abstinence only education works?

ElFenix

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http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/6846398.html

In the first carefully designed study to evaluate the controversial approach to sex ed, researchers found that only about a third of sixth- and seventh-graders who went through sessions focused on abstinence started having sex in the next two years. In contrast, nearly half of students who got other classes, including those that included information about contraception, became sexually active.

i wonder if that makes programs designed as this one was (apparently without the moral overtones) candidates for federal funds?
 
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StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
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No way. Abstinence is what religious people preach and by definition that's wrong. Give kids condoms, tell them experimentation is ok, tell them that 1/4 of all boys and 1/6 of all girls (I remember this stat well) have a homosexual experience, open the gates, and let them have at it.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,147
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There might be a delay, but there are also higher Teen Pregnancy rates amongst the same group. So pick your poison.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
I don't think abstinence education where they tell people it is better to wait till you are married and try to use religion or morals works that well because most kids will take it as being talked down to.

What does work is having them change diapers, feed babies and get spit up on and talking to people that are in jail for child support.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
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The damning thing about the abstinence only group lies in two facts. The spirit may be initially willing but the flesh is almost always weak. And when that sad or happy day comes when they fall off the wagon, the damn fools don't know anything about birth control or safe sex. Making them sitting ducks for unwanted pregnancy or aids. And yes, many in that group think anal sex with a female is not really sex.
 

Strk

Lifer
Nov 23, 2003
10,198
4
76
If I'm not mistaken, most studies have found abstinence-only education does make people wait a little longer and have fewer partners, but does nothing to decrease STD rates. I believe one study even found an increased likelihood of things other than coitus to fulfill a few needs. I guess it doesn't count if it's in a different hole.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
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The damning thing about the abstinence only group lies in two facts. The spirit may be initially willing but the flesh is almost always weak. And when that sad or happy day comes when they fall off the wagon, the damn fools don't know anything about birth control or safe sex. Making them sitting ducks for unwanted pregnancy or aids. And yes, many in that group think anal sex with a female is not really sex.
Like the afghanis, it's not gay if you don't love him
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,147
5,664
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The damning thing about the abstinence only group lies in two facts. The spirit may be initially willing but the flesh is almost always weak. And when that sad or happy day comes when they fall off the wagon, the damn fools don't know anything about birth control or safe sex. Making them sitting ducks for unwanted pregnancy or aids. And yes, many in that group think anal sex with a female is not really sex.

Yup. It is a Religion Fail, primarily. People have to ask themselves Why is it a "Sin". It was primarily because there was no Birth Control or ways to avoid disease, so Sex before Marriage was a major Social problem. Back then a Teen could also be Married and not have to boil with hormones for near a decade of their Lives either. So trying to live by an Ancient standard(no Sex before Marriage) mixed with Modern Standards(Waiting until 18+ before Marriage) is a ridiculous endeavor. Some can/will manage it, but certainly not all or even most.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
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What is also disturbing is that the Federal Government used to fund these abstinence only programs big time long after statistics showed them to be extremely ineffective.
 

ElFenix

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glad there's a lot of responses about the program in the link and the results of the study
 

child of wonder

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Aug 31, 2006
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So only about 1/3 of these kids had sex after going through abstinence only education prior to 9th grade?

So abstinence only education is claiming that if only 1/3 of all 14 years old have had sex this is something to be proud of?
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
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And the teen pregnancies between the two groups are what, i.e., was the percentage of teens that got pregnant more for one group than the other group?
 

GTKeeper

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Apr 14, 2005
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I don't see why giving away condoms and the pill is a bad thing.

I think what people need to understand is that the correlation between a teen mother (and this goes up a lot more if she's single) and the chance that her child will end up a criminal is VERY high. Read the book Tipping Point, or Outliers (its in one of those)

Whether you like it or not, condoms, the pill contribute to LOWERING the crime rate because we have less pregnancies.

I don't think if you hand out condoms or the pill that automatically causes teens to have more sex. In my high school (back in the day) you knew EXACTLY who was having sex and who was not and it had very little to do with the fact if they had sex education or not, or whether they had access to condoms or the pill.

Society just needs to get over itself in terms of 'abstinence or no abstinence' and just focus on FACTS and how we can mitigate things instead of flat out trying to eliminate things that are impossible to eliminate.
 

ElFenix

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And the teen pregnancies between the two groups are what, i.e., was the percentage of teens that got pregnant more for one group than the other group?

not sure, but the article does include this:
The abstinence program had no negative effects on condom use, which has been a major criticism of the approach.

so, condom use amongst those having sex is the same, number of people having sex in the abstinence group is lower, the logical conclusion is that the teen pregnancy rate is lower in the abstinence education group.

i hope they will do follow ups to find out this information, if they already haven't.
 

ElFenix

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I don't see why giving away condoms and the pill is a bad thing.

I think what people need to understand is that the correlation between a teen mother (and this goes up a lot more if she's single) and the chance that her child will end up a criminal is VERY high. Read the book Tipping Point, or Outliers (its in one of those)

Whether you like it or not, condoms, the pill contribute to LOWERING the crime rate because we have less pregnancies.

I don't think if you hand out condoms or the pill that automatically causes teens to have more sex. In my high school (back in the day) you knew EXACTLY who was having sex and who was not and it had very little to do with the fact if they had sex education or not, or whether they had access to condoms or the pill.

Society just needs to get over itself in terms of 'abstinence or no abstinence' and just focus on FACTS and how we can mitigate things instead of flat out trying to eliminate things that are impossible to eliminate.

and if it turns out the best way to mitigate is abstinence only education?

Over the next two years, 33.5 percent of the students who went through the abstinence program started having sex, compared to 52 percent who were just taught safe sex.
About 42 percent who went through the comprehensive program started having sex, and about 48.5 percent of those who just learned about other ways to be healthy. The abstinence program had no negative effects on condom use, which has been a major criticism of the approach.
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
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Are small federal government, states rights folks for federal funds being used for abstinence only education?
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
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Works fine if you go all-the-way. To include stoning, flogging and separation of male and female excepting relatives. When I was in Saudi girls had to show their bloody consummation post marriage. None have issues due to shame it brings and in some cases death.
 
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DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
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So: it fails for the God-based, anti-contraceptive programs that socially conservative Republicans like and Bush funded, but works for a program they'd dislike that doesn't demonize premarital sex or condoms.

I'm OK with funding this kind of program if the research shows it works. Science!
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
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Yup. It is a Religion Fail, primarily. People have to ask themselves Why is it a "Sin". It was primarily because there was no Birth Control or ways to avoid disease, so Sex before Marriage was a major Social problem. Back then a Teen could also be Married and not have to boil with hormones for near a decade of their Lives either. So trying to live by an Ancient standard(no Sex before Marriage) mixed with Modern Standards(Waiting until 18+ before Marriage) is a ridiculous endeavor. Some can/will manage it, but certainly not all or even most.

Do you have any argument against kids of any age having sex?
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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No way. Abstinence is what religious people preach and by definition that's wrong. Give kids condoms, tell them experimentation is ok, tell them that 1/4 of all boys and 1/6 of all girls (I remember this stat well) have a homosexual experience, open the gates, and let them have at it.


You just said that the schools should tell my daughter to start fucking. If anyone does that, they will have to talk to me personally. That would be most unpleasant for them, especially after my lawyer gets done with them too.


I'm hoping that's sarcasm on your part.
 
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Zstream

Diamond Member
Oct 24, 2005
3,396
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You just said that the schools should tell my daughter to start fucking. If anyone does that, they will have to talk to me personally. That would be most unpleasant for them, especially after my lawyer gets done with them too.


I'm hoping that's sarcasm on your part.

What this man just said.
 
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