Alcoholism is not a disease.

[Amused]

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.
.

Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

BULLSH1T

While they may lack the self control to control their drinking once they've started (the same as I am with my addictions) they DO have the ability to avoid alcohol completely.

This is why addicts MUST live in a black and white world when it comes to the objects of their addictions. They lack only the control to moderate their use. They DO NOT lack the control to avoid use altogether.

I know addiction very well. It is, and always will be, a CHOICE.

Millions of dry and clean addicts prove you 100% wrong.

 

[Scarpozzi]

It's not a disease. It's a profession.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.
.

Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

WTF? Are you being sarcastic, or are you really that deluded?

 

[Megatomic]

Originally posted by: shilala
Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

How can this be? And why don't you take any responsibility for your situation? And especially how can you not be responsible for taking your first drink???? We're you predestined to drink that very drink and become an alcoholic?

ps - in every case "you" is meant to refer to all alcoholics collectively

 

[Megatomic]

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.
.

Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

WTF? Are you being sarcastic, or are you really that deluded?

I think that the "experts" tell them this to make them feel better about themselves.

 

[shilala]

Originally posted by: Megatomic

Originally posted by: Amused
I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I've used highly addictive products before but never really became addicted to them. I gave up smokes and chew and never really felt pain over it. And I did use them regularly. My wife is pissed because she can't quit smoking and I made it look so easy...

It's funny, isn't it?
I've kicked cigarettes, no big deal. I've tried every drug in the cabinet, most of them to excess. None of them ever stuck.
Alcohol and Snuff. Aaargh. I don't drink any more, but it took a hell of a lot of help. I don't know if they have a snuff rehab. It wouldn't work anyways because I have no desire to quit (even if I say so).
I'm hopelessly addicted to having friction applied to my pecker. I'm not going to the friction rehab, either.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Megatomic

Originally posted by: Amused
I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I've used highly addictive products before but never really became addicted to them. I gave up smokes and chew and never really felt pain over it. And I did use them regularly. My wife is pissed because she can't quit smoking and I made it look so easy...

It's funny, isn't it?
I've kicked cigarettes, no big deal. I've tried every drug in the cabinet, most of them to excess. None of them ever stuck.
Alcohol and Snuff. Aaargh. I don't drink any more, but it took a hell of a lot of help. I don't know if they have a snuff rehab. It wouldn't work anyways because I have no desire to quit (even if I say so).
I'm hopelessly addicted to having friction applied to my pecker. I'm not going to the friction rehab, either.

The only adiction you were born with in that last list is friction on the pecker. All else is a carefully created illusion to help exlplain a severe lack of self control.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: Megatomic

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.
.

Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

WTF? Are you being sarcastic, or are you really that deluded?

I think that the "experts" tell them this to make them feel better about themselves.

Yes. That said, nhe vast majoity of psychology is complete BS. People beleived somatotyping and phrenology for ages while the self-proclaimed experts did.

 

[DBL]

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.

I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I'd have to disagree here. An alcoholic does not have the ability to choose to stop drinking. They have a PHYSICAL addiction. By not drinking their body goes into withdrawal. Yes, once they have beaten the physical withdrawal, they can physically avoid drinking but considering their often depressed state (most likely caused by their alcoholism), they usually relapse. It's a viscous cycle.

 

[Vic]

Alcoholism is a choice. If it wasn't, then AA wouldn't work (but it does). Some people just have harder choices to make than others. Nothing new there.

 

[brigden]

There isn't a moron in this thread in a position to equivically state whether alcoholism is a true disease or simply a self-induced condition.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.

I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I'd have to disagree here. An alcoholic does not have the ability to choose to stop drinking. They have a PHYSICAL addiction. By not drinking their body goes into withdrawal. Yes, once they have beaten the physical withdrawal, they can physically avoid drinking but considering their often depressed state (most likely caused by their alcoholism), they usually relapse. It's a viscous cycle.

The high viscosity of the cycle does not mean that after the initial drink it was predetermined that the drinker would become the drunk.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.

I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I'd have to disagree here. An alcoholic does not have the ability to choose to stop drinking. They have a PHYSICAL addiction. By not drinking their body goes into withdrawal. Yes, once they have beaten the physical withdrawal, they can physically avoid drinking but considering their often depressed state (most likely caused by their alcoholism), they usually relapse. It's a viscous cycle.

Millions of dry alcoholics who CHOSE to stop and did so on their own prove you wrong.

Not to mention millions of clean drug and nicotine addicts such as myself.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.

I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I'd have to disagree here. An alcoholic does not have the ability to choose to stop drinking. They have a PHYSICAL addiction. By not drinking their body goes into withdrawal. Yes, once they have beaten the physical withdrawal, they can physically avoid drinking but considering their often depressed state (most likely caused by their alcoholism), they usually relapse. It's a viscous cycle.

And they have, and usualy ignore, the option to get help both before and after it becomes a serious proxlem.

 

[DBL]

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox
Yes. That said, nhe vast majoity of psychology is complete BS. People beleived somatotyping and phrenology for ages while the self-proclaimed experts did.

Who said anything about psychology? Alcoholism is a disease and the vast majority of medical doctors will tell you the same.

 

[Jacob910]

There is plenty of science that some of our behavior is from genetics, it does not matter that so many uneducated and ill informed people will make bold statements that alcoholism is not a disease.

 

[Megatomic]

Originally posted by: brigden
There isn't a moron in this thread in a position to equivically state whether alcoholism is a true disease or simply a self-induced condition.

There isn't a moron in this thread in a position to equivically state whether there's a moron in this thread who's in a position to equivically state whether alcoholism is a true disease or simply a self-induced condition.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox
Yes. That said, nhe vast majoity of psychology is complete BS. People beleived somatotyping and phrenology for ages while the self-proclaimed experts did.

Who said anything about psychology? Alcoholism is a disease and the vast majority of medical doctors will tell you the same.

It's ALL in the mind. ALL of it. Your body can becowe accustomed to the chemical presence, but that occurs because of a choice.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: loic2003
It's a lifestyle

QFT

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox
Yes. That said, nhe vast majoity of psychology is complete BS. People beleived somatotyping and phrenology for ages while the self-proclaimed experts did.

Who said anything about psychology? Alcoholism is a disease and the vast majority of medical doctors will tell you the same.

They call all addictions a disease.

It is not. It is a choice.

If it were not a choice, millions of alcoholics would not be dry, yet functioning freely in society. Yet they are.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: brigden
There isn't a moron in this thread in a position to equivically state whether alcoholism is a true disease or simply a self-induced condition.

LOL. Sure there is, lots of us.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.

I've kicked two of the strongest addictions known to man. Both were hell to go through, but in the end, it was ALL up to me. It was a simple, but agonizing CHOICE to STOP.

In the end, addiction is NOT a disease. It is a choice.

I'd have to disagree here. An alcoholic does not have the ability to choose to stop drinking. They have a PHYSICAL addiction. By not drinking their body goes into withdrawal. Yes, once they have beaten the physical withdrawal, they can physically avoid drinking but considering their often depressed state (most likely caused by their alcoholism), they usually relapse. It's a viscous cycle.

So what you're saying is that alcoholism is exactly like any other chemical dependency. So... in learning to overcome this dependency (which only came into existence by the initial CHOICE to start drinking), one can empower oneself to quit forever (which is what AA teaches), or one can victimizes oneself into believing that there is no choice and thus no hope. Obviously, you want to believe the latter. Recovering alcoholics around the world hope you enjoy it in hell.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: DBL

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox
Yes. That said, nhe vast majoity of psychology is complete BS. People beleived somatotyping and phrenology for ages while the self-proclaimed experts did.

Who said anything about psychology? Alcoholism is a disease and the vast majority of medical doctors will tell you the same.

So. People think there is a God, too. That proves nothing.

 

[shilala]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: shilala

Originally posted by: Amused
While it is true that some people are more easily addicted to alcohol, it is STILL a choice to keep drinking, or dry out.

No matter how heavily one is addicted, the CHOICE is still there.
.

Absolutely 100% wrong. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter of drink on any level, at any time, in any situation. Never did, never will. That goes for before picking up a drink, after picking it up, or before they ever took their first drink.

BULLSH1T

While they may lack the self control to control their drinking once they've started (the same as I am with my addictions) they DO have the ability to avoid alcohol completely.

This is why addicts MUST live in a black and white world when it comes to the objects of their addictions. They lack only the control to moderate their use. They DO NOT lack the control to avoid use altogether.

I know addiction very well. It is, and always will be, a CHOICE.

Millions of dry and clean addicts prove you 100% wrong.

Maybe it's simply the word "choice" that doesn't work for me. I do get your point.
Don't pick it up and it can't get away from you makes perfectly good sense.
Thing is, somewhere along the way in my alcoholic career, I completely lost the ability to exercise my "choice" on whether or not to pick it up.
I needed it and relied on it as much as oxygen. I picked it up to survive. It was that or a bullet in the melon.
Now I do have a choice. I can choose to get the ongoing help I need to control the problem. I can choose to do what I need to do to keep from ending up like I was.
I chose literally thousands of times not to drink and still did. I chose thousands of times not to continue drinking once I started, but still did.
I don't know what it's called when you choose to do something and it doesn't work out.
Lack of willpower, maybe. I liken willpower to trying not to shyt when I have diarrhea.
I don't want to shyt my pants if there's no toilet available. I can choose not to shyt my pants. If it's coming, it's coming.
I can't stop it.

 

[91TTZ]

It stems from a lack of self control. The drinking itself is a choice, so you can't put the blame anywhere else. Unfortunately some people have the odds stacked against them a bit and lack the ability to control their urges very well. Some people have addictive personalities where they seem to get addicted to just about anything. They can't control their urges.

I have a completely non-addictive personality and if anything, I lack motivation. I don't get addicted to anything (and I've partied with some hard sh!t). Unfortunately, a couple of my friends weren't able to handle it, and they got hooked.