A Moral Challenge

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,287
6,352
126
I find it rather interesting how people come at certain issues. We all have beliefs. How far will we go to push them on others?

If a person wants to commit suicide and you can prevent them from doing so, will you?

Should a person at the end of life have a right to die to avoid a lingering end?


How would you justify your decision?

 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,358
8,447
126
depends on if they want to commit suicide for the wrong reasons. i have no problem with someone terminally ill wanting to be put down. we do it with dogs and its humane. we keep people on life support when they're brain dead because we can't let go. its odd.
 

Kelvrick

Lifer
Feb 14, 2001
18,422
5
81
I would not stop them. I would just talk to them about it so that I can be sure that they have made the best decision in their mind.

<== monkey dance
 

Ronstang

Lifer
Jul 8, 2000
12,493
18
81
It depends upon the person....for instance, if you Moonbeam were going to commit suicide I would not stop you since you would finally shut up!
 

bolido2000

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2001
3,720
1
0
Someone who wants to suicide usually doesn't have its mind clear.
Thats like someone who wants to do drugs. You can't just let them fvck up their lives because they are choosing to do so at that moment.
 

SuepaFly

Senior member
Jun 3, 2001
972
0
0
My roommate suffers from depression and often threatens to commit suicide.

My conclusion is this, I will do everything I can to help, so long as I'm not choosing her life over mine. Lots of people have told me to jump ship a long time ago, but how can a person live with themselves if they don't try? Its not a question of pushing morals upon someone, people who want to commit suicide and let others know are crying for help. If they really wanted to commit suicide they would have done it quietly and secretly.
 

MinorityReport

Senior member
Jul 2, 2002
425
0
0
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I find it rather interesting how people come at certain issues. We all have beliefs. How far will we go to push them on others?

If a person wants to commit suicide and you can prevent them from doing so, will you?

Should a person at the end of life have a right to die to avoid a lingering end?


How would you justify your decision?

Correct me if I am wrong, but your moral dilemma above sounds very close to the concept of Palestinian Suicide Jihad or the Al Queda suicide squads.

Do you hve a secret liking for these acts deep inside you > DO you admire teh "courage" of these jihadis ?

If yes, then go join them and let GOd be with you

 

ed21x

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 2001
5,411
8
81
Originally posted by: her209
This is America. Its our right to force our beliefs onto others.

You should try visiting china. A couple years ago, some protestor from the United States took it upon himself to travel there and protest their human rights issue. The guy got beaten up and arrested Be happy that you live in a place where the government gives you the freedom to crap on them all day long.
 

thomsbrain

Lifer
Dec 4, 2001
18,148
1
0
you have a moral obligation to offer your help and support. and you have a moral obligation to then stand back and let them make their own choice.
 

Deeko

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
30,213
11
81
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I find it rather interesting how people come at certain issues. We all have beliefs. How far will we go to push them on others?

If a person wants to commit suicide and you can prevent them from doing so, will you?

Should a person at the end of life have a right to die to avoid a lingering end?


How would you justify your decision?

yes, and if that's what they want, yes
 

JupiterJones

Senior member
Jun 14, 2001
642
0
0
If a person wants to commit suicide and you can prevent them from doing so, will you?

Like grabbing their arm and pulling them off the ledge? Yes, it would be automatic.

Should a person at the end of life have a right to die to avoid a lingering end?

When you ask about a right to die, I assume you mean that there would be no law against the action. Everyone has the right to die, how can it be prevented.

Instead of having a right to die, the question should be whether it is ever right to die (i.e. suicide). Consider the following:

Seneca, knowing that Nero intended to take his life, had no
fear. He knew that he could defeat the Emperor. He knew that "at
the bottom of every river, in the coil of every rope, on the point
of every dagger, Liberty sat and smiled." He knew that it was his
own fault if he allowed himself to be tortured to death by his
enemy. He said: "There is this blessing, that while life has but
one entrance, it has exits innumerable, and as I choose the house
in which I live, the ship in which I will sail, so will I choose
the time and manner of my death."


For the Christian, I would say that we should depend on God's sovereignty and stay our own hand. We have the promise that we will not undergo anything that we cannot handle, and that God himself will provide the way out. There are many imaginable situations where the temptation to end your life would be present, but we are to resist temptation. It would be sinful for the Christian to commit suicide.

Balthasar Hubmair was burnt at the stake by Catholics in 1527. He told his followers that he would signal them if this death was bearable, and did so. Almost 20,000 people in Vienna came to Christ in the two years that followed his martyrdom. Would it have been better for him to kill himself, or to bravely suffer his execution?

For the non-believer, I would advise you to stay your hand for there is no relief in the grave.


 

scorp00

Senior member
Mar 21, 2001
994
0
71
I say give them a gun and see if they are really serious. Most people aren't serious and just say they want to die for attention.

I'm all for helping terminally ill people to die if they wish to. There's no need to suffer needlessly.
 

jayglick

Member
Oct 22, 2001
126
0
0
Originally posted by: thomsbrain
you have a moral obligation to offer your help and support. and you have a moral obligation to then stand back and let them make their own choice.

Obviously just your opinion of what my moral obligation is...
 

wolf papa

Senior member
Dec 12, 1999
738
0
0
I have known several people who chose to end their life. In all of those instances, their choice was a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Unfortunately, they could not see that there were other solutions, the situations overwhelmed them. So, I would intervene to the best of my ability, just because I've seen the questions and despair it leaves for the friends and family members. It's the most selfish act imaginable, and I can justify denying one person their choice, in the interest of those they would leave.

I differentiate between that, and someone suffering with an incurable illness.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
If you've received all the help that society can offer (drugs, psychological counselling, etc.) and still insist on wanting to kill yourself go for it. Life isn't worth living if you want to die.
 

lebe0024

Golden Member
Dec 6, 2000
1,101
0
76
One of the dumbest ideas of modern thought is "DON"T PUSH YOUR BELIEFS ON ME!!!" What a joke. Every day I thank God that someone "pushed" their beliefs on me.

With that said, if some one desires to kill themselves above all else, they're going to kill themselvse. There's really not that much I can do to MAKE them stop. I would, however, hope to help them think out their desires for suicide.
 

ATLien247

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2000
4,597
0
0
Being the cold-hearted bastard that I am, I would keep the person alive long enough to somehow get myself put into their will.

They're free to go after that...

 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,287
6,352
126
I'm visualizing this from this perspective. In the first case you act to override a person who has free will to choice to die if you, say, physically grab them, whereas in the second by voting to outlaw assisted suicide, you take away the person's free will. In both cases you go for life, but the first case the person remains free to try again but the second not. There seems to be a progression in how far you are willing to push your belief on others. You condemn someone to burn on the stake instead of taking a pill, for example, when that may not be their choice.

I'm curious, because being attacked here on ATOT so frequently of late, apparently, for a some anomalous 'sticktoitive' confidence in my own opinions, I've begun to delve into things that characterize my thinking and the thinking of others. There is little that I find more fascinating than what makes people think they are right. It becomes even more interesting as you begin to see how few people are.

In the case posed here, I would unquestioningly stop the first because I have some familiarity with the feeling and defeated it pretty totally, I think. The second example isn't so easy, but I can't bring myself to decide for another who has lived almost all the time they have, that they must not be given the choice of a death with the dignity of their choice.
 
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