Almost 3 years later and bin Laden still on the run...now a new push to get him??

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Mockery

Originally posted by: conjur
[And that article doesn't state when Lt. Col. Khan was deployed in Afghanistan. It also mentions he's about to be redeployed and will leave Afghanistan. Usually, a rebuttal reinforces one's position instead of countering it.

OMG?.You?re so right. Khan is surely the only person in that entire region that can speak the language. He was merely an example of the types of men we have over there. Seriously?do you think our military doesn?t have anyone over there that can proficiently communicate that language? Is this what your argument has boiled down to?

I never said that, did I?

My point was that key translators were taken OUT of Afghanistan during the crucial early months. Even the special ops forces were dumbfounded by the move.

LMAO! "irrelevant in my eyes"

Nice dismissal.

Dismissal??? So we should all be taking Bush?s word for gospel? Should I buy into everything he said about WMD too?

All the other Bush fans have. When Bush says something, he means it. Whether it's wrong or right in our eyes, it's right in his eyes.

And those Pakistani forces were only increased within the last 6-9 months. That large of a force has NOT been there the entire time. And, guess what? We're into election season!

Last I checked we didn?t control Pakistan?..Are you going to change your thread title to

?Almost 3 years later and bin Laden still on the run...now Pakistan makes a new push to get him???

No, we don't control Pakistan but this administration is apparently leaning heavily to get U.S.-friendly...nay...cozy leaders in charge. That may help but the way they're doing that is wrong.

Anyway, we have troops in the area. Not enough and they weren't in-country until recently. That's a fact that cannot be denied.

 

[GreatBarracuda]

Originally posted by: MachFive
Mach's 4 month predictions:

1. More terror warnings that are vague and useless.
2. Several attempted terror attacks on high-profile targets that get the nation in a frenzy.
3. OBL popping out like a jack in the box in our custody weeks, days, or minutes before the election.

Call me paranoid.

I agree 100%.

Edit: I think that's why the Pakistani Prime Minister resigned. The President and him must have had "differences" over this issue.

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: conjur

3) You shoud be embarrassed.

No, no, no. YOU should be embarrassed. Let's see here. Bin Laden is indicted in '98. According to the indictment, the merry men of Al-Qaida declare Jihad on the U.S. "on or about August 23, 1996".

Moving right along, Janet "I'll burn down your damned church" Reno, old Willie's third choice (no, not first or second) for the AG position, spends much of her time occupied with important matters such as trying to rectify her Waco blunder (read: killing Americans), falsely accusing Richard Jewel, (unethically) covering Willie's ass or worrying about some obscure adolescent from Cuba.

Jihadist freaks bomb the WTC in '93. After three years, the State Department under Albright (another postmodernist idiot) finally issues a dossier on bin Laden. I guess Willie, your boy Clarke and the rest of the Clinton orgy (sans William Cohen) were really on the ball, because five years after the first WTC bombing we find ourselves treated to an "indictment". Yep, that's right, you can't make this stuff up, 5 years. Meanwhile, Khobar Towers, Nairobi and Dar es Salaam are also blown to smithereens by this mob of fvcktards.

So what course of action does Willie and his joyous little elves follow? Why, they launch cruise missiles at an aspirin factory in Sudan and tents in Afghanistan!

And you try to tell us that Bush isn't acting "quickly enough"? Pssst. Freedom Hall is on on sale today for $58. 29. You better hurry.

 

[dnuggett]

Yep, that's right, you can't make this stuff up, 5 years.

Ding Ding Ding. We have a winner.

Oh yes and a loser. Paging conjur.... conjur please accept your ass at burnedout's post.

 

I don't understand how we have the technology to launch an ICBM from the US to Russia and land it within meters of it's target, but after three years of searching we can find one guy living in a specific location. It's not like he's alone, he has to travel with a pack of grunts. If our satellites can't do the job then I guess all that cool Cold War tech was a bunch of BS.

And I do find it ironic how Bin Laden has popped up as the central figure in terrorism again just in time for the elections.

 

[Alistar7]

Maybe you should spend a bit more time reading the news, I have always been able to find recent stuff on Afghanistan, OBL, etc.

I am prety sure that since we locked down targeting for Moscow it has not moved.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: conjur

3) You shoud be embarrassed.

No, no, no. YOU should be embarrassed. Let's see here. Bin Laden is indicted in '98. According to the indictment, the merry men of Al-Qaida declare Jihad on the U.S. "on or about August 23, 1996".

Moving right along, Janet "I'll burn down your damned church" Reno, old Willie's third choice (no, not first or second) for the AG position, spends much of her time occupied with important matters such as trying to rectify her Waco blunder (read: killing Americans), falsely accusing Richard Jewel, (unethically) covering Willie's ass or worrying about some obscure adolescent from Cuba.

Jihadist freaks bomb the WTC in '93. After three years, the State Department under Albright (another postmodernist idiot) finally issues a dossier on bin Laden. I guess Willie, your boy Clarke and the rest of the Clinton orgy (sans William Cohen) were really on the ball, because five years after the first WTC bombing we find ourselves treated to an "indictment". Yep, that's right, you can't make this stuff up, 5 years. Meanwhile, Khobar Towers, Nairobi and Dar es Salaam are also blown to smithereens by this mob of fvcktards.

So what course of action does Willie and his joyous little elves follow? Why, they launch cruise missiles at an aspirin factory in Sudan and tents in Afghanistan!

And you try to tell us that Bush isn't acting "quickly enough"? Pssst. Freedom Hall is on on sale today for $58. 29. You better hurry.

If the CIA and the Pentagon had cooperated, we might have had better luck at getting bin Laden. Go back and check your history on that to see how the CIA and the Pentagon were reluctant to help.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: GreatBarracuda

Originally posted by: MachFive
Mach's 4 month predictions:

1. More terror warnings that are vague and useless.
2. Several attempted terror attacks on high-profile targets that get the nation in a frenzy.
3. OBL popping out like a jack in the box in our custody weeks, days, or minutes before the election.

Call me paranoid.

I agree 100%.

Edit: I think that's why the Pakistani Prime Minister resigned. The President and him must have had "differences" over this issue.

And guess who the knew Prime Minister will be? Aziz...a close friend of none other than Paul Wolfowitz!

 

[DealMonkey]

Look we all know that OBL & Co are hiding in the Pakistani Tribal area somewhere along the Afghan-beloved patriot border. Let's look at this situation for a sec:

Q: How big of an area is this?

A: Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) are areas of Pakistan outside any of the four provinces, comprising a region of some 27,220 km² (10,507 mi²). Neighbouring regions are: Afghanistan to the west, North-West Frontier to the north, Punjab to the east and Balochistan to the south. The total population of the FATA was estimated in 1998 to comprise about 3,138,000 people.

Q: Why can't Musharraf project military power into that region?

A: Well armed militants have clashed with beloved patriot troops quite frequently in the past. I'm not personally clear on what kind of forces the militants in the FATA zone could muster. Anyone know how many tribal fighters would we be facing -- assuming we were working jointly with beloved patriot forces?

I can see two problems:

ONE: Musharraf is unwilling to project force into the FATA zone and risk potentially stirring up any kind of serious trouble with the militants there. Although, some of these militants have marked him for death, so it may be wise to start dealing with at least the most extremist of the tribal fighters now. Doing so, however risks starting something major with ALL of the pashtun there. Who knows? Messing around in FATA could start a civil war in Pakistan...

TWO: Musharraf cannot put an American face on any kind of armed conflict that occurs in or near FATA because it will cause him serious political problems. So U.S. troops are confined to the Afghan side of the border, or to small infiltration type teams that can sneak into FATA and not be seen.

So it seems like the only remaining solutions are to surveil the area, insert humint into FATA, have special forces operating unseen in and around the area. When and if specific intel on OBL is garnered, go after him with a good sized strike force.

I'll betcha at this stage, they have the plans together for a strike force and have most of surveillance and SpecOps in place, yet the approximate location of OBL within the ten thousand square mile region is still unknown.

 

[Mockery]

Very thorough assessment DealMonkey!

 

[sapiens74]

I took us almost 5 years to avenge Pearl Harbor. patience isn't a liberal's best virtue.

 

[Cobalt]

Originally posted by: conjur
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/09/politics/09home.html?hp

WASHINGTON, July 8 - Osama bin Laden and his chief lieutenants, operating from hideouts suspected to be along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border, are directing a Qaeda effort to launch an attack in the United States sometime this year, senior Bush administration officials said on Thursday.

"What we know about this most recent information is that it is being directed from the seniormost levels of the Al Qaeda organization," said a senior official at a briefing for reporters. He added, "We know that this leadership continues to operate along the border area between Afghanistan and Pakistan."

Counterterrorism officials have said for weeks that they are increasingly worried by a continuing stream of intelligence suggesting that Al Qaeda wanted to carry out a significant terror attack on United States soil this year. But until the comments of the senior administration officials on Thursday, it was not clear that Mr. bin Laden and top deputies like Ayman Zawahiri were responsible for the concern.

Hmm...those tens of thousands of troops in Iraq...hmmm...

Wonder how they'd have done in surrounding that small area along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border had they NOT been sent to Iraq? Wonder how they'd have done if they were put in-country as soon as possible, instead of sending less than 10,000 troops five months after 9/11?

I wonder why there's such a strong push now against Pakistan to do something when, for the last 2 1/2 years, the efforts were not seen?

Abu Ghraib is plastered all over the news and Ashcroft comes out with a terror warning (and gets b!tch-slapped by Ridge who says there's no new evidence.)

Kerry picks Edwards and, WHAM!, a new terror warning with absolutely no specifics comes out again.


Hmmmmm...

Rove and Racicot must think they're geniuses.

If they find him, it will be very close to the election, like weeks.

 

[katka]

Leave Osama alone! Do you notice that they like to spell his name USAma. Hmmmm, is this some sign that the USA orchestrated an elaborate plan and place the blame on a simple, religious man.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Look we all know that OBL & Co are hiding in the Pakistani Tribal area somewhere along the Afghan-beloved patriot border. Let's look at this situation for a sec:

Q: How big of an area is this?

A: Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) are areas of Pakistan outside any of the four provinces, comprising a region of some 27,220 km² (10,507 mi²). Neighbouring regions are: Afghanistan to the west, North-West Frontier to the north, Punjab to the east and Balochistan to the south. The total population of the FATA was estimated in 1998 to comprise about 3,138,000 people.

So, we can't find a group of people in area smaller than the state of Massachusetts?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: conjur
So, we can't find a group of people in area smaller than the state of Massachusetts?

I think the biggest problem is the sheer difficulty in getting into the FATA and gathering intel. Obviously, if you're not Pashtun, or if you look American/Pakistani military you're going to have problems. I mean, over 3 million live there and they probably all have AKs and a few RPGs lying around. If you're the Pakistani military, you don't just go wandering in there whenever you feel like it.

 

[conjur]

A little over 3 million, yes, but half of them are women, at least according to the 1998 Pakistani census.

And, I find it hard to believe we can't infiltrate that area somehow...esp. given 2 1/2 years' time.

 

[DealMonkey]

Well, I kinda do too, especially given the importance of finding OBL. Well, at least it should be of high importance. In any event, I do know that the beloved patriot gov't has been diplomatically dealing directly with tribal leaders in an effort to convince them not to support foreigners hiding in the tribal lands. I would also imagine that money could be used to huge effect, similar to what often happened in Afghanistan. Meaning, just buy the support of regional leaders, information, etc.