AGP vs PCI Express

[vision33r]

Why are there so many ranters about AGP support over PCI Express? There are so many choices as far as videocards and we are moving forward by dropping support for slower parts.

And yet so many people rant about not adopting PCI Express based system. Even as ATI fans, Crossfire and future ATI cards will all be native PCI Express based and adding converters are gonna hurt performance.

 

[cbehnken]

CPU development has been slow the last few years. So, everyone with an nforce3/agp system still can have a fast cpu and won't be able to use the latest video cards.

If CPU development had been much faster and AMD would've forced a socket change like Intel the AGP/PCI-E battle would be almost over.

 

[biostud]

people don't want to spend money if it's not necesary.

 

[vision33r]

Originally posted by: biostud
people don't want to spend money if it's not necesary.

I guess computer geeks are stingy compared to car guys. Even if that extra $2k for new turbo that make the car faster just 0.5 secs is worth it to them.

 

[Beiruty]

In Acceleration 0.5 or 1s is a big deal it is like 10 car length lead in a drag race! It is like 100 ft in 1302 ft race.

 

[So]

You do realize that none of the cards out there saturate the AGP bus with data yet, right? People are reluctant to change because the benefits are simply not there performance wise.

The switch to PCIe is strictly for architectural benerits, not for the end user.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: vision33r
Why are there so many ranters about AGP support over PCI Express? There are so many choices as far as videocards and we are moving forward by dropping support for slower parts.

And yet so many people rant about not adopting PCI Express based system. Even as ATI fans, Crossfire and future ATI cards will all be native PCI Express based and adding converters are gonna hurt performance.

Maybe, EXCEPT THAT'S NOT TRUE, THEY ARE NOT SLOWER.

 

[BillyBobJoel71]

pci-e has the same performance as agp. i am not going to pci-e until my ocmputer dies. no point, and a waste of money now.

 

[CKTurbo128]

I hear so many people claim that people with AGP systems are using "slow, budget CPUs" and that PCI-Express video cards are much faster than their AGP varients. Totally wrong.

So many forget about S939 nForce 3 users that are equipped with AGP who are capable of using just as fast and the latest CPUs (i.e. Athlon 64 X2 with BIOS update) as nForce 4 users. Also, don't forget about the use of Pentium-M on older, Pentium 4 AGP motherboards (via Pentium M adapter), which competes very well against high-end A64s when overclocked.

 

[ryanv12]

I have an Asus A8V Deluxe, and with the money I have to spend on a computer I can afford a 7800GTX and X2 4200+. Unfortunately, my motherboard isn't going to work with with that GTX, but there's no money left in my max budget for a new motherboard. Surely I could just wait or put a little more money into my budget, but why waste my money? This change is being forced on me unnecessarily and I wouldn't see an improvement. The evil part is, that nvidia knows I'm just going to splurge a little extra for a new motherboard because I have no choice, and they also know it's most likely going to be an nforce4 motherboard, and even more money in their pockets. Do I expect them to make an AGP part when they know they can get more money out of me? No. Would it be nice? Yes, but I guess that's business.

When my Windows goes BSOD because of having to put in a new motherboard, I'm going to be annoyed at having to reinstall every darn thing on my computer again. This is why I wish ATI was still in the game because then they might force high-end AGP parts.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: vision33r

Originally posted by: biostud
people don't want to spend money if it's not necesary.

I guess computer geeks are stingy compared to car guys. Even if that extra $2k for new turbo that make the car faster just 0.5 secs is worth it to them.

because .5 sec is like 30 fps in computers!!!

 

[Sforsyth]

I'm happy with my XP3200 and AGP for the next maybe 3 years

 

[Sokratz]

Yeah it's sad, I would have been happy w/my xp2500 oc'd all crazy and 9800pro, but now i'm in this stupid connundrum about pci-e vs agp. i can afford a new cpu and mobo, but not really a new cpu, mobo, and gpu.

 

[gac009]

Everyone is going to convert to PCI-E, just not right now. We will change to PCI-E when we get new MBs and CPUs and we will get new MBs when the old MBs and CPUs need changing. Right now they dont.

 

[Beiruty]

The only question, why in the world they designed a new PCI-e? AGP was not a bottleneck. More High-speed devices are integrated on the motherboard. The only thing really new is SLI?Crossfire which is NOT aValue proposition.

PCI-e ? What is the advantage?

 

[jim1976]

Well you can always take a new pci-e mobo in s754 so that you don't need to buy a new cpu too. My 3400+ @2700MHz right now should suffice for the next year as well as a good performer cpu so I'm limiting my budget as well.
I know I have to change my mobo again when I'll take a new cpu (probably when Longhorn arrives) but it is a solution for me.

 

[NokiaDude]

PCI-e is all about the SLI action. Those with AGP systems ae stuck with one video card.

 

[imported_TheRipper]

Originally posted by: vision33r
Why are there so many ranters about AGP support over PCI Express? There are so many choices as far as videocards and we are moving forward by dropping support for slower parts.

And yet so many people rant about not adopting PCI Express based system. Even as ATI fans, Crossfire and future ATI cards will all be native PCI Express based and adding converters are gonna hurt performance.

That is not true. The 6800 Ultra and the X850XT crossed over fine to AGP, PCIE card held no advantage at all over the AGP versions.

ATI is going to release PCIE and AGP versions of the R520 if they can ever get it launched. At that point we will see if the PCIE version is faster. So far the two interfaces have been dead even, with the early PCIE versions getting beaten in some cases.

It is nothing to get steamed over really. I'll run what I can afford to run. I am not hurting at the moment.

 

[addinator]

Originally posted by: Beiruty
The only question, why in the world they designed a new PCI-e? AGP was not a bottleneck. More High-speed devices are integrated on the motherboard. The only thing really new is SLI?Crossfire which is NOT aValue proposition.

PCI-e ? What is the advantage?

PCI-e gives you 16 pipelines to run info through, instead of the 8 pipelines which an agp has. though, at the moment, there isn't much utilizing the extra 8 pipelines. in theory, it can give you double the performance of an AGP slot, still having only one card. though, don't be fooled, in SLI each card is pulled back to 8 pipelines, to add up to 16. thus, allowing the two graphics cards to run correctly.

future ATI cards will all be native PCI Express based and adding converters are gonna hurt performance.

they aren't really converting from pci-e to agp, they simply take the technology and build it differently for the respective part, AGP or PCI-e. now i'm not saying they totally rebuild the card, but its not as if they port it like we see in games (such as a console game being ported to the pc).

 

[Megatomic]

Originally posted by: Sokratz
Yeah it's sad, I would have been happy w/my xp2500 oc'd all crazy and 9800pro, but now i'm in this stupid connundrum about pci-e vs agp. i can afford a new cpu and mobo, but not really a new cpu, mobo, and gpu.

Oh Happy Day!
Now we both can run AGP video cards with the newest AMD cpu's. :heart: