Am I being too paranoid about a HDD being shipped poorly?

[Darknite39]

I ordered 2x 6TB WD Blue on Sat, and they arrived today. I didn't initially realize what the 2 boxes were, but, when I did, I said "you have to be kidding." The dude still has 2 more, so I might be able to swap them out, but I am checking here to see if I'm being too paranoid. I figure, even if they scan OK initially, the chance of failure has to be higher than baseline given how little padding they were given during transit. Usually they're in a box inside another box with lots of padding.

Thoughts?

Small priority rate box:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jxij2fk24bm117q/2016-08-22 16.11.51.jpg?dl=0

Wrapped in 2 layers of bubble wrap:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jyyccilf4vsf31k/2016-08-22 16.12.03.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/nsb9o0vy32b2hsi/2016-08-22 16.12.34.jpg?dl=0

 

[UsandThem]

Just test them. That's pretty much I have received hard drives from Newegg. In fact, my last SSD from them came in a padded envelope, and the SSD box was crushed on 3 of the 4 corners.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

I used to work for FedEx. By our book, there should be at least 2" of padding or void on all sides of the HDD (since it'd be considered fragile). In the real world, that's a bit negotiable, and the ratio of stuff to stuffing makes a difference, but... not that negotiable.

The small flat rate box and padded envelopes trick would be a-okay for a 2.5" HDD, IMHO. But for a 3.5" (which tend to be more delicate anyway) I'd want something bigger and better padded.

I'd have put both drives in a single medium flat rate box, wrapped them in bubble wrap until they were 5+" thick (the inner dimension of the box), and then filled any remaining space with old newspapers or grocery store circulars so they weren't bopping around in there. Postage would have been about the same.

So hopefully that guy doesn't work for UPS or FedEx, cuz damn.

Even if the drives work now, impact damage may cause them to fail early. But if you try to return them to the seller, chances are the replacements will be equally not-very-well-packed. (Also, on what grounds - that they might fail? Anything might fail. That's what the manufacturer warranty is for.)

And why are you buying amateurishly packed (presumably used?) hard drives on eBay? That's what you do when you don't care if they're going to work or not.

 

[Darknite39]

Thank you both for the advice! I will test each drive and see what I've got. I always buy them in pairs so I'll have a backup for each drive, and if they undergo a full format and work OK I'll use them as the backups instead of the primaries for a couple of 6TBs I already have (from newegg).

As to why I bought them on ebay: They're new / sealed OEM drives. The dude had good feedback for previous hard drive sales (and otherwise), and the price was $148/ea (and I had a $15 coupon), so I decided to risk it (saving about $90). I'll be more cautious in the future, though. You get what you pay for.

 

[Elixer]

This is what they want for a RMA: https://support.wdc.com/Warranty/packingInstructions.aspx

All products require stable and sufficient packing material, needed to protect the product from ESD (Electro Static Discharge) influences and possible damage during transport. Required Packaging Steps:
A. Place drive in ESD (Electro Static Discharge) Bag (For internal drives only.)
B. Wrap with 2 inches of bubble wrap or non-movable foam cushioning
C. Place in sturdy cardboard box. Do not use chipboard, as it is not strong enough to withstand the rigors of transit. Please make sure the corrugated carton is free from defects and is structurally sound. Note: Returning a WD hard drive in an envelope, will void the warranty.

So, a NEW HD should at least follow the guidelines.

The good ole days...

I also say, never, ever get anything like a HD from fleabay.

So, yeah, that packaging sucks.
Could have damage from all the handling the drive went under, and it could have damaged it.

 

[Darknite39]

Yeah, I've RMA'd drives before (and even sold a couple on here.

I actually just took the first one out of the bubble wrap and see this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jg3bxrynkvrgf98/2016-08-22 18.44.30.jpg?dl=0

There's no way this is a new drive. It's been re-sealed. There's not even a desiccant pack in the anti-static bag.

 

[UsandThem]

Thank you both for the advice! I will test each drive and see what I've got. I always buy them in pairs so I'll have a backup for each drive, and if they undergo a full format and work OK I'll use them as the backups instead of the primaries for a couple of 6TBs I already have (from newegg).

As to why I bought them on ebay: They're new / sealed OEM drives. The dude had good feedback for previous hard drive sales (and otherwise), and the price was $148/ea (and I had a $15 coupon), so I decided to risk it (saving about $90). I'll be more cautious in the future, though. You get what you pay for.

It's probably just all down to the economics for him. He saves 'X' by shipping them in bare-minimum flat-rate boxes, and probably assumes that 'Y' amount of them will be damaged in transit. As long as 'X' stays higher than 'Y', he'll keep doing it.

Now as a private seller/trader, I would never package and send a sensitive item like that in such a small box with minimum padding, but I don't sell/trade in high volume, and a few extra bucks for shipping isn't going to bother me.

 

[UsandThem]

Yeah, I've RMA'd drives before (and even sold a couple on here.

I actually just took the first one out of the bubble wrap and see this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jg3bxrynkvrgf98/2016-08-22 18.44.30.jpg?dl=0

There's no way this is a new drive. It's been re-sealed. There's not even a desiccant pack in the anti-static bag.

Do they even put those in hard drive bags anymore? It's been a few years since I bought a regular hard drive, but I don't remember it having a pack in it.

You should be able to see it's data (power on, writes, etc.) with a free hard drive utility.

 

[Darknite39]

Do they even put those in hard drive bags anymore? It's been a few years since I bought a regular hard drive, but I don't remember it having a pack in it.

You should be able to see it's data (power on, writes, etc.) with a free hard drive utility.

Do they even put those in hard drive bags anymore? It's been a few years since I bought a regular hard drive, but I don't remember it having a pack in it.

You should be able to see it's data (power on, writes, etc.) with a free hard drive utility.

My other 2 came in these bags with a desiccant pack: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mck17bc0gz5ojoo/2016-08-22 18.50.57.jpg?dl=0

 

[Elixer]

Do they even put those in hard drive bags anymore? It's been a few years since I bought a regular hard drive, but I don't remember it having a pack in it.

You should be able to see it's data (power on, writes, etc.) with a free hard drive utility.

I still purchase lots of internal drives, and they all have come in those silver anti-static bags, along with those desiccant packs.
Newegg used to be really bad in shipping these suckers, in the last year or so, they have gotten better.
Amazon is hit or miss, sometimes they pack it well, other times, it is just a bare drive flopping around in a big box.
Here is amazon on one of those miss days:

I like these:

newegg is supposed to ship them in these...

 

[UsandThem]

My other 2 came in these bags with a desiccant pack: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mck17bc0gz5ojoo/2016-08-22 18.50.57.jpg?dl=0

I see. Maybe the seller figured most people wouldn't notice. Was it a long-term seller with lots of feedback, or a relatively new seller?

 

[Darknite39]

I see. Maybe the seller figured most people wouldn't notice. Was it a long-term seller with lots of feedback, or a relatively new seller?

He's been active for a little over 2 years with 100% positive feedback (150 total). And I am guessing that a lot of people wouldn't have noticed the bag issue.

 

[UsandThem]

Amazon is hit or miss, sometimes they pack it well, other times, it is just a bare drive flopping around in a big box.

Yeah, they are really bad sometimes. I have ordered motherboards sold by them, and had it come in a big box with one small sheet of air-bubble wrap.

Other times if I order a bag of Timothy Hay for my son's guinea pig, it comes in a big box with a whole role of air-bubble wrap around it.

Edit:

The picture you just uploaded looked like my motherboard packaging from them, except it had about 12" of air-bubble sheet.

 

[UsandThem]

He's been active for a little over 2 years with 100% positive feedback (150 total). And I am guessing that a lot of people wouldn't have noticed the bag issue.

I'd just contact him and see what he has to say. Maybe he knows, or maybe he was like I was and didn't think they still came in the bags. Who knows where he gets them from.

 

[Darknite39]

I'd just contact him and see what he has to say. Maybe he knows, or maybe he was like I was and didn't think they still came in the bags. Who knows where he gets them from.

Yeah, I'm messaging him now in a non-accusatory manner. We'll see what happens.

 

[Darknite39]

Hm. Interesting reply from the seller. I guess I'll try to format them and see what happens.

Huh. The power on count is 9 and the time is 0.0 days. Maybe the dude is legit after all. Still doesn't excuse the packaging, of course.

I understand your concern. We open all drives, check the smart data and format them for the buyer’s convenience and then reseal them in a new antistatic bag. It is rare to find a problem with a new drive however one of the drives I was about to send you did not pass the test, I had to wait about four times as long as normal for my tech bench to recognize it which was a red flag for me and I have marked it as such and set it aside and sent you two drives that were recognized instantly and had perfectly clean smart data which you yourself can verify with any number of programs. I recommend CrystalDiskInfo which can be downloaded for free at http://download.cnet.com/CrystalDiskInfo/3000-2086_4-10832082.html I will try to include some screen shots of both a new 6TB western digital and a used 4TB western digital. You will see an area where it says “Power On Hours” which reads 0 hours on the new one and 119 hours on the used one. This is the true measure of if a hard drive is new or not. All my hard drives that are listed as new are ZERO hours.

If that doesn’t make you feel better and you would like to return the drives just let me know.

Thank you.

 

[Elixer]

Hm. Interesting reply from the seller. I guess I'll try to format them and see what happens.

Huh. The power on count is 9 and the time is 0.0 days. Maybe the dude is legit after all. Still doesn't excuse the packaging, of course.

I understand your concern. We open all drives, check the smart data and format them for the buyer’s convenience and then reseal them in a new antistatic bag. It is rare to find a problem with a new drive however one of the drives I was about to send you did not pass the test, I had to wait about four times as long as normal for my tech bench to recognize it which was a red flag for me and I have marked it as such and set it aside and sent you two drives that were recognized instantly and had perfectly clean smart data which you yourself can verify with any number of programs. I recommend CrystalDiskInfo which can be downloaded for free at http://download.cnet.com/CrystalDiskInfo/3000-2086_4-10832082.html I will try to include some screen shots of both a new 6TB western digital and a used 4TB western digital. You will see an area where it says “Power On Hours” which reads 0 hours on the new one and 119 hours on the used one. This is the true measure of if a hard drive is new or not. All my hard drives that are listed as new are ZERO hours.

If that doesn’t make you feel better and you would like to return the drives just let me know.

Thank you.

So, basically, they just see if it turns on, do a quick format (which is pointless), and check SMART, then reseal the bag up.
Sorry, that is not new. Once the factory bag has been opened, and by their own admission, they did a quick format, it can't be sold as new. That would be against the law.
It is fine if they are upfront about it though, but, it still can't be called new.

 

[Darknite39]

Yeah, even if the drives work I will say something to the guy about his procedure and selling something as new when it's not.

 

[UsandThem]

Yeah, I agree with Elixer.

If that is what they do, they should state so in their Ebay listing. They are probably grey market drives.

It's like Ebay sellers claim to open up brand new cell phones to check them, or flash a new OS on them, but still list them as new.

If I buy something that is listed as new, I want to be the one opening for the first time as to ensure it is truly new.

It would be like buying a new car that has several thousand miles on it because they just wanted to make sure the engine worked.

 

[Darknite39]

You're preaching to the choir. I can't comprehend why he'd choose to do all of that unless there was something weird going on.

 

[UsandThem]

You're preaching to the choir. I can't comprehend why he'd choose to do all of that unless there was something weird going on.

Sometimes it's just worth it to pay a little more and catch them in sale at Newegg or Amazon, and not have to deal with shady Ebay sellers.

I used to buy and sell on there at lot, but I closed my Ebay store after a guy bought brand new sealed headphones from me listed as no returns accepted. He opened them, used them, posted a video review online that he thought they were "ok but not as good sounding as Beats", and wanted to return them after 30 days. Despite me showing all that stuff to Ebay, they made me return his money. They suck.

 

[Elixer]

They also got tools to reset SMART, but that does cost a few thousand $$$ though.
Come to think of it, I bet there are no warranties on these drives either, unless they are an authorized dealer (which I doubt).
So, basically, they are "AS IS" drives.

 

[Darknite39]

I checked the serial on one of the drives and it checked out. I thought the warranty was tied to the drive itself? If not, then I'm definitely returning them.

...I really should have just paid the extra $90 and gotten a couple more from newegg.

They also got tools to reset SMART, but that does cost a few thousand $$$ though.
Come to think of it, I bet there are no warranties on these drives either, unless they are an authorized dealer (which I doubt).
So, basically, they are "AS IS" drives.

 

[Darknite39]

Sometimes it's just worth it to pay a little more and catch them in sale at Newegg or Amazon, and not have to deal with shady Ebay sellers.

I used to buy and sell on there at lot, but I closed my Ebay store after a guy bought brand new sealed headphones from me listed as no returns accepted. He opened them, used them, posted a video review online that he thought they were "ok but not as good sounding as Beats", and wanted to return them after 30 days. Despite me showing all that stuff to Ebay, they made me return his money. They suck.

Yikes. That is horrible. I've sold a few DVDs on ebay recently, but I don't (and won't) make a habit of it. As a seller, I trust neither ebay nor paypal based on hearing a lot of stories like this one.

 

[Elixer]

I checked the serial on one of the drives and it checked out. I thought the warranty was tied to the drive itself? If not, then I'm definitely returning them.

...I really should have just paid the extra $90 and gotten a couple more from newegg.

Western Digital ("WD") values your business and always attempts to provide you the very best of service.

No limited warranty is provided by WD unless your WD Product ("Product") was purchased from an authorized distributor or authorized reseller. Distributors may sell Products to resellers who then sell Products to end users. Please see below for warranty information or obtaining service. No warranty service is provided unless the Product is returned to an authorized return center in the region (warranty regions are identified as Canada, U.S.A., Latin America, Europe, Middle East, Africa, Asia Pacific, India and Thailand) where the Product was first shipped by WD, which may have regional specific warranty implications.

If your Product was purchased as a component integrated within a system by a system manufacturer, no limited warranty is provided by WD. Please contact the place of purchase or the system manufacturer directly for warranty service.

I am not a policy expert, but, reading the above at http://support.wdc.com/Warranty/warrantyPolicy.aspx?lang=en seems pretty clear.