Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez challenged to a debate for $10,000 or proceeds to charity

[Moonbeam]

there's only one debate invitation she need consider & that's from Anthony Pappas. The rest is just alt-right trolling.

I'm sure she'll debate plenty of Repubs once she's in Congress.

Poor Ben! All he's accomplished is getting her tire tracks on his back.

It's just sexual abuse by sexually undesirable males trying their childish dominance stances. The idiot concept of masculinity represented by conservative males are having reflexive death spasms. They will all be replaced by healthy young nurturing males. Nothing to be gained by debating them. They are as effective as a dinosaur puffing up its frill at an approaching asteroid, sound and fury, signifying nothing. Why debate leaves that will soon blow away in the breeze? Socialism is the feminine side of human nature and the struggle that has finally been lost is the effort to keep women dependent on men. I suggest that when women say they want socialism and men want sex they say, yes mam. Liberated women don't like sex with reptiles.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Loaded questions are not reasonable, by definition. They're accusations.

so·cial·ism
ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/
noun

a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.​

Ben's question:

Name an industry you would not nationalize; which ones should the government not run and why?​

If she is a socialist that is an absolutely fundamental question she should be able to answer. It’s not an accusation it’s a question about the core of what she claims to believe.

 

[Jhhnn]

so·cial·ism
ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/
noun

a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.​

Ben's question:

Name an industry you would not nationalize; which ones should the government not run and why?​

If she is a socialist that is an absolutely fundamental question she should be able to answer. It’s not an accusation it’s a question about the core of what she claims to believe.

Bullshit. To phrase it as an honest question would be something like "Do you think we need to nationalize any industries?"

Business being regulated by the community as a whole is a basic feature of every western democracy. We already do it in a myriad of ways, quite to everybody's benefit.

 

[UglyCasanova]

That’s a cop out answer and you know it. You many not like his delivery but the question is the same as how you rephrased it. Ask her your rephrased question in a nicer tone for all it matters, the crux of her answer if she’s sincere about her beliefs should be the same.

"Look at me I’m a socialist but don’t ask me about it!”

 

[brycejones]

The red scare is upon us!

 

[Jhhnn]

That’s a cop out answer and you know it. You many not like his delivery but the question is the same as how you rephrased it. Ask her your rephrased question in a nicer tone for all it matters, the crux of her answer if she’s sincere about her beliefs should be the same.

"Look at me I’m a socialist but don’t ask me about it!”

From Wikipedia-

A loaded question or complex question fallacy is a question that contains a controversial or unjustified assumption (e.g., a presumption of guilt)

 

[UglyCasanova]

The assumption isn’t unjustified or controversial, it’s an assumption based on exactly what she claims to be.

 

[soundforbjt]

Her response was pathetic. She tried to play a victim, when she claimed Repubs were scared of her to debate. She's challenged and tries to equate that to sexual harassment. Which belittles people who have actually been sexually harassed. She is scared, because she knows she would get owned. She has owned herself so many times in the past few week, without any one's help. He is much smarter than her, knows politics much better than her.She is really just clueless, and is the worst thing that the Dems need right now. She's dividing them and its going to hirt them. Which is one reason CNN separated themselves from her recently.

You seem quite concerned.

 

[ch33zw1z]

The assumption isn’t unjustified or controversial, it’s an assumption based on exactly what she claims to be.

Shapiro's assumption isn't justified based on the definition of socialism you posted, or from her espoused views. His question, and Jhnn's rewording are very different.

 

[ch33zw1z]

You seem quite concerned.

He's not sure which Democrat to vote for next time around.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Shapiro's assumption isn't justified based on the definition of socialism you posted, or from her espoused views. His question, and Jhnn's rewording are very different.

Break it down for me


Name an industry you would not nationalize; which ones should the government not run and why?

Do you think we need to nationalize any industries?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Break it down for me


Name an industry you would not nationalize; which ones should the government not run and why?

Do you think we need to nationalize any industries?

Break what down for you? Jhnn already broke the difference down for you. So do you not understand the difference? Also, did you interpret the definition of socialism to mean nationalization specifically?

The only industry I think should be nationalized, outside of already existing government subsidies because that's not nationalization technically, is medical.

Here's another wiki for you to read: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalization?wprov=sfla1

 

[SP33Demon]

And the point, now made repeatedly, is that no one cares what you call it. As for the insurance companies, the ACA is a tradeoff. The mandate meant they would get millions of new customers, including younger, healthier, and therefore more profitable customers. In exchange, they would have to insure the already sick. The problem was that the penalty for not buying insurance was too low and too many opted out. If the insurance companies aren't getting enough new customers to cover the cost of having to insure the already sick, then everyone's premiums will go up.

A short term solution would be to fix the ACA by raising the non-compliance penalty to make sure that virtually everyone gets into the system. Since those who currently choose not to buy in are on average young and healthy, the end result would be to lower everyone's premiums.

But all of this is at best a stop gap. Private health insurance is a failed system no matter how you try to tweek it. My wife and I (self-employed) pay just under $1,000 a month for each of us, and we still have to pay thousands a year for our care. It's a good thing we're high wage earners. If we made anything near the national median we'd have to make seriously hard choices about getting care versus having money to pay for necessities. These premiums just keep going up, substantially, year over year. Everyone is being priced out of the market. Including small to medium sized employers.

I'm fine with not fixing the ACA. It will only accelerate the process of getting to the point where a strong majority will demand a single payer system.



You're using an example from 35 years ago to prove that conservatives care about healthcare? It should be a given understanding that when I make an observation like "conservatives don't care" that I'm talking about the present state of American conservatism.

So we will rob Peter (young folks) to pay Paul (old folks). As if we don't pay enough for SS and Medicaid when we're young. If anything we should expand medicaid but add a work requirement with it and I'll bet you that will be the GOP's fix. The non-compliance penalty is dead. RIP

That sucks that you pay that much for insurance. I do empathize with you on the greedy ass companies raking in profits in what amounts to a system that should be more privatized to where the market dictates prices. Ben's comparison of xrays to lasik is a fine example, but the greed is too much for these healthcare companies. F em

 

[brycejones]

So we will rob Peter (young folks) to pay Paul (old folks). As if we don't pay enough for SS and Medicaid when we're young. If anything we should expand medicaid but add a work requirement with it and I'll bet you that will be the GOP's fix. The non-compliance penalty is dead. RIP

That sucks that you pay that much for insurance. I do empathize with you on the greedy ass companies raking in profits in what amounts to a system that should be more privatized to where the market dictates prices. Ben's comparison of xrays to lasik is a fine example, but the greed is too much for these healthcare companies. F em

Quoted for the lulz given who benefits from Trump's tax cuts.

 

[Jhhnn]

The assumption isn’t unjustified or controversial, it’s an assumption based on exactly what she claims to be.

She hasn't said we should nationalize anything. That makes Shapiro's assumption unreasonable.

 

[Jhhnn]

So we will rob Peter (young folks) to pay Paul (old folks). As if we don't pay enough for SS and Medicaid when we're young. If anything we should expand medicaid but add a work requirement with it and I'll bet you that will be the GOP's fix. The non-compliance penalty is dead. RIP

That sucks that you pay that much for insurance. I do empathize with you on the greedy ass companies raking in profits in what amounts to a system that should be more privatized to where the market dictates prices. Ben's comparison of xrays to lasik is a fine example, but the greed is too much for these healthcare companies. F em

That's a fine bit of doublespeak. Blame greedy insurance companies, then say we should just let them do whatever they want in a free market... As if they'll actually do better by the public if we place fewer demands on them...

That's some serious post truth mind fuck right there.

 

[SP33Demon]

LoL. What non-shithole state do you live in.

Not NJ. Let's list how much of a shithole it's become, shall we?

1) Worst property taxes in the entire country - this will get even worse with the Trump tax cut that now only lets you deduct 10k max in SALT. That's going to crush NJ residents this year with a median home price $348k with a property tax $6.5k.
2) 23 cent gasoline tax increase which made NJ's gas go from one of the cheapest to one of the worst. Oh and btw that sales tax decrease you were promised in exchange for the gas tax hike? It's going away, lmao.
3) NJ lawmakers are now mulling a tax on your tap water that will net the state 150mil annually.
4) As Trump canceled the individual mandate for obamacare, NJ reinstated it.
5) NJ just imposed enormous tax increases on guns.
6) NJ is now a sanctuary state and just lost over 4 million in federal grants as a result.
7) NJ is so strapped for cash they're mulling merging K-6/K-8 schools with K-12 and moving municipal public services to the county level and possible toll increases.
8) Related to #7, since NJ will be coming up 9.5 billion short in the next 6 years they're going to cut all state-based healthcare plans from Platinum (covered 90%) to Gold (only 80%). Way to stick it to those evil NJ public servants b/c NJ can't manage their money!
9) NJ penalizes a missed toll with a draconian $50. Nationally other toll agencies require 95% less in their fines for a missed toll ($5).
10) NJ has a history of state troopers racially profiling.
11) NY hates you and charges more in tolls for NJ residents.
12) NJ is now the only idiotic state in the country that has banned pumping your own gas.
13) Trenton, NJ is the worst capital in the country to live in according to Wallethub this year.
14) NJ drivers are worst in the country according to Wallethub this year.
15) NJ has the worst finances in the nation, according to Truth in Accounting thinktank in 2017.
16) NJ is the 4th worst state to retire according to Kiplingers 2018 and 2nd worst according to CBS Moneywatch in 2016.

 

[MrSquished]

Not NJ. Let's list how much of a shithole it's become, shall we?

1) Worst property taxes in the entire country - this will get even worse with the Trump tax cut that now only lets you deduct 10k max in SALT. That's going to crush NJ residents this year with a median home price $348k with a property tax $6.5k.
2) 23 cent gasoline tax increase which made NJ's gas go from cheapest to one of the worst. Oh and btw that sales tax decrease you were promised in exchange for the gas tax hike? It's going away, lmao.
3) NJ lawmakers are now mulling a tax on your tap water.
4) As Trump canceled the individual mandate for obamacare, NJ reinstated it.
5) NJ just imposed enormous tax increases on guns.
6) NJ is now a sanctuary state and just lost over 4 million in federal grants as a result.
7) NJ is so strapped for cash they're mulling merging K-6/K-8 schools with K-12 and moving municipal public services to the county level and possible toll increases.
8) Related to #7, since NJ will be coming up 9.5 billion short in the next 6 years they're going to cut all state-based healthcare plans from Platinum (covered 90%) to Gold (only 80%). Way to stick it to those evil public servants b/c NJ can't manage their money!
9) NJ penalizes a missed toll with a draconian $50. Nationally other toll agencies require 95% less in their fines for a missed toll.
10) NJ has a history of state troopers racially profiling.
11) NY hates you and charges more in tolls for NJ residents.
12) NJ is now the only idiotic state in the country that has banned pumping your own gas.
13) Trenton, NJ is the worst capital in the country to live in according to Wallethub this year.
14) NJ drivers are worst in the country according to Wallethub this year.
15) NJ has the worst finances in the nation, according to Truth in Accounting thinktank in 2017.
16) NJ is the 4th worst state to retire according to Kiplingers 2018 and 2nd worst according to CBS Moneywatch in 2016.

It's not cheap to live in NJ but guess what, you should understand this as a consumer capitalist - sometimes you gotta pay for a quality product. I'd rather pay more to live in NJ right next to the greatest city in the world than save money by living in some shithole state in the South. Now bear in mind you only live once, your prime years should be spent in a prime area, not some subpar state. When you retire and if your funds are limited, then suck it up and live in some shithole southern state maybe. But those are the lower quality of life years. So it makes sense.

 

[Jhhnn]

Whatabout New Jersey!

 

[SP33Demon]

It's not cheap to live in NJ but guess what, you should understand this as a consumer capitalist - sometimes you gotta pay for a quality product. I'd rather pay more to live in NJ right next to the greatest city in the world than save money by living in some shithole state in the South. Now bear in mind you only live once, your prime years should be spent in a prime area, not some subpar state. When you retire and if your funds are limited, then suck it up and live in some shithole southern state maybe. But those are the lower quality of life years. So it makes sense.

I've lived there before. It's a complete and utter shithole and that list should make you want to run fast and never look back. You are wasting your prime years by getting raped by NJ's unending and incessant fees that will only continue to get worse as you lose your entire home SALT deduction minus 10k and NJ has to make up their ridiculous $9.5 billion state deficit by taking it out of your pocket. Oh and the worst state to retire is almost always NY with NJ not far behind.

 

[woolfe9998]

I've lived there before. It's a complete and utter shithole and that list should make you want to run fast and never look back. You are wasting your prime years by getting raped by NJ's unending and incessant fees that will only continue to get worse as you lose your entire home SALT deduction minus 10k and NJ has to make up their ridiculous $9.5 billion state deficit by taking it out of your pocket. Oh and the worst state to retire is almost always NY.

Every other developed country in the world has a system with more government involvement, and they all have less expensive health care. Usually substantially less. Yet you think we can make our healthcare less expensive with less government involvement. It doesn't compute.

 

[UglyCasanova]

She hasn't said we should nationalize anything. That makes Shapiro's assumption unreasonable.

Like most socialist organizations, DSA believes in the abolition of capitalism in favor of an economy run either by “the workers” or the state — though the exact specifics of “abolishing capitalism” are fiercely debated by socialists.

..
In practice, that means DSA [members advocate] ending private ownership of a wide range of industries whose products are viewed as “necessities,” which they say should not be left to those seeking to turn a profit.

..
While both DSA and some left-wing Democrats agree that the government should provide universal health insurance, DSA ultimately wants to nationalize hospitals, providers, and the rest of the health care system as well. While both will work toward higher taxes on Wall Street, DSA ultimately wants to nationalize the entire financial sector.


She says she’s a member of the DSA, is she a liar?

 

[MrSquished]

I've lived there before. It's a complete and utter shithole and that list should make you want to run fast and never look back. You are wasting your prime years by getting raped by NJ's unending and incessant fees that will only continue to get worse as you lose your entire home SALT deduction minus 10k and NJ has to make up their ridiculous $9.5 billion state deficit by taking it out of your pocket. Oh and the worst state to retire is almost always NY with NJ not far behind.

It's not cheap, never thought it was but you gotta pay to play. It's one of the greatest states in the nation. In less than 20 minutes I can be in midtown Manhattan, NYC, the greatest most diverse city on the planet. In an hour and change south I can be at some nice beaches. I can head 30 minutes north and be at a wonderful state park. In 1-2 hours both north and west I can be in some massive state park systems from Harriman to Delaware Water Gap to the Catskills, with backpacking and all kinds of activities. It's also only a 5 hour flight to London.

Tough to beat IMO. It's one of the best areas to live in the country, if you make decent coin and take advantage of what it has to offer. If you just stay out in the burbs and don't take advantage of the city and nature areas nearby then you may as well think about moving elsewhere. But I would take my 740 square foot 2BR condo close to NYC over 2,000 sq feet in Anywhere, North Carolina any day of the week and twice on Sundays.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Like most socialist organizations, DSA believes in the abolition of capitalism in favor of an economy run either by “the workers” or the state — though the exact specifics of “abolishing capitalism” are fiercely debated by socialists.

..
In practice, that means DSA [members advocate] ending private ownership of a wide range of industries whose products are viewed as “necessities,” which they say should not be left to those seeking to turn a profit.

..
While both DSA and some left-wing Democrats agree that the government should provide universal health insurance, DSA ultimately wants to nationalize hospitals, providers, and the rest of the health care system as well. While both will work toward higher taxes on Wall Street, DSA ultimately wants to nationalize the entire financial sector.


She says she’s a member of the DSA, is she a liar?

The best economics advice I've heard in life is always from Bartenders. Don't you fucking know anything?

 

[Fanatical Meat]

So we will rob Peter (young folks) to pay Paul (old folks). As if we don't pay enough for SS and Medicaid when we're young. If anything we should expand medicaid but add a work requirement with it and I'll bet you that will be the GOP's fix. The non-compliance penalty is dead. RIP

That sucks that you pay that much for insurance. I do empathize with you on the greedy ass companies raking in profits in what amounts to a system that should be more privatized to where the market dictates prices. Ben's comparison of xrays to lasik is a fine example, but the greed is too much for these healthcare companies. F em

Why do I have to keep saying this. Mexico is going to pay and they’ll be happy paying for it.