9600GT SLi review

[bryanW1995]

damnit, apoppin, I was just about to tell him that "apoppin thinks that 9800gtx is gonna be a killer!" way to steal my thunder...

dual 8800gt...nice...that should be a LOT better than 9600gt sli. cheex, are you getting this?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: apoppin
SLi huh? .. i KNEW you would go for it, Keys!

awesome ... and congratulations

.. although i remain unconvinced that we have seen real GTX specifications
... and you are right, if you want to explore nvidia's multi GPU, there is no need to wait .. i am sure you got a very good deal

i'll 'call' you in May with r700 and up the ante, shall i?

I am having a hard time buying that the 9800GTX is 1.5" longer just for an extra SLI connector, but alas, that's probably why.

a wager? .. a gentleman's bet, perhaps?
- if you need more, perhaps some distasteful task the loser has to perform
:evil:

i am betting that 9800GTX is being understated and that nvidia is allowing this misdirection ... because it is their history of doing so.

i think i am going to buy a GX2 on Launch Day instead however, not a GTX as i cannot SLi anything on my MB ... but i DO want to test multi-GPU against my modest CrossFire setup.

in the meantime all of 'you guys' can continue with your self-abusive speculations while i go and enjoy some GAMES ... i am SO tired of benchmarking - i want to reap the rewards of upgrading ... Guild Wars: NightFall [online] is next with Perseus Rising for "in between"

Just be polite ... it is only "hardware" and both companies make great HW

aloha

 

[bryanW1995]

why would you spend the $450 or whatever on a gx2 for such a tiny performance increase, especially at 16x1050? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get a great new video card or at least spring for the "apoppin xfire mode" (tm), but how much can you spend on a video card at 14x9? Having said all that, if you want me to hold on to one of your video cards to test mixed mode crossfire then just say the word!

edit: oh yeah, this is a great thread. who would have thought that sli on a midrange card could spark such heated debate?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
why would you spend the $450 or whatever on a gx2 for such a tiny performance increase, especially at 16x1050? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get a great new video card or at least spring for the "apoppin xfire mode" (tm), but how much can you spend on a video card at 14x9? Having said all that, if you want me to hold on to one of your video cards to test mixed mode crossfire then just say the word!

edit: oh yeah, this is a great thread. who would have thought that sli on a midrange card could spark such heated debate?

Me? ... i was just leaving .. OK ... sigh

what 14x9? that is my 2nd LCD ... i game at 16x10 and also at 16x12 occasionally


i do not intend to keep the GX2 or else i will dump Crossfire
... letsee, i think i can get $350 for my 2 cards with both bridges .. a cheap further upgrade indeed - IF performance warrants it on MY rig [up to 16x12, remember]

Now, IF i don't see a whole lot of difference ... or if SLi turns out to be a lesser solution than CrossFire - it just seems to me, i can sell the GX2 for what i pay for it on Day One ... a few days later

Hence the reference to "staying up for 196 hours on black coffee and no doze" ... benchmarking the hell out of it and then selling it [perhaps for a tidy little profit if Rollo actually let something "slip" about availability - or not]

 

[lopri]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
I have 2 8800GT's coming by Saturday and a 700W SLI certified PSU by tomorrow.
After seeing 9800GTX specs, there's no more point in waiting.

You will like it. For $400, it's a very good bang. Granted there still are some caveats but often times those are title-specific so hopefully your favorite games don't have issues with SLI. I wish it had some more bandwidth and frame buffer, but only way to have that is to go GTX/Ultra route, which is kinda pointless at this point. I've already been bragging about my best cabling job ever in the Cases & Cooling forum. GX2 might end up being faster, but it'll be hotter. And what's the point of having a SLI board if not using it?

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
why would you spend the $450 or whatever on a gx2 for such a tiny performance increase, especially at 16x1050? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get a great new video card or at least spring for the "apoppin xfire mode" (tm), but how much can you spend on a video card at 14x9? Having said all that, if you want me to hold on to one of your video cards to test mixed mode crossfire then just say the word!

edit: oh yeah, this is a great thread. who would have thought that sli on a midrange card could spark such heated debate?

Me? ... i was just leaving .. OK ... sigh

what 14x9? that is my 2nd LCD ... i game at 16x10 and also at 16x12 occasionally


i do not intend to keep the GX2 or else i will dump Crossfire
... letsee, i think i can get $350 for my 2 cards with both bridges .. a cheap further upgrade indeed - IF performance warrants it on MY rig [up to 16x12, remember]

Now, IF i don't see a whole lot of difference ... or if SLi turns out to be a lesser solution than CrossFire - it just seems to me, i can sell the GX2 for what i pay for it on Day One ... a few days later

Hence the reference to "staying up for 196 hours on black coffee and no doze" ... benchmarking the hell out of it and then selling it [perhaps for a tidy little profit if Rollo actually let something "slip" about availability - or not]

sorry, I know that you game at 16x1050, I should have been more specific: I game at 14x9 b/c I'm too cheap to upgrade my monitor until I can get a quality 24" unit for under $300.

 

[Cheex]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
damnit, apoppin, I was just about to tell him that "apoppin thinks that 9800gtx is gonna be a killer!" way to steal my thunder...

dual 8800gt...nice...that should be a LOT better than 9600gt sli. cheex, are you getting this?

Yes, I am. I guess 8800GT SLI is still the king of the hill as far as price/performance goes.

Especially, since my 780i board is a gift....As long as it works well...I might as well endorse it by going SLI...

What you think?

 

[apoppin]

absolutely .. go for it

we are all [well, mostly] GAMERS .. and the games are ahead of the HW ...
... i just have to be careful .. this IS a recession .. and my injury limits my work to strictly part time .. for god knows how long

and Bryan ... i have 'bad news' for you .. the Soyo 24" 19x12 at OM is a decent 24" TN panel for under $300 ... just make sure you get the replacement warranty as there seem to be some lemons .. but it is a beautiful display if you don't need all the inputs.
-i would get one in a heartbeat if i could handle such a big display. 24" makes me uncomfortable while gaming - i tried on e and a 27" CRT years before - much worse than 22" - i just can't find a comfortable distance to be from my screen .. and up close i can see the individual pixels
- if there was a cheap but decent 20-21" 19x12 display, i would want that one

 

[bryanW1995]

My wallet is frowning at you apoppin.

soyo is back up to $399 right now, unfortunately.

I do have tilt and height adjustments on my 19" jobber btw. does the soyo have those?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
My wallet is frowning at you apoppin.



I do have tilt and height adjustments on my 19" jobber btw. does the soyo have those?

yet you are smiling ... right now

read the actual user reviews ... some on on their 3rd one !

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2155691&enterthread=y

http://www.officemax.com/omax/...sku.jsp?skuId=21361009

unfortunately [or 'fortunately' according to Mr Wallet] you just missed the sale .. and it has been off an on quite a few times ... keep watching hot deals

 

[Cheex]

Originally posted by: apoppin
absolutely .. go for it

we are all [well, mostly] GAMERS .. and the games are ahead of the HW ...
... i just have to be careful .. this IS a recession .. and my injury limits my work to strictly part time .. for god knows how long

Let's say I get 8800GT SLI, won't everyone among us "look down upon" (sounds wierd) my rig and frown once 9800xxx is released?

 

[BFG10K]

The "little goal" was to establish whether or not the G94 had improved architecture or not over G92.

But how can you establish that if your test doesn?t stress the architectures in the manner required?

If I run GLQuake at 320x240 and get the same performance on two different GPUs, what conclusions can I draw about said GPU architectures?

The answer is nothing because the test isn?t testing the GPUs, it?s testing the CPU.

CoD 4 is relatively primitive on a technical scale compared to CryEngine/UT3, especially with respect to lighting and shaders. The MP maps are also generally lightweight to attain a high framerate and you also used a middling resolution.

So given the GPU likely had little to no stress, you really can?t infer anything about the architectures from your results.

And you carry on this way as if you believe we are all a flawed species and stupid.

Sorry no, I never called anyone ?stupid? or ?a flawed species?.

I stated the tests were flawed and hence can?t be used as evidence for what you were trying to prove.

Criticizing testing methods with valid reasoning is not only allowed on a tech forum, it is encouraged.

If you want to conduct tests on every popular game at various resolutions while disabling shaders, that would be interesting, and I would be willing to help out.

I might be willing to provide more results if Azn concedes my two Bioshock tests disproved his theories.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

The "little goal" was to establish whether or not the G94 had improved architecture or not over G92.

But how can you establish that if your test doesn?t stress the architectures in the manner required?

If I run GLQuake at 320x240 and get the same performance on two different GPUs, what conclusions can I draw about said GPU architectures?

The answer is nothing because the test isn?t testing the GPUs, it?s testing the CPU.

CoD 4 is relatively primitive on a technical scale compared to CryEngine/UT3, especially with respect to lighting and shaders. The MP maps are also generally lightweight to attain a high framerate and you also used a middling resolution.

So given the GPU likely had little to no stress, you really can?t infer anything about the architectures from your results.

And you carry on this way as if you believe we are all a flawed species and stupid.

Sorry no, I never called anyone ?stupid? or ?a flawed species?.

I stated the tests were flawed and hence can?t be used as evidence for what you were trying to prove.

Criticizing testing methods with valid reasoning is not only allowed on a tech forum, it is encouraged.

If you want to conduct tests on every popular game at various resolutions while disabling shaders, that would be interesting, and I would be willing to help out.

I might be willing to provide more results if Azn concedes my two Bioshock tests disproved his theories.

If the shaders on the G94 were superior in some way, it would have surpassed the 8800GT when the 8800GT ran at 64 shaders, not equaled it. No matter what game was used. CoD4, Bioshock, Crysis, whatever.

You mention "test in the manner required". How is it required to run say, CoD4 at 25x16 when all we are testing is Power per shader? Not power per total shaders? You're the one still not seeing the goal. You are stuck on overall shader power of the GT in games that require more shader power. That's not what we were looking for.

Do you disagree that an 8800GT at 64 shaders and exact same clocks as a 9600GT would run STALKER any differently at any resolution? How about Bioshock? Lost Planet?
This was the goal. Nothing else.

 

[nRollo]

This is probably going nowhere, I should have stepped in earlier.

1. AFAIK, the shaders in the 9600GT are not re-done, this was not mentioned in the Editors conference on this part IIRC. I will verify this with NVIDIA.

2. The G9x series uses an internal data compression the G8x series doesn't use, but it's all G9x, not just the 9600GTs.

I'll verify the above and post here in this thread, so people can stop disabling blocks and running benches, my apologies for not jumping in earlier.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Cheex

Originally posted by: apoppin
absolutely .. go for it

we are all [well, mostly] GAMERS .. and the games are ahead of the HW ...
... i just have to be careful .. this IS a recession .. and my injury limits my work to strictly part time .. for god knows how long

Let's say I get 8800GT SLI, won't everyone among us "look down upon" (sounds wierd) my rig and frown once 9800xxx is released?

who really cares?


... IF *you* are happy with your rig ... and you are getting what you want in games!!! i don't care in the slightest that i am running "last gen" CrossFire .. in fact, i get a kick out of the fact is 'keeping up' so well for so little money i spent on it over the last 9 months.

That said, i may well pick up a GX2 on Day One to compare with my CrossFire ... if my 'hunch' is correct - still unsure.
:Q

.. . . and i look forward to a response from nvidia to settle the sniping here .. that would be most appreciated, Rollo

 

[bryanW1995]

cheex, I will look down on you if you don't have dual 9800gx2's, 9900gtx when that comes out, etc. you must always have the latest and greatest hardware or you are nothing

 

[taltamir]

Originally posted by: dreddfunk

Originally posted by: apoppin
You are late to the party Dredd ... Keys and BFG and a few others are already *doing* just that

Originally posted by: Azn
#1 has been tested already if you read few pages back and already been proven that you don't need a 112SP to get near 8800gt performance.

9600gt is proof anyways for #1.

#2 I can't test because I don't have a 8800gt or 9600gt. Yes I would really appreciate if you would test it and shut BFG up once and for all.

'Late to the party', 'already been proven', hardly. All respect to Keys and BFG--as I think it was wonderful for them to do the tests to begin with--I don't believe their tests to be conclusive in any way, which is indicated by the fact that both plan further tests.

However, and this is the point of my posting, I think testing two G80 GPUs, is the wrong choice. I'm interested in their results, but their applicability to G92/G94 cards, with their different texture and memory setups, remains tentative.

The issue at hand is how a *G94* card with 64 SPs performs close to a *G92* card with 112 SPs. The answer to that question isn't going to lie in running tests on two G80 cards.

So I suggest coordinating a test between G92/G94 cards, while *controlling* for variables (such as number of shaders and texture units).

I will try to do what I can on my own, as a G92 owner, but someone with a G94 and a computer with similar specs would really need to be in the equation to *prove* anything (I'm on an e2140 @2.4, IP35-E, 3GB HP Value RAM DDR2-667 @600, BFG 8800GT OC @625, monitor up to 1920x1200).

If anyone knows of any downloadable time-demos that seem reasonable to test, I'd be more than happy to give it a go. I don't have many of the latest FPS-style games, I got out of the habit of playing them, but I'm willing to do what I can within reason (i.e. I don't have the money to go out and buy five games just to run benchmarks).

Cheers.

I whole heartedly agree. I have a G92 8800GTS and live in coppell, tx. If anyone is around here with a 9600GT we can get together over the weekend, I bring my card, you bring yours, and we test them with identical shader amounts and clockspeeds and compare performance.
It is a simple enough situation that was NOT yet tested here. What was tested so far is taking a card and cutting its shaders. Not testing the G92 and G94 with identical clockspeeds and shaders on an identical system and comparing performance. I stipulate the G94 would do better, but who knows.

 

[batmang]

Damn, the 3850 256mb in crossfire got destroyed. Are their any 9600GT 512MB SLI vs 3870 512MB Crossfire benches? That to me would be more interested since those are in the same price range.

EDIT: Found one at TechSpot.
http://www.techspot.com/articl...-versus-radeon-hd3870/

The hard choice is picking between the 9600GT 512mb and the 3870 512mb. The 3870 needs to be in the $180 price range to be really competetive.... come on ATI!

 

[taltamir]

i think i see what is happening here.. nvidia is agressively cutting down little used parts of the core and upping the clock speed while adding optimizations. This makes the core cheaper and cheaper to produce. And allows them to further and further undercut AMD on the price/performance and total price fields.

This entire generation nvidia has just been cutting things from the die, When you think about it, how close is the 9600GT in performance to the 8800GTX? sure its slower, but by how much? yet how much does it cost?

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
cheex, I will look down on you if you don't have dual 9800gx2's, 9900gtx when that comes out, etc. you must always have the latest and greatest hardware or you are nothing

ahaha dont tease sweet cheex....

Cheex get the best mang! get dual 3870x2's for x-firex or tri 9800gtx's for TriSli! Never look back and always look down on others!

LOL Bryan, that post made me laugh

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: nRollo
This is probably going nowhere, I should have stepped in earlier.

1. AFAIK, the shaders in the 9600GT are not re-done, this was not mentioned in the Editors conference on this part IIRC. I will verify this with NVIDIA.

2. The G9x series uses an internal data compression the G8x series doesn't use, but it's all G9x, not just the 9600GTs.

I'll verify the above and post here in this thread, so people can stop disabling blocks and running benches, my apologies for not jumping in earlier.

But it's fun!!

Thanks for checking on it for us.

 

[Tempered81]

expreview used the new 174 whql drivers that the 9600 runs on and put them on a 8800gt (g92). It boosts the 8800Gt's preformance as well. The "mystery magical filters" are driver side, and suitable for all g92's now, possibly via a modded driver INF...

http://www.laptopvideo2go.com/...ex.php?showtopic=17609

 

[manimal]

If anyone sees that driver modded post it in here and I will compare my G92GTS and my 9600GT at the same clocks. I have 2 machines at 3.6 with a quad so I can do a relatively decent comparison, After doing a few runs with the setups as they are now I will switch the cards to the opposite pcs to average the performance.

 

[Tempered81]

I just posted the modded driver. Im running it on my 8400GS mobile in my laptop now.

YGPM

 

[manimal]

woot thx J, im dowloading now and will let you guys know what I see.



merde....thats a vista driver, I only have vista on my dual boot machine that has the 9600GT on it....