A non-hater Seagate thread

[XavierMace]

Just doing my part to balance the Seagate threads. LOL.

Had my first failure out of the 12x 2TB Seagates. Drives have nearly 5 years of time (40,000+hours) on them. I honestly can't complain. Yeah, I know, small sample size and all but I've got no qualms about replacing it with another identical Seagate drive.

Now comes the fun of swapping the failed drive out of the pool.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Just doing my part to balance the Seagate threads. LOL.

Had my first failure out of the 12x 2TB Seagates. Drives have nearly 5 years of time (40,000+hours) on them. I honestly can't complain. Yeah, I know, small sample size and all but I've got no qualms about replacing it with another identical Seagate drive.

Now comes the fun of swapping the failed drive out of the pool.

What pooling software are you using? StableBit?

I'd think the inconvenience is the time it might take to complete, but if it is one of only 12 in the pool, that shouldn't be a major problem. If it's stablebit, you simply wait while it goes through its "Measuring" and "Balancing" operations. Hopefully you used enough of the duplication feature that there wouldn't be any data loss, or it would only be anticipated data-loss for unduplicated data.

 

[XavierMace]

ZFS on Solaris 11. It's a Z2 array, so no data loss. Everything on it is still running normally. It's not so much a problem as just an annoyance.

 

[JimmiG]

No problems with Seagate in general here, however at work we have a crate full of failed ST3000DM01's. This seems to be the only model that suffered abnormally high failure rates.

 

[Puffnstuff]

To be honest I've had drives fail from every manufacturer I've used, the most expensive one was my wd veloraptor 600gb. Unfortunately Seagate has provided me with the most failures of any manufacturer so I've stopped using them in favor of wd blacks. When finances permit I hope to run all ssd's in my pc.

 

[bigboxes]

They all fail. However, like puffy I've moved on to another, HGST. Was big time Seagate for years. Still have plenty still running reliably in my file server and as back up drives. Just not going to take a chance with my data.

 

[cbn]

Seagate did relatively well IMO according to the results posted in the following thread:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2473309

And the cumulative results (with the exception of the drives 3TB and smaller):

So I am thinking ST4000DM000 at $109.99 free shipping might be the bargain drive to get:

http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-SATA-...F8&qid=1463571699&sr=1-1&keywords=ST4000DM000

 

[Sheep221]

All those HDD failure charts are not well reflected to home and office users. They use them on servers, mainly cloud storage etc where even the most reliable drives usually wear out and fail. It is very unlikely the home user would have 10% failure rate even if he would be running same amount of specific drives as that data center, reason is simple, the end users don't process the same amounts of data compared to datacenters. Even if you have the worst seagate model, it's still very unlikely it will stop working. However as a precaution everyone should backup their data regularly no matter what.

 

[Elixer]

All those HDD failure charts are not well reflected to home and office users. They use them on servers, mainly cloud storage etc where even the most reliable drives usually wear out and fail. It is very unlikely the home user would have 10% failure rate even if he would be running same amount of specific drives as that data center, reason is simple, the end users don't process the same amounts of data compared to datacenters. Even if you have the worst seagate model, it's still very unlikely it will stop working. However as a precaution everyone should backup their data regularly no matter what.

Of course, the reverse of that is, if they can withstand the punishment of what Backblaze is using them for, then, the home user should be more confident in the ones that rated the highest.

 

[Topweasel]

All those HDD failure charts are not well reflected to home and office users. They use them on servers, mainly cloud storage etc where even the most reliable drives usually wear out and fail. It is very unlikely the home user would have 10% failure rate even if he would be running same amount of specific drives as that data center, reason is simple, the end users don't process the same amounts of data compared to datacenters. Even if you have the worst seagate model, it's still very unlikely it will stop working. However as a precaution everyone should backup their data regularly no matter what.

I don't know the Backblaze while a worst case scenario does seem to mirror real world results. I mean for someone who hasn't had more than 1 HDD failure in 20 years while owning several glass platter Deathstars (45GXP, 60GXP, 2x120GXP, and the final 160GXP) and probably a total of 75-100 drives throughout the years. I bought 3 of the ST3000DM01 drives. 1 was failing and I have retired it. One was failing and I quickly tried to move data off the drive, mid way through it died completely and causes the machine to not boot if its connected at power up.

I am not going to trash Seagate and honestly one of the strong points of these drives was that they were the first high capacity drives post flood to come back down to regular pricing. But at this point the problems with the ST3000DM01 model should probably be considered fact. We have both anecdotal and empirical evidence that they are problematic and prone to spontaneous and even when not spontaneous earlier deaths than spindle drives normally experience.

I fully approve of a thread that wants to cover the leaps and bounds they have jumped since then. But its just plain silly to try to whitewash that issue.

 

[bigboxes]

I fully approve of a thread that wants to cover the leaps and bounds they have jumped since then. But its just plain silly to try to whitewash that issue.

Yeah, I think that Seagate are still a valid OEM. But this is something that really happened. It's difficult to put a value on your data and uptime.

 

[jumpncrash]

I work for a dedicated server company, in the datacenters, conditions are definitely not ideal, but at one point the vast majority of our drives were 1 and 2 tb seagates...lets just say we changed alot. So many in fact, that we have moved away from seagate completely. We now use HGST drives, but there are still a ton of seagates from that era that are still running. Whenever we have to do maintenance and we see one we're always amazed.

 

[tweakboy]

Seagate and Maxtor both blow! Try WD gl

 

[AlienTech]

I just got a 8TB SMR drive that seems to perform just as well as the WDC 8TB reds so I am happy with it. And I have 2 of those 2TB drives with the deeper indent that are great drives so I got the exact 3TB model which is the worst drive I have ever used. I also have a 1TB drve which is really cool and fast but the 1.5TB drive runs extremely hot and at the time was the fastest drive so I was happy with it even knowing it would fail before the 5 year warranty was over and it did and the replacement drive already got 2 relocated sectors with less than 100 hours of use but I also have a 2TB drive that has over 32000 bad sectors and still work.. So the rest of the 2TB's I only use as cold storage drives. I just scavenged a 6GB drive from 1997 for the magnets which worked just fine.. And I got 2 external 2TB's and one of them failed in a week.. They sent an old refurbished replacement so was not happy with that.

So what does this say? Well the information on seagate drives are lacking and it is really a toss up. Good luck with that 2TB drive replacement.. It is not as simple as you think.. But if you are lucky it might work out.. People learn such things the hard way... I have been trying out other drives even if they cost 10-25% more now after my experiences.. Seagate now questions warranty replacements. They replaced the 5 year old 1.5TB drive but not the 1TB drive which failed and no communication either and they changed the web pages so finding information is even more difficult.. They also changed the forums and they had some really experienced people in them who were very technical and could help with failures and such. Did you know that most drive failures would just short out the MOV's and all you needed to do to get them working again was to just clip their leads off? All that info is now lost.

So seagate is hiding more and more details on their drives so as to fool the most people most of the time. The higher than standard failure rates is fine for the price but the time it takes and the hassles of recovering data if possible and the difficulty now in finding any information means people like me who are technical and have means for data recovery and knowledge don't think it is worth the cheaper price. I would rather pay 25% extra to get a drive with half the failure rates. Because of the black box nature of things now it does in the end save you more money. Just because I had a 2 decade old drive working just fine and I just got a new drive from them don't mean I am fond of them or prefer them to others.. If given a choice I would choose someone else. And wait until you run into trouble getting your replacement drive working.. Maybe you will end up lucky.. If not you will be back here saying you don't know what happened.. It should work and maybe you did something wrong.. Most likely you did not and you just happened to fall into the seagate marketing and sales dark hole.

 

[nerp]

All those HDD failure charts are not well reflected to home and office users. They use them on servers, mainly cloud storage etc where even the most reliable drives usually wear out and fail. It is very unlikely the home user would have 10% failure rate even if he would be running same amount of specific drives as that data center, reason is simple, the end users don't process the same amounts of data compared to datacenters. Even if you have the worst seagate model, it's still very unlikely it will stop working. However as a precaution everyone should backup their data regularly no matter what.

People who care about the backblaze data often are running home NAS stuff. Myself, I have a small home server box with 8 drives running 24/7. They story my data, videos and media content that is used by the whole family. Four of the drives in there are going on 7 years old with no problems and healthy reports from Crystaldisk. They are WD greens, blacks and HGST.

Of all the drives I've used over the years, and I've used plenty, I've had only two failures. Both were seagates. Go figure.

Today, I see the choice between WD Red and HGST for my purposes. Seagate, even if they fixed all their problems 100% already, has some years to go before actual confidence is built again.

And anecdotally, I've seen dozens of friends and family members with failed hard drives. Always a seagate.

 

[nerp]

Also, Seagate is laying off thousands. The lack of skilled tech support, quality service and engagement with users on forums might be explained by the layoffs.

 

[pimpin-tl]

I've had enough Seagate stuff over the past 25 years to know that Seagate makes crappy stuff. I have honestly NEVER had a Western Digital drive fail on me, but I have had MANY Seagates fail. I as of recently decided to not purchase Seagate any more.

 

[ronbo613]

I don't hate Seagate, I just don't buy them

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I don't hate Seagate, I just don't buy them

Those manufacturers all go through "bad years."

At one time in the '90s, I had a couple Seagate drives -- maybe SCSI-II or -III can't remember -- which ran hot, people said they ran hot, and I could see it myself. Started buying more WD drives.

Then, just like PuffnStuff, I had that same problematic WD VelociRaptor 600GB. And it went south, too.

I started using Seagates again when I built a RAID5 from 4x 320GB units, and never had a problem with them. More recently in 2014, I had to choose between WD "Reds" and Seagate NAS drives. For any number of good reasons but no less for the reviews I'd seen, I purchased the latter.

I'd love to have several of those HGST's. But I've had no problem with the Seagates.

 

[XavierMace]

So what does this say? Well the information on seagate drives are lacking and it is really a toss up. Good luck with that 2TB drive replacement.. It is not as simple as you think.. But if you are lucky it might work out..

Yes it is as simple as I think.

zpool offline
zpool replace

 

[Ranulf]

I've good luck with seagates over the years, especially the externals. But I have a 1.5TB external that only holds game backups that are not a big loss if it goes and one of the famously bad ST3000 3tb internal models that while noisy, is running fine after 1.5 years.

I've had more WD drives die on me but then I run more WD drives than any other brand.

*Knocks on wood.

 

[Elixer]

Also, Seagate is laying off thousands. The lack of skilled tech support, quality service and engagement with users on forums might be explained by the layoffs.

They are doing what WD is doing... 8000 cut from WD as well.

It is a race to the bottom, so, expect products that are made even more cheaper than before. I wouldn't be shocked if they both trim the warranty to 6 months.

Sad days.

 

[VirtualLarry]

They are doing what WD is doing... 8000 cut from WD as well.

It is a race to the bottom, so, expect products that are made even more cheaper than before. I wouldn't be shocked if they both trim the warranty to 6 months.

Sad days.

I wouldn't expect them to do that, and expect to keep any of the lucrative branded-OEM drive supply contracts. Most branded-OEM PCs come with a 1-year warranty.

 

[master_shake_]

i've had 12 seagate st2000dm001's in a RAID 6 since 09 and only have had 1 failure.

not really a failure when your kid takes out a drive and drops it....

the only gripe i have is the lack of 1 tb platters.

even though they were supposed to be.

as of late my only drive purchases have been toshibas.

love those drives.

22 in a norco 4224 and only 1 failure.

 

[ronbo613]

Those manufacturers all go through "bad years."

At one time in the '90s, I had a couple Seagate drives -- maybe SCSI-II or -III can't remember -- which ran hot, people said they ran hot, and I could see it myself. Started buying more WD drives.

Then, just like PuffnStuff, I had that same problematic WD VelociRaptor 600GB. And it went south, too.

I started using Seagates again when I built a RAID5 from 4x 320GB units, and never had a problem with them. More recently in 2014, I had to choose between WD "Reds" and Seagate NAS drives. For any number of good reasons but no less for the reviews I'd seen, I purchased the latter.

I'd love to have several of those HGST's. But I've had no problem with the Seagates.

I've had more than a few Seagate drives. When they started failing, I went to WD, which are good hard drives, especially the Blacks. Now I use HGST, which are also good drives.

I'm not brand loyal when it comes to hard drives, I try to get the best drive for the money.