8GB VRAM not enough (and 10 / 12)

[BFG10K]

8GB

• Dying Light 2, Battlefield 2042, Avatar Frontiers of Pandora, Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3, Starfield, Forza Horizon 5, Horizon Forbidden West, Alan Wake 2, The Last of Us, Tekken 8, FC 24, Detroit Become Human, Death Stranding, Alone in The Dark, Overwatch 2
  3060 12GB higher 1% low than 4060 8GB https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIfz57wmywg
• Cyberpunk 2077, Diablo 4, Hogwarts Legacy, Horizon Zero Dawn, Microsoft Flight Sim 2020, Witcher 3, Watch Dogs Legion skip to 4K + DLSS for each game https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPiaWWd0xGc
• Ratchet & Clank, Plague Tale Requiem, Last Of Us, Jedi Survivor, Far Cry 6, Hogwarts Legacy, Forza Horizon 5, Cyberpunk 2077 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr3MckDxMfE&pp=ygUTMTZnYiB2cyA4Z2IgNDA2MCB0aQ==
• Far Cry 6, Godfall, Hogwarts Legacy, Forza Horizon 5, Forspoken, Doom Eternal, Watchdogs Legion https://youtu.be/fJc--C01P90?t=268
• Last Of Us, Resident Evil 4, Callisto Protocol, Plague Tale Requiem, Halo Infinite, Forspoken https://youtu.be/2_Y3E631ro8?t=429
• Last Of Us, Hogwarts Legacy, Resident Evil 4, Forspoken, Plague Tale Requiem, Callisto Protocol https://youtu.be/Rh7kFgHe21k?t=288
• Hogwarts Legacy, Last Of Us, Spider Man Remastered, Doom Eternal, Forza Horizon 5 https://youtu.be/R943CbDTq_s?t=1473
• Horizon Forbidden West 4060 has issues @ 1080p + DLSS unless you switch off frame generation and reduce settings to high https://youtu.be/3AyKvI23VGw?t=233
• Horizon Forbidden West 3070 requires reducing textures 2 notches https://youtu.be/xTwEGy6HHKo?t=351
• Deathloop https://youtu.be/lu_XHyO-6zY?t=918
• Ghost Recon Breakpoint https://youtu.be/iUGppQVpXzU?t=529
• Resident Evil 2 https://youtu.be/Aa-gsgRjMII?t=796
• Talos Principle 2 https://youtu.be/K6FATQAuEwI?t=337
• Spider Man Remastered https://youtu.be/vRVR_plVSlc?t=1060
• Witcher 3 https://youtu.be/vRVR_plVSlc?t=1240

Horizon Forbidden West 3060 is faster than the 2080 Super despite the former usually competing with the 2070. Also 3060 has a better 1% low than 4060 and 4060Ti 8GB.

Spoiler

Resident Evil Village 3060TI/3070 tanks at 4K and is slower than the 3060/6700XT when ray tracing:

Spoiler

Company Of Heroes 3060 has a higher minimum than the 3070TI:

Spoiler

10GB / 12GB

• Plague Tale Requiem 3080 10GB tanks if you enable ray tracing, would be fast enough if it had more VRAM because if you stop moving, the framerate stabilizes to >60FPS https://youtu.be/7zjrMww3fAc?t=496
• Hogwarts Legacy 4K + RT, 4060Ti 16GB is faster than 4070 12GB https://youtu.be/X-h_R488Mq8?t=191

Reasons why still shipping 8GB since 2014 isn't NV's fault.

Spoiler

1. It's the player's fault.
2. It's the reviewer's fault.
3. It's the developer's fault.
4. It's AMD's fault.
5. It's the game's fault.
6. It's the driver's fault.
7. It's a system configuration issue.
8. Wrong settings were tested.
9. Wrong area was tested.
10. Wrong games were tested.
11. 4K is irrelevant.
12. Texture quality is irrelevant as long as it matches a console's.
13. Detail levels are irrelevant as long as they match a console's.
14. There's no reason a game should use more than 8GB, because a random forum user said so.
15. It's completely acceptable for the more expensive 3070/3070TI/3080 to turn down settings while the cheaper 3060/6700XT has no issue.
16. It's an anomaly.
17. It's a console port.
18. It's a conspiracy against NV.
19. 8GB cards aren't meant for 4K / 1440p / 1080p / 720p gaming.
20. It's completely acceptable to disable ray tracing on NV while AMD has no issue.
21. Polls, hardware market share, and game title count are evidence 8GB is enough, but are totally ignored when they don't suit the ray tracing agenda.

According to some people here, 8GB is neeeevaaaaah NV's fault and objective evidence "doesn't count" because of reasons(tm). If you have others please let me know and I'll add them to the list. Cheers!

 

[Mopetar]

8GB is relegated to entry level. Even 10-12GB are on borrowed time. Enthusiasts should not buy anything under 16GB of vRAM if they intend to play games coming out in 2024 and 2025.

Today 12GB cards are right at the edge just like 8GB cards were 18 months ago, and history will repeat.

12 GB will likely last the current console generation. Ultimately any VRAM amount is on borrowed time, buts it's a question of how quick that time will come. 8 GB was obviously a bad choice given the new consoles having 16 GB.

That said anything less than 16 GB is not appropriate for a high-end card. Anything that will be kept for five years or more should ha e at least that much as towards the end of that span we'll definitely see titles that want at least that much for top quality settings.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I read demand for it continues to fall, so it may drop another $5-$10 soon. Now is still a great time to buy of course.

Samsung the last hold-out, also recently instituted short-term production cuts, but due to inventory oversupply, the market won't see price increases until Q3.

Edit: Here's the front-page article that I got that info from:

Samsung Becomes Latest Memory Fab to Cut Production Amidst Post-Pandemic Slump

www.anandtech.com

 

[maddie]

Samsung the last hold-out, also recently instituted short-term production cuts, but due to inventory oversupply, the market won't see price increases until Q3.

I would take any predictions for coming quarters as fantasy. It might be correct but is likely wrong.

 

[maddie]

AMD agrees.

Building an Enthusiast PC

Are YOU an Enthusiast? Do you crave the best experiences possible in your games with no expense spared? Are you the type that keeps on top of ‘what is the best GPU’? Do you like to track GPU benchmarks and reviews? At this level of PC building, you should have confidence that you are getting...

community.amd.com

This slide is interesting. Several more on page.

 

[igor_kavinski]

View attachment 79346

Nvidiots better sit down while going through that

 

[MrTeal]

Yeah makes me wish I would have sprung the extra $100 for an RX 6800 instead of a 6700 XT. Oh well, at least didn't get completely screwed with a 3060 Ti.

If you think 3060 Ti buyers are screwed, wait until people get their shiny new $500 4060 Ti's home in a month or so.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

If you think 3060 Ti buyers are screwed, wait until people get their shiny new $500 4060 Ti's home in a month or so.

God the 4060 Ti is going to make the GTX 960 look like a great card for its time.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Gamers (frantically): MAYDAY MAYDAY!!! WE NEED MORE VRAM!!!!

Jensen (listening to music with headphones and thinking to himself): Look how happy they are. They are beside themselves with excitement!

 

[Jaskalas]

This mismanagement from NVIDIA, if it continues to spill over into the 40 series, is going to leave a mark.
I will certainly remember my 8gb card next time I make a purchase.

 

[Ranulf]

God the 4060 Ti is going to make the GTX 960 look like a great card for its time.

Ah, the fun days of debating over the 960 2gb ($199) vs 4gb ($230) released a couple weeks later versus the r9 290 4gb (that had been selling for $250-275 since Oct 2014).

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Ah, the fun days of debating over the 960 2gb ($199) vs 4gb ($230) released a couple weeks later versus the r9 290 4gb (that had been selling for $250-275 since Oct 2014).

Those R9 290s were as low as $200 brand new in November 2014. And with 4-5 games as part of the Never Settle Space Edition bundle. And that was back when R9 290 was like a 4070 Ti equivalent of its day at worst.

 

[Ranulf]

I never did activate my free copy of star citizen that came with that card.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I never did activate my free copy of star citizen that came with that card.

You're going to look like a sucker in 25 years when that game launches

 

[Timorous]

AMD agrees.

Building an Enthusiast PC

Are YOU an Enthusiast? Do you crave the best experiences possible in your games with no expense spared? Are you the type that keeps on top of ‘what is the best GPU’? Do you like to track GPU benchmarks and reviews? At this level of PC building, you should have confidence that you are getting...

community.amd.com

This slide is interesting. Several more on page.

View attachment 79346

Makes me wonder if AMD are rethinking the 7700XT and 7600XT.

7700XT could just be a cut N32 die and still use 4 MCDs.

7600XT could have 16GB.

Then an entry level 7600 or 7500 could use N33 with just 8GB.

A 16GB 7600XT Vs an 8GB 4060 would be interesting.

 

[jpiniero]

Makes me wonder if AMD are rethinking the 7700XT and 7600XT.

7700XT could just be a cut N32 die and still use 4 MCDs.

7600XT could have 16GB.

Then an entry level 7600 or 7500 could use N33 with just 8GB.

A 16GB 7600XT Vs an 8GB 4060 would be interesting.

I mean, there's a reason why nVidia cost the bus size - they wanted to reduce power consumption... and cost. If AMD feels like they need to have the N32 models have 16 GB, that's not going to help the chances of them bothering.

Maybe GDDR6W could make clamshell easier. But that's really a stretch.

 

[maddie]

I mean, there's a reason why nVidia cost the bus size - they wanted to reduce power consumption... and cost. If AMD feels like they need to have the N32 models have 16 GB, that's not going to help the chances of them bothering.

Maybe GDDR6W could make clamshell easier. But that's really a stretch.

..... and cost.

Funny.

 

[BFG10K]

This slide is interesting. Several more on page.

This is a start but they also need to include screenshots/footage from HWUB, specifically textures fading in and out by simply standing still, and the horrifically unplayable hitching. Then show how stable 16GB is in comparison.

Otherwise it's too easy to dismiss as a fluff piece.

 

[A///]

Imo the for 8 gb arguments are weak. it's no different to the hard drive and memory arguments I've heard since I got into computers in the 80s. there is nothing wrong with more god of good things in computing.

 

[A///]

This mismanagement from NVIDIA, if it continues to spill over into the 40 series, is going to leave a mark.
I will certainly remember my 8gb card next time I make a purchase.

?????????????????/

50 series you mean?

 

[Timorous]

This mismanagement from NVIDIA, if it continues to spill over into the 40 series, is going to leave a mark.
I will certainly remember my 8gb card next time I make a purchase.

I don't recall the 3.5GB 970 or the 2GB 960 or even the 4GB 980 leaving that much of a mark when vram requirements jumped to around 6-8GB as we came out of the PS4s cross gen phase. 4000 series feels very much like the 900 series in that it is better than 700 (3000) series was but still not quite enough and it won't be until a super refresh or 5000 series releases that we see something more akin to the 1000 series.

EDIT: Sorry I quoted the wrong post.

 

[jpiniero]

I don't recall the 3.5GB 970 or the 2GB 960 or even the 4GB 980 leaving that much of a mark when vram requirements jumped to around 6-8GB as we came out of the PS4s cross gen phase.

Developers were likely much more conscious that swapping on a platter drive console would be very costly... not to mention loading times in general... so there was a deliberate attempt to keep RAM usage down and hide loading using various schemes. Don't need to do that anymore.

 

[jpiniero]

FWIW Arkane just said that Redfall will only have the 30 fps quality mode on Series X at launch although they claim they will add a 60 fps mode later. It's probably a CPU bottleneck but definitely doesn't inspire confidence in the PC version.

 

[fleshconsumed]

Well lads, I'm officially hopping off of 8GB train. I just side graded from 3070FE to 6800 (non-XT) Sapphire Pulse and 3070FE is heading off to ebay. I'm finally getting 16GB vram which should last me till RDNA4, and I'm also getting slight performance boost. Don't really care about RT so that's not an issue. I know that most people go for 6800XT/6900XT/6950XT but 6800 is plenty enough for me for right now and I prefer my cards to stay around 200W envelope for heat and noise reasons.

These past two (three?) years have been really weird. I've had RX480 8GB essentially since release day in 2016. It lasted me 5 years, but it was finally getting a bit too old by 2020-2021. Through sheer luck I managed to score open box 3060ti for my wife from Microcenter for less than $400 tax included and 3070FE for myself from a Best Buy drop since miners were going for 3060ti/3080/3090 and 3070's were relatively easy to get. I knew back then that 8GB was way too little, but for the life of me I could not get AMD card. When I asked microcenter associate if they ever had AMD shipments he basically laughed in my face. Microcenter was getting plenty of nvidia cards and if you were willing to camp overnight on a drop day you were guaranteed to get a card, but sadly AMD cards were MIA.

Well, I'm back on AMD train, did DDU earlier today and 6800 is in. Feels good to ditch nvidia. Now I just hope that my wife's 3060ti will last another couple of years. Thankfully she only has 1440p and the most demanding game she plays is Witcher 3 so I'm hoping she'll be alright.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I know that most people go for 6800XT/6900XT/6950XT but 6800 is plenty enough for me for right now and I prefer my cards to stay around 200W envelope for heat and noise reasons.

Same reasons I went 6800 instead of higher. The Sapphire Pulse line has always been solid bang for buck for me, you should be happy with it. I bought the XFX Qick due to pricing at the time. It is a big card; runs cool and quiet.

I just sold my EVGA 3060ti and it is still a really capable card. Moving forward maybe not so much. Mine had close to 2yrs warranty left and sitting in its box, so no point in keeping it.

There is a lot of copium being smoked out there. The push back is that 8GB is fine, it's all fake news about needing more VRAM.

 

[A///]

Nvidiots better sit down while going through that

Nvidia nor Jh give a flying fiddle what amd has to say about gpus.