give. Have also ordered GC Extreme, the mobo does not seem to overclock the 7700k its on stock and when all cores are loaded it reaches 4.4Ghz.

While gaming it does not reach the levels of Prime95 and mostly hovers around 70C. Also tested it with Ashes of Singularity there also around the 64-70c mark the cpu max goes.

 

[sm625]

I just bought an Asus z270 board and the first thing I did was try the auto-OC button. It set the CPU to 1.5v. (lol. They should call it the "fry my CPU" button, not the auto OC button.) I doubt yours is that high but it sounds like it must be up around 1.4v.

 

[Conroe]

I have that board, the 5.0 ghz profile works but just changes the auto setting to something else. CPUz shows 1.4v vcore, but if I set 1.35v it is stable. Default with BIOS 0801 is 4.5 ghz all cores locked ~1.2v. I'd have too set each turbo clock manually to get it to run stock. I have never ran it at stock.

the mobo does not seem to overclock the 7700k its on stock and when all cores are loaded it reaches 4.4Ghz

What your saying does not add up. None of the three BIOS for the 270G set it to lower than 4.5ghz, all cores locked.

 

[ozzy702]

OP, What is the vcore during P95 as measured by cpuz? What does the clockspeed say under P95?

 

[imported_JohnJohn]

Ok an update tried to get the CPU exchanged to a different batch but could not get them to agree. Intel warrenty is there but its a lengthy process, I also got a new metal brace for the 212 in post from France which has given the 212 even tighter fit and I got the best thermal paste in the local market Grizzly Kryonaut.

All this and still my temps were very high and with everything on stock "No OC manual or Auto". CPUz reported my vcore around 1.2v and which was close enough to my friends 1.186v so I did not bother much with it. After a long email session with ASUS people it turns out their board is to blame and CPUz is maybe reporting the wrong vcore. Not only is my 7700k a bad piece but the mobo is pushing extra voltage at stock for no reason!!

They told to manually set vcore to 1.185v and if needed play around with the LLC. At 1.19v with LLC at High things seem ok with temps around low- mid 80s on only Prime95 bench.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Wouldn't be the first time that a board pushed extra vcore.

 

[Pohemi]

Your temperature results are perfectly reasonable, as the CM 212 is a terrible HSF and always was a terrible HSF.

The people telling you it should be lower are the same people that don't properly stress test their CPUs to start with to make themselves feel better.

People should have stopped recommending the CM 212 after Ivy Bridge came out, but one simply cannot keep the viral marketing of the CM 212 down.

Return the worthless CM 212...

Sounds like you had a bad experience with a CM 212, like it stole your girlfriend and slapped you in the face or something. That's some pretty strong hate for something that still works for a lot of people. The 212 Evo and 212X are improvements on the original, and the 212X that I have is doing a fine job on my 7700K, keeping temps in mid to high 70's under Prime95. Just my 2 cents.

 

[imported_JohnJohn]

Sounds like you had a bad experience with a CM 212, like it stole your girlfriend and slapped you in the face or something. That's some pretty strong hate for something that still works for a lot of people. The 212 Evo and 212X are improvements on the original, and the 212X that I have is doing a fine job on my 7700K, keeping temps in mid to high 70's under Prime95. Just my 2 cents.

While I agree with you that the 212x is good since I had it before the new 212 LED that I have is certainly lighter and not as effective. Given the popularity of the 212 CM made compromises with the 212 LED to make extra bucks I would think.

Based on my experience with this there is certainly a reason to buy AIO liquid coolers like the H45 which are only a bit more in cost.

 

[crashtech]

All the versions of the CoolerMaster 212 are 4 heat pipe coolers with very similar radiating area. They are a good, cheap way to increase heat dissipation while going to a much quieter 120mm fan.The mope who was hating on the 212 ought to at least have suggested an alternative that was comparable in price, height, and was actually available!

I would suggest that if you are staying out of thermal throttling at your intended voltage and clockspeed using Prime95, you HSF is working as intended, and has enough safety margin to handle any real-life situation. There isn't much in the way of real-life loading that will get the CPU that hot.

 

[bononos]

......
All this and still my temps were very high and with everything on stock "No OC manual or Auto". CPUz reported my vcore around 1.2v and which was close enough to my friends 1.186v so I did not bother much with it. After a long email session with ASUS people it turns out their board is to blame and CPUz is maybe reporting the wrong vcore. Not only is my 7700k a bad piece but the mobo is pushing extra voltage at stock for no reason!!

They told to manually set vcore to 1.185v and if needed play around with the LLC. At 1.19v with LLC at High things seem ok with temps around low- mid 80s on only Prime95 bench.

That makes more sense. Prime95 is not considered to be a power virus and its a good real world stress test program for the cpu. Too bad on your cpu though.

 

[WhoBeDaPlaya]

We are talking about dissipating 90W (stock) or ~130W (OCed) of heat, which the "crappy" Hyper 212+ should be able to do (handles my old i7 920 just fine).

 

[wingman04]

Ok an update tried to get the CPU exchanged to a different batch but could not get them to agree. Intel warrenty is there but its a lengthy process, I also got a new metal brace for the 212 in post from France which has given the 212 even tighter fit and I got the best thermal paste in the local market Grizzly Kryonaut.

All this and still my temps were very high and with everything on stock "No OC manual or Auto". CPUz reported my vcore around 1.2v and which was close enough to my friends 1.186v so I did not bother much with it. After a long email session with ASUS people it turns out their board is to blame and CPUz is maybe reporting the wrong vcore. Not only is my 7700k a bad piece but the mobo is pushing extra voltage at stock for no reason!!

They told to manually set vcore to 1.185v and if needed play around with the LLC. At 1.19v with LLC at High things seem ok with temps around low- mid 80s on only Prime95 bench.

Actually when running default settings in BIOS it is the Intel CPU VID that sets the stock voltage, not the motherboard.

 

[coercitiv]

Not only is my 7700k a bad piece but the mobo is pushing extra voltage at stock for no reason!!

At 1.19v with LLC at High things seem ok with temps around low- mid 80s on only Prime95 bench.

So far I have yet to see evidence that the CPU is indeed a bad performer thermal wise. Simply adjusting vcore to what should have been stock values brought you a drop of 5C in temps. Adding a few fans will also lower temps more. It seems to me you are bound to reach the 80C median or maybe even lower, depending on your ambient temps.

 

[sm625]

Your temperature results are perfectly reasonable, as the CM 212 is a terrible HSF and always was a terrible HSF.

The 212 EVO offers 122% of the perf per dollar of the TRUE Spirit 140 Direct. Can the "LED" version really be that much worse?

 

[StefanR5R]

We are talking about dissipating 90W (stock) or ~130W (OCed) of heat, which the "crappy" Hyper 212+ should be able to do (handles my old i7 920 just fine).

Performance of "direct touch" designs like Hyper 212+ and True Spirit 140 Direct is sensitive to die size and die shape, more so than designs with full copper base. Hence, extrapolation of such a cooler's performance from the 263 mm², 45 nm i7 920 to the circa 126 mm², 14 nm i7 7700K is bound to be inaccurate.

(That said, IMO the major contributor to the OP's problem are the mere 120 mm intake and outlet fans each, which are inadequate for a ~100 W CPU on Prime plus a 180 W GPU on Furmark simultaneously, at least if it is an open-air cooler type graphics card.)

 

[imported_JohnJohn]

The GPU is a 1080 ASUS ROG Strix 1080 factory OCed with three fans.

I have managed to get the temps down to about 84C on Prime95 after a bit of under clocking and reducing the vcore a bit will share the results when I get back home.

With both the CPU and GPU stressed "Prime95+Furmark" it does reach 90C+ but generally stays below 93C

I have dropped the speed by about 300Mhz so now its at 4.1Ghz but it requires less vcore and the temps have dropped off will upload test screens later. On a disappointing note got in touch with Intel who say if its working at the specified stock speed there is noting wrong with the processor and I need to get appropriate cooling.



EDIT: Also noticed my Core1 is hotter than Core0 by 5-6C always, Core0 is the coolest and Core1 the hottest with others in between

EDIT2: Had found this thread with a similar issue https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?90637-Z270G-amp-7700K-Core-Voltage-amp-Temps . There is a chance that I have one from a similar batch or maybe just plain bad luck.

 

[coercitiv]

On a disappointing note got in touch with Intel who say if its working at the specified stock speed there is noting wrong with the processor and I need to get appropriate cooling.

Just to be clear, this happens in a closed, dust filtered case with just one low RPM fan, right?

 

[Redentor]

i7 7700K + Cooler Master TX3 (Supported TDP up to 140W) = Throttling @ default. XD
https://twitter.com/BitsAndChipsEng/status/830155650533580800

 

[StefanR5R]

Performance of "direct touch" designs like Hyper 212+ and True Spirit 140 Direct is sensitive to die size and die shape, more so than designs with full copper base. Hence, extrapolation of such a cooler's performance from the 263 mm², 45 nm i7 920 to the circa 126 mm², 14 nm i7 7700K is bound to be inaccurate.

I should also point out my 212 is the new LED one

Here is a fotograph of the base of Cooler Master Hyper 212 LED, straight from CM's web site:

In the worst case, the hottest cores are located beneath one of the aluminum strips.

(That said, IMO the major contributor to the OP's problem are the mere 120 mm intake and outlet fans each, which are inadequate for a ~100 W CPU on Prime plus a 180 W GPU on Furmark simultaneously, at least if it is an open-air cooler type graphics card.)

But in the end, there are multiple factors:

• rather low case ventilation, as far as I could gather from the info provided so far
• GPU blowing part of its heated exhaust right up into the air stream which enters the CPU cooler
• 120 mm class slim tower cooler provides adequate radiator surface for stock-clocked 4-core CPUs, but can become inadequate for overclocked CPUs
• direct-touch type cooler on a 14 nm CPU
  
• Kaby Lake generally running hot at higher frequencies, but much more so when overclocked, let alone overvolted
• some Kaby Lake-ready BIOSes are said to be over-eager with auto overvolting
• Kaby Lake, just like Skylake, Haswell, and Ivy Bridge, being manufactured with a TIM layer between die and heat spreader (rather than soldered), and this TIM layer being quite a bit thicker than necessary, and than desirable for a higher clocked CPU

Anything that I forgot?

 

[StefanR5R]

i7 7700K + Cooler Master TX3 (Supported TDP up to 140W) = Throttling @ default. XD
https://twitter.com/BitsAndChipsEng/status/830155650533580800

The base of Cooler Master TX3:

 

[crashtech]

I've had to resurface the bottoms of direct contact heat sinks before, the heat pipes can move around, especially during shipping but also after thermal cycling.

 

[Pohemi]

You can see that the difference between the 212 LED and the 212Evo/212X is that there are no gaps in the direct contact surface on the latter. I would think that could make a decent variable to how well it cools, especially "hot spots" in the CPU.

 

[imported_JohnJohn]

You can see that the difference between the 212 LED and the 212Evo/212X is that there are no gaps in the direct contact surface on the latter. I would think that could make a decent variable to how well it cools, especially "hot spots" in the CPU.

I think you are right infact this also explains why Core1 is hotter than Core0 by 4-6C. Also another point while comparing to my old 212X I was correct the new 212 LED weights less by 24g in terms of heat-sink only. Given the construction materials are the same old same old this 24g also matters in heat dissipation I am guessing.

 

[crashtech]

If you have room you could temporarily rotate your HSF 90°, then see if temps change. If you have your HSF off, you can check how flat it is with some sandpaper on a thick pane of glass

 

[imported_JohnJohn]

This is interesting while I was checking on alternatives to the pea size drop method for the thermal paste with respect to 212 LED I came across this review https://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cooling/2017/01/11/cooler-master-hyper-212-led-review/2 for the 212 LED. Notice how far this 212 is from the 212X specially in the socket 2011 even an i32 beats it, I have no idea why most of the reviews which I read gave the 212 LED high marks and if memory serves me correctly in most places 212 LED was shown equal to a 212X or very close.

Anyway here is the latest result from using 2 new intake fans in the front and with existing 1 exhaust fan and 1 side panel fan. I also reapplied the thermal paste "Using a vertical line method" after using a special clearer on both the CPU and the heatsink to remove all oil.

If you have room you could temporarily rotate your HSF 90°, then see if temps change. If you have your HSF off, you can check how flat it is with some sandpaper on a thick pane of glass

Confirming yes it does make a difference Core1 is closer to Core0 but Core4 went crazier by 7C. My CPU is not HSF off I am frankly scared of it ever since the time of the ivy bridges.