780/770 sales appear slow

[Highmodulus]

I bought one. But only because the 7970 in my sig is dying and causing system crashes. Figured I'd give Nvidia a go this time around.

I bought one to replace an ATI card as well, so obviously ATI is DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED and this is the best card release in the history of gaming.

btw- video card fan boys are funny, how about using our host's review of the 770 rather than some random obscure site.

For the two games I am playing right now:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6994/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-review/11
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6994/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-review/12

The 770 is handily beating the stock 7970 despite selling for within $9 of it on Amazon. And its beating the much more expensive GHZ version as well. This was a big factor in my decision. The Anandtech review noted this pricing issue as well:

"With that said, there are a couple of wildcard factors in play here that can tilt things in either side’s favor. At $399 the GTX 770 is cheaper than the 7970GE by $20 to $50, depending on the model and whether there’s a sale going on (the 7970 is actually priced closer, but we’d consider the 7970GE the better value for AMD cards). Consumers at virtually every level are still very price-conscious, so that’s going to put AMD in a pinch as they need 7970GE, not 7970 vanilla, to match GTX 770."

As the AMD bundle did nothing for me, AMD's pricing on the 7970 (and especially the 7970GE's) on Amazon was not very competitive at this point. If the 7970GE was the same price, it would have been more of a tie in my book. But as the Anandtech review noted, pick the games you like and weight your decision accordingly. The GTX 770 was better at the games I liked, and cheaper too. So the 6870 was replaced with a GTX770.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Sure was -- it started the ball rolling for weak 28nm default price/performance. Great deal now!

Hey that's my line...

How was AMD supposed to know their $550 card would compete with nVidia's $250 card while nVidia grew market share and danced a jig in Santa Clara to the tune of record setting financials?

 

[Rvenger]

Gamers have more choices and improved 28nm price/performance.

Nothing has improved, with the exception of the 780/Titan you can achieve the same performance you did when AMD released the 7970 in January 2012.. Price drops came shortly after and leveled to basically where we are now.


To think these choices are great, they really are not. PC market is stagnant and getting worse.

 

[Grooveriding]

780 is your typical ultra high end card that very few people buy, marked up $150 over where that card has been for the past five years. An already tiny market that was eaten in to by the Titan and the portion of that small market that bought one who have no use for the 780.

No doubt the 780 has/will sell far less than 680, 580 or 480 before that did due to the Titan and small niche nature of that price point in GPUs. That is, of course, ignoring whatever price drops are coming in the future.

I expect the Titan and 780 to both see in excess of $100 price cuts before the year is out though. Things could change, particularly if AMD puts out a new halo card which would have to force price cuts on Titan and 780.

770 is a joke of a card, rebadged overclocked 680 with an even worse implementation of boost than is on the 680, at least if you care about getting the most out of your overclock.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Your opinion would have more weight if you weren't constantly claiming Titan wasn't selling while it was selling out and nVidia came out and said they sold three times as many Titans as they did 690s.

At some point you need to reference some actual facts before you can form an opinion good enough to share with a large group of people.

 

[Grooveriding]

Haha, broken record still with some major fail on reading comprehension still leading to broken assumptions. Get over it, lol, months later and still can't let it go...
Have a forum break, they're not that important.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Haha.

 

[SirPauly]

Nothing has improved

Sure it has -- The GTX 670 slot did get replaced with 17-20 percent more performance and now the GTX 670 offers even more price performance as its street price is dropping.

 

[Kallogan]

Your opinion would have more weight if you weren't constantly claiming Titan wasn't selling while it was selling out and nVidia came out and said they sold three times as many Titans as they did 690s.

True dat. They sold 3 GTX 690s and 9 Titans.

 

[wand3r3r]

^ balla source? It was more at that point than 690 in a year unless you have a different source. Not 3x as much but let's not let the details get in the way of a good story.

 

[OCGuy]

Having stock on shelves for a "new" tech product is typically a bad sign. It's not hard to pick up on the demand if one is not too dense.

What is worse is not having any "new" tech product on the market at all.


The damage control by Zoners hasn't been this bad since the 690.....

 

[Siberian]

I think these AMD advocate type posts are their answer to the 7 series. No product available but a lot of FUD threads. :thumbsdown:

 

[rgallant]

I bought one to replace an ATI card as well, so obviously ATI is DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED and this is the best card release in the history of gaming.

btw- video card fan boys are funny, how about using our host's review of the 770 rather than some random obscure site.

For the two games I am playing right now:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6994/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-review/11
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6994/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-review/12

The 770 is handily beating the stock 7970 despite selling for within $9 of it on Amazon. And its beating the much more expensive GHZ version as well. This was a big factor in my decision. The Anandtech review noted this pricing issue as well:

"With that said, there are a couple of wildcard factors in play here that can tilt things in either side’s favor. At $399 the GTX 770 is cheaper than the 7970GE by $20 to $50, depending on the model and whether there’s a sale going on (the 7970 is actually priced closer, but we’d consider the 7970GE the better value for AMD cards). Consumers at virtually every level are still very price-conscious, so that’s going to put AMD in a pinch as they need 7970GE, not 7970 vanilla, to match GTX 770."

As the AMD bundle did nothing for me, AMD's pricing on the 7970 (and especially the 7970GE's) on Amazon was not very competitive at this point. If the 7970GE was the same price, it would have been more of a tie in my book. But as the Anandtech review noted, pick the games you like and weight your decision accordingly. The GTX 770 was better at the games I liked, and cheaper too. So the 6870 was replaced with a GTX770.

just saying
the gtx 770 is a good card for some but:

where did you get the gtx 770 4gb or do you have the 2gb if so your comparing a apple to a plum.
-most reviews concede that 2gb might be a issue after ps4 games are released.
-gtx770 4 gb will cost more , so stating the gtx770 is cheaper is misleading ,

I have no shin in this game and will wait for the 20nm but if you read the 780 thread where they are fighting over 6gb vs 3 gb so the 2gb vs 3 gb war is lost.

 

[Lonbjerg]

Nothing has improved,

Prepare for the paradox!!!

with the exception of the 780/Titan

Paradox detected....

 

[Will Robinson]

Hey that's my line...

How was AMD supposed to know their $550 card would compete with nVidia's $250 card while nVidia grew market share and danced a jig in Santa Clara to the tune of record setting financials?

At some point you need to reference some actual facts before you can form an opinion good enough to share with a large group of people.__________________

Sorry,which card was that you are referring to

 

[RussianSensation]

Sure was -- it started the ball rolling for weak 28nm default price/performance. Great deal now!

I am not sure what's happening with this forum. I've been following AT for so long and I recall PC "enthusiasts" doing everything possible to extra maximum value, such as buying Albatron GeForce 4200Ti with its 3.3ns memory and overclocking it to match or pass GeForce 4600, 9500Pro unlock into a 9700, 6800 Non-ultra pixel pipeline unlock, X800GTO2 unlock, 6800GT overclocking from 350mhz to 425mhz, GTX460/470/560Ti overclocking not long ago. All of a sudden, the term enthusiast means throwing more $$$ at a problem, not at all what it meant in the past.

Why in our forum where we buy K series Intel CPUs, Noctua NH-D14/Phanteks/Silver Arrows/H100s, do TIM roundups and try to find 1-2*C drops in temperatures, CPU de-lidding, MSI Afterburner voltage unlocks, all of a sudden when it's most convenient to ignore, people ignore HD7970's easy overclocking that has been available from day 1?

1) HD7970 OC in the hands of "enthusiasts" was at or near the top of the fastest GPU from Jan 2012 until the day Titan launched, outside of select few GTX680 Lightnings with modded bioses that cost $580-600. And if you watercooled it and it reached 1350mhz+, then you basically had GTX780 level of performance 18 months ago. You keep ignoring this on AT forum. Is this forum turning into TigerDirect or BestBuy now? It sure seems that way.

2) HD7970 OC delivered far better performance/$ over GTX580 OC than GTX680 did over 7970, GTX780 did over 7970GE or Titan did over 7970GE. Again, knowing 7970 was factory underclocked at 925mhz and many people hit 1050-1100mhz on stock voltage alone, and AMD provided FREE 7970GE bios upgrade to 7970 owners, and the fact that 7970 has dual BIOSes which means it's 100% risk free to flash it with a 1.05ghz 7970GE bios, you still ignore 7970's overclocking 18 months ago.

So if you accept that HD7970 was weak in price/performance, then following it, this entire generation is even worse. How in the world do you keep ignoring that HD7970 OC delivered 40-80% more performance when overclocked compared to a GTX580 OC for $100 and yet no single card since January 2012 has brought that much increase in price/performance?

Looking at GTX770/780/Titan and existing prices of HD7970GE, all of these cards are now overpriced. When GTX480 launched at $499, about 1.5 years later you could pick one up for $175-225 on Newegg. Again, if you thought HD7970 vs. 580 brought weak price/performance for a $100 premium, then everything else since then has been simply awful. GTX770 at stock can't convincingly beat an 11 months old 7970GE and NV's AIB needed factory overclocked versions to surpass it. Sure it comes with a $100 price drop from the 680 but it's been 15 months since 680 launched.

 

[5150Joker]

I am not sure what's happening with this forum. I've been following AT for so long and I recall PC "enthusiasts" doing everything possible to extra maximum value, such as buying Albatron GeForce 4200Ti with its 3.3ns memory and overclocking it to match or pass GeForce 4600, 9500Pro unlock into a 9700, 6800 Non-ultra pixel pipeline unlock, X800GTO2 unlock, 6800GT overclocking from 350mhz to 425mhz, GTX460/470/560Ti overclocking not long ago. All of a sudden, the term enthusiast means throwing more $$$ at a problem, not at all what it meant in the past.

Why in our forum where we buy K series Intel CPUs, Noctua NH-D14/Phanteks/Silver Arrows/H100s, do TIM roundups and try to find 1-2*C drops in temperatures, CPU de-lidding, MSI Afterburner voltage unlocks, all of a sudden when it's most convenient to ignore, people ignore HD7970's easy overclocking that has been available from day 1?

1) HD7970 OC in the hands of "enthusiasts" was at or near the top of the fastest GPU from Jan 2012 until the day Titan launched, outside of select few GTX680 Lightnings with modded bioses that cost $580-600. And if you watercooled it and it reached 1350mhz+, then you basically had GTX780 level of performance 18 months ago. You keep ignoring this on AT forum. Is this forum turning into TigerDirect or BestBuy now? It sure seems that way.

2) HD7970 OC delivered far better performance/$ over GTX580 OC than GTX680 did over 7970, GTX780 did over 7970GE or Titan did over 7970GE. Again, knowing 7970 was factory underclocked at 925mhz and many people hit 1050-1100mhz on stock voltage alone, and AMD provided FREE 7970GE bios upgrade to 7970 owners, and the fact that 7970 has dual BIOSes which means it's 100% risk free to flash it with a 1.05ghz 7970GE bios, you still ignore 7970's overclocking 18 months ago.

So if you accept that HD7970 was weak in price/performance, then following it, this entire generation is even worse. How in the world do you keep ignoring that HD7970 OC delivered 40-80% more performance when overclocked compared to a GTX580 OC for $100 and yet no single card since January 2012 has brought that much increase in price/performance?

Looking at GTX770/780/Titan and existing prices of HD7970GE, all of these cards are now overpriced. When GTX480 launched at $499, about 1.5 years later you could pick one up for $175-225 on Newegg. Again, if you thought HD7970 vs. 580 brought weak price/performance for a $100 premium, then everything else since then has been simply awful. GTX770 at stock can't convincingly beat an 11 months old 7970GE and NV's AIB needed factory overclocked versions to surpass it. Sure it comes with a $100 price drop from the 680 but it's been 15 months since 680 launched.

Some of us ignore AMD products for a very simple reason: Crossfire sucks and so do their drivers. For that fact alone I won't consider AMD until they can prove they have made huge strides. And I speak from experience having used Crossfire + AMD drivers extensively the last 3-4 years.

 

[Lonbjerg]

I am not sure what's happening with this forum. I've been following AT for so long and I recall PC "enthusiasts" doing everything possible to extra maximum value, such as buying Albatron GeForce 4200Ti with its 3.3ns memory and overclocking it to match or pass GeForce 4600, 9500Pro unlock into a 9700, 6800 Non-ultra pixel pipeline unlock, X800GTO2 unlock, 6800GT overclocking from 350mhz to 425mhz, GTX460/470/560Ti overclocking not long ago. All of a sudden, the term enthusiast means throwing more $$$ at a problem, not at all what it meant in the past.

Why in our forum where we buy K series Intel CPUs, Noctua NH-D14/Phanteks/Silver Arrows/H100s, do TIM roundups and try to find 1-2*C drops in temperatures, CPU de-lidding, MSI Afterburner voltage unlocks, all of a sudden when it's most convenient to ignore, people ignore HD7970's easy overclocking that has been available from day 1?

1) HD7970 OC in the hands of "enthusiasts" was at or near the top of the fastest GPU from Jan 2012 until the day Titan launched, outside of select few GTX680 Lightnings with modded bioses that cost $580-600. And if you watercooled it and it reached 1350mhz+, then you basically had GTX780 level of performance 18 months ago. You keep ignoring this on AT forum. Is this forum turning into TigerDirect or BestBuy now? It sure seems that way.

2) HD7970 OC delivered far better performance/$ over GTX580 OC than GTX680 did over 7970, GTX780 did over 7970GE or Titan did over 7970GE. Again, knowing 7970 was factory underclocked at 925mhz and many people hit 1050-1100mhz on stock voltage alone, and AMD provided FREE 7970GE bios upgrade to 7970 owners, and the fact that 7970 has dual BIOSes which means it's 100% risk free to flash it with a 1.05ghz 7970GE bios, you still ignore 7970's overclocking 18 months ago.

So if you accept that HD7970 was weak in price/performance, then following it, this entire generation is even worse. How in the world do you keep ignoring that HD7970 OC delivered 40-80% more performance when overclocked compared to a GTX580 OC for $100 and yet no single card since January 2012 has brought that much increase in price/performance?

Looking at GTX770/780/Titan and existing prices of HD7970GE, all of these cards are now overpriced. When GTX480 launched at $499, about 1.5 years later you could pick one up for $175-225 on Newegg. Again, if you thought HD7970 vs. 580 brought weak price/performance for a $100 premium, then everything else since then has been simply awful. GTX770 at stock can't convincingly beat an 11 months old 7970GE and NV's AIB needed factory overclocked versions to surpass it. Sure it comes with a $100 price drop from the 680 but it's been 15 months since 680 launched.

I onwed a Ti4600, not a Ti4200...stop posting like ENTHUSIAST forums are about bargain deals, when most of enthusisast have 1 prime consern:

PERFORMANCE!!!

You would be good in Best Buy I think.

 

[wand3r3r]

I onwed a Ti4600, not a Ti4200...stop posting like ENTHUSIAST forums are about bargain deals, when most of enthusisast have 1 prime consern:

PERFORMANCE!!!

You would be good in Best Buy I think.

If you only care about performance, what was your card before the titan?

 

[DaveSimmons]

GTX770 at stock can't convincingly beat an 11 months old 7970GE and NV's AIB needed factory overclocked versions to surpass it. Sure it comes with a $100 price drop from the 680 but it's been 15 months since 680 launched.

It's similar to the story with AMD vs Intel. AMD isn't improving its own cards enough to push nviida to drop prices more than that.

I remember the 4870 forcing nvidia into an instant $100 price drop, but the rate of performance gains has been slowing down since then.

Intel's Haswell on the desktop is very ho-hum. I'm still on Sandy Bridge (i5-2500) and I'm still waiting for a new desktop CPU to be worth buying.

And again like with intel, not everyone overclocks. Many of us buy CPUs and cards based on their stock speed performance.

 

[Subyman]

The people that can blow $650 on a gpu already blew $999 on the Titan several months ago. The market for a 770 already have a 670 or 680. Unless you really need to upgrade, it's a weird time to buy.

 

[3DVagabond]

It's similar to the story with AMD vs Intel. AMD isn't improving its own cards enough to push nviida to drop prices more than that.

Why when nVidia is 6 months behind AMD on a generation they can't even be accused of being late, but when nVidia releases something that AMD doesn't have an immediate response to AMD can no longer compete? Get a grip, folks. nVidia might have the single GPU crown again... For a while... It's not the end of AMD.

As far as AMD pushing nVidia to drop their prices, those days are over. The only thing that comes of that is nVidia fanbois get cheaper gear. They won't buy AMD no matter what, anyway. Why get into price wars that don't garner you market share?

 

[DaveSimmons]

Why when nVidia is 6 months behind AMD on a generation they can't even be accused of being late, but when nVidia releases something that AMD doesn't have an immediate response to AMD can no longer compete? Get a grip, folks. nVidia might have the single GPU crown again... For a while... It's not the end of AMD.

As far as AMD pushing nVidia to drop their prices, those days are over. The only thing that comes of that is nVidia fanbois get cheaper gear. They won't buy AMD no matter what, anyway. Why get into price wars that don't garner you market share?

I hope you weren't attributing the "can't compete" to me, that isn't what I said or meant. AMD does compete at every point except the top. But their own performance increases have been too slow to push nvidia that much.

I've owned many AMD cards and CPUs over the last 20 years, and I still have a 3800+ X2 gathering dust. Two of my last 4 cards were AMD - 4870 then 6850. After that it was a GTX 560 then 680.

I picked the 680 this time because at launch it was cheaper, faster, quieter and used less power than the competing cards from AMD. Six months later I might have bought AMD instead.

 

[3DVagabond]

I hope you weren't attributing the "can't compete" to me, that isn't what I said or meant. AMD does compete at every point except the top. But their own performance increases have been too slow to push nvidia that much.

I've owned many AMD cards and CPUs over the last 20 years, and I still have a 3800+ X2 gathering dust. Two of my last 4 cards were AMD - 4870 then 6850. After that it was a GTX 560 then 680.

I picked the 680 this time because at launch it was cheaper, faster, quieter and used less power than the competing cards from AMD. Six months later I might have bought AMD instead.

Bad choice of words, maybe. "can't push nVidia"? They have been ahead of nVidia in single GPU performance, even at stock clocks, since the 7970GHz was released. They, of course, push nVidia. It took nVidia a whole year longer to bring GK110 to market. AMD doesn't push the envelope that hard. They are releasing mainly consumer products and the cost of bringing a chip like that to market for the numbers it would sell, just isn't economically feasible.

Let's just say I disagree with your analogy comparing AMD vs. nVidia with AMD vs. Intel. AMD's performance is behind Intel's, and not just because of Intel's superior process. AMD is not behind nVidia. They just aren't making any +500mm² GPU's. I have no doubt that if they wanted to risk needing an additional 12mos to bring a product to market they could make big Titanesque GPU's too. How many would they sell though, and to whom? A handful of enthusiasts? They don't have the presence in the professional and supercomputing market to sell enough of them.

 

[ams23]

770 is a joke of a card, rebadged overclocked 680

Technically this is incorrect because the GTX 770 has lower voltage at it's specified operating frequency compared to GTX 680 at the same operating frequency. Anandtech has a comparison of GeForce Clockspeed Bins between GTX 770 and GTX 680 here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/6994/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-review/2 . As you can see from the chart towards the bottom of the page, at 1045MHz/1058MHz/1110MHz clockspeed, GTX 770 has lower voltage (and hence lower power consumption at these frequencies) than GTX 680. The GTX 770 is also able to access higher voltage bins than GTX 680 to achieve even higher clockspeeds at these higher voltages and higher levels of power consumption. And of course, the GTX 770 has newer and higher clocked GDDR5 memory, in addition to improvements to real world acoustics (through the adaptive fan speed controller). At $100 less than the launch price of GTX 680, with higher-than-reference clocked cards available for $399, with a 4GB VRAM option coming for a small price premium, hardly a joke of a card really for those looking to upgrade from older and slower video cards and who would rather not spend more on a GTX 780 or Titan.