With the release of Alder Lake less than a week away and the "Lakes" thread having turned into a nightmare to navigate I thought it might be a good time to start a discussion thread solely for Alder Lake.
Wasn't there another Alder Lake die in the works that was 6P + 0E? Those could come with AVX-512 enabled out of the box since there is less of an excuse to not have it enabled, except market segmentation.AVX512 seems like a real flaw of the Alder Lake design. A lot of silicon that is just being turned off.
I wonder if they are going to squeeze AVX512 into to future E-Cores.
All this E-core brouhaha could have been easily avoided with right-click context menu options "Run with P-cores only" and "Run with E-cores only". Would have been piece of cake for Microsoft to add those options.
Do the E-cores disappear from Task Manager when you press Scroll Lock?In the BIOS you can set the scroll lock to enable/disable the E cores. Problem solved.
Leaving that kind of performance changing decisions to the clueless end user is terribad, anybody smart enough to understand which group is going to give him better performance or efficiency or whatever can easily do this with task manager' affinity settings, or by making a shortcut including these settings.All this E-core brouhaha could have been easily avoided with right-click context menu options "Run with P-cores only" and "Run with E-cores only". Would have been piece of cake for Microsoft to add those options.
Do the E-cores disappear from Task Manager when you press Scroll Lock?
All this E-core brouhaha could have been easily avoided with right-click context menu options "Run with P-cores only" and "Run with E-cores only". Would have been piece of cake for Microsoft to add those options.
Still, Windows has plenty of power user options available in the UI, like show "Show hidden and system files" or *shudder* "Format" right there in the Drive right-click context menu which doesn't really provide any helpful information about what it really does. I bet there are quite a few people out there who found out the hard way what it does. I think my dad was one of them because I remember when I asked him what the Format option does in Excel back when we got our first PC, he immediately forbid me to click it, saying it would destroy all data! I clicked it anyway when he wasn't around and found, much to my delight, that I could make colorful cells. Also, I would love to know if anyone other than him clears the gridlines in Excel and then writes a frickin' letter in itLeaving that kind of performance changing decisions to the clueless end user is terribad, anybody smart enough to understand which group is going to give him better performance or efficiency or whatever can easily do this with task manager' affinity settings, or by making a shortcut including these settings.
The entire point of Thread Director is offering a seamless experience to the user. Microsoft adding these options would make it clear that for the time being the scheduler cannot offer optimal performance.All this E-core brouhaha could have been easily avoided with right-click context menu options "Run with P-cores only" and "Run with E-cores only". Would have been piece of cake for Microsoft to add those options.
The entire point of Thread Director is offering a seamless experience to the user. Microsoft adding these options would make it clear that for the time being the scheduler cannot offer optimal performance.
I'd rather see continuous development effort from Intel/MS than a crude UI switch that tells the user the most advanced chips from Intel could use human scheduling help. The upcoming desktop & mobile launch in 2022 could be a great occasion for a software update.
Even Ian complained that his particular use case wasn't handled gracefully by Thread Director. The whole Alder Lake affair seems kinda rushed, like they were tweaking stuff till the last minute. I understand that Microsoft can't provide an Alder Lake specific option without go ahead from Intel and Intel desperately wanted to make the hybrid cores seem as seamless as possible in general use. They succeeded for the most part. Let's hope AMD shows them how it's really done.The entire point of Thread Director is offering a seamless experience to the user. Microsoft adding these options would make it clear that for the time being the scheduler cannot offer optimal performance.
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4K gaming doesn't need P-cores. A new BIOS option needed to disable P-cores with a keypress to save power in such a scenario.
Possibly first gaming use of AVX512?
Thanks. Got me to find this:That's speculation.
You need more than just disable the E cores to get avx 512 on adl.PlayStation 3 Emulator Delivers Modest Speed-Ups with Disabled E-Cores on Intel Alder Lake Processors
According to some testing performed by the team behind RPCS3, a free and open-source emulation software for Sony's PlayStation 3, Intel's Alder Lake processors are enjoying a hefty performance boost when E-Cores is disabled. First of all, the Alder Lake processors feature a hybrid configuration...www.techpowerup.com
Possibly first gaming use of AVX512?
Thanks. Got me to find this:
Just saying that a Desktop Sunny Cove/Tremont hybrid would not cut it for for desktop against Amd Current and up coming Desktop CPUs, they had to push Alderlake(the 12900K) to match a stock 5950X(When the 5950X is without limits the story changes). Do you thing a 8C/16T Sonny cove + 8C/8T Tremont Hybrid would keep up?
Also I believe that the superwide design of the Gracemont cores is directly related to their "tuning" for MT performance. We have 6 decoders in 2x3 clusters and if I remember correctly 17 decode. But, the OoS is much more primitive than Golden Cove, meaning MT throughput will only be high if the incoming code is already highly parallel as Gracemont doesn't the smarts to work it out on the fly.
Golden Cove is very wide, since on uop cache hit it's effectively 8-wide. The higher number of pipeline stages will result in more misses and both contribute to gain when SMT is on.
The problem with looking at averages is you miss issues with performance deltas during high stress scenarios, and the 1% lows on the e-cores can be worse than Sandy Bridge.
So if you have 8 P's and 4E's like the 12700K you could select 4 P's as foreground and the rest to background as the OS deems necessary. Or if you really needed the background apps to crank you could select 2 E's for foreground for a little web browing or something?
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What do you suppose would happen if you select Background Services on your system? Would that make all except one P-core tend to background stuff?