Question AMD 2Q23 Earnings

Page 4 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

yuri69

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
433
714
136
People are stuck in the past. AMD is a very different company compared to ten and even 5 years ago.
AMD has 2 server platforms, trash-lowend-premium-highend level mobile chips, two core IP variants, hybrid chips, 3D variants, etc. They aim at making multiple different accelerator lines. They want to create an ultra-premium mobile line. Not even mentioning the Xilinx IPs.

All this costs money to develop and bring to the market. They didn't have those money 5 years ago.

Yet, RTG products are still abysmal with no magic change on the horizon.
 
Reactions: A///

Ajay

Lifer
Jan 8, 2001
16,074
8,103
136
Radeon has to admit they are #2 by lowering the price and profiling themselves as such.
Yeah, they should just give up and settle for an unprofitable business with low market share. They would be better off exiting dGPUs that use that 'business' model. They screwed up on RDNA3 and apparently 4. They have a plan to Make RDNA5 a winner - hope they are able to pull it off, grab some decent market share and profits. Then we will have more choices between competitive products in each market segment.

The days of getting 40% more performance for the same price as the last gen are going away. The slowing gains on xtor performance are a big component of that. Once we TSMC starts needing High NA EUV lithography, big dies go away - so chiplets and advanced packing are the only way forward. Packaging techniques aren’t quite were they need to be yet for high volume high performance products - but allot of money is being poured into this. There are even shortages in packaging output for NVs H100s, where the money is there to pay for it.
 
Reactions: Tlh97 and krawcmac

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
11,161
3,858
136
Yet, RTG products are still abysmal with no magic change on the horizon.

There s a lot of viral marketing around AMD GPUs, not to point the finger on some users but reading here and there it seems that most NV users act so at the behalf of their brand, and at the end thoses purposely fabricated urban legends are taken at face value.

Better to lOok at real numbers and you ll understand why AMD is vilified, i.E, because that s the only mean to keep them from gaining marketshare as their GPUs are very competitive perfs and perf/price wise :

 

adroc_thurston

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2023
3,298
4,723
96
Missing a true DLSS alt, various subpar implementations of FSR, unusable VR months after the release on RDNA3, long standing multi-monitor/video power consumption problems, often broken OpenCL driver releases, recent broken HW browser video acceleration, no OptiX acceleration, broken DaVinci resolve, ROCm is no alternative to the CUDA stack, long standing OpenGL Windows issues, etc
People don't care about most things you've listed.
Not enough talent, overly ambitious, bad management?
Neither of the three.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
14,823
5,440
136
Cut funding to chase AI hype?

(Not that isn't a bad idea, given that people only buy AMD dGPUs when their margins suck)
 

yuri69

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
433
714
136
There s a lot of viral marketing around AMD GPUs, not to point the finger on some users but reading here and there it seems that most NV users act so at the behalf of their brand, and at the end thoses purposely fabricated urban legends are taken at face value.

Better to lOok at real numbers and you ll understand why AMD is vilified, i.E, because that s the only mean to keep them from gaining marketshare as their GPUs are very competitive perfs and perf/price wise
Those graphs are cool and shiny. However, the reality is Radeon brand compared to GeForce is like comparing SsangYong to Chrysler. Both offer usable products, although in the market PoV only one of them is feature complete, offers a wide range of support, is the "way to go", ...

Graphs like that do not include the feature set, brand name, or its legacy. There is no vilification needed.
Am trying to understand what MI300 is.
Can you help me?
Looks too leadership to be abysmal with no magic change on the horizon.
The rant concerns Radeon dGPUs but whatever.

My crystal ball tells me the MI300 series is a line of products with availability in H1 2024. It is a product finally making that 2015 big-APU idea somehow viable. Yet, the theoretical performance in the "AI precision" is behind 2022 H100, right? Also it will have to rely on the ROCm stack which is ... not supported the way you would expect.
Which is why you build the biggest stick and charge whatever for it.
This is ATi/AMD's classic!

All those big bad chips hyped as "nVidia killers"... the memories: R520, R600, Cayman, Tahiti, Fiji, Vega 10, Vega 20, or Navi 31. NVidia always just released a faster card - often with no sweat, no fancy tech, no wide bus, nor Ti variants.

Betting on the biggest stick is nice but it has to be the real flagship product with polished features, SW support, etc. People somehow don't want to shell $1-2k.
 

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
11,161
3,858
136
Those graphs are cool and shiny. However, the reality is Radeon brand compared to GeForce is like comparing SsangYong to Chrysler. Both offer usable products, although in the market PoV only one of them is feature complete, offers a wide range of support, is the "way to go", ...

Graphs like that do not include the feature set, brand name, or its legacy. There is no vilification needed.

The rant concerns Radeon dGPUs but whatever.

Graphs perfs do not need any comment, they speak loud and right, reality is that AMD s GPUs are of good performance and at more afordable prices than their NV counterparts.

Features like DLSS are useless, this was implemented because they didnt know how to increase perfs without throwing more silicon and make new cards desirables, so they did rely on interpolation, wich is basically to compute an intermediary theorical frame, but at worse the AI will create artifacts, or even reproduce the same frame to fill the void and boost the framerate but at the expense of quality and real imaging, nothing is worth the rasterized real FPS.

Also it s several gens that AMD drivers are better, but we still hear the contrary based on a 20 years old issue at a time when ATI wasnt even part of AMD, at the end viral marketing is king when it comes to make some critics about AMD GPUs since on the technical side there s really nothing worth mentioning.
 
Last edited:

adroc_thurston

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2023
3,298
4,723
96
The rant concerns Radeon dGPUs but whatever.
It is a Radeon dGPU.
My crystal ball tells me the MI300 series is a line of products with availability in H1 2024
You don't know anything then.
Yet, the theoretical performance in the "AI precision" is behind 2022 H100, right?
You can do the math yourself, there's an endnote for MI300A quoting 2500TF sparse FP8 achieved (guess what % of theorethical it is).
Also it will have to rely on the ROCm stack which is ... not supported the way you would expect.
Oh it works well enough.
Just not on client dGPs.
All those big bad chips hyped as "nVidia killers"... the memories: R520, R600, Cayman, Tahiti, Fiji, Vega 10, Vega 20, or Navi 31
Wow how wonderful that you've skipped R580 or Cypress or Hawaii or N21.
Just so little bias in that post.
Also Cayman was tiny (and so was V20, really) and Tahiti was very much a flagship product no strings attached.
Betting on the biggest stick is nice but it has to be the real flagship product with polished features, SW support, etc.
No it has to be the biggest stick.
 
Reactions: Tlh97

yuri69

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
433
714
136
Graphs perfs do not need any comment, they speak loud and right, reality is that AMD s GPUs are of good performance and at more afordable prices than their NV counterparts.
Indeed, that's always been the case. ATi/AMD is the a bit cheaper alternative to nV. But is this enough? The market doesn't think so.
 

Thunder 57

Platinum Member
Aug 19, 2007
2,794
4,075
136
This is ATi/AMD's classic!

All those big bad chips hyped as "nVidia killers"... the memories: R520, R600, Cayman, Tahiti, Fiji, Vega 10, Vega 20, or Navi 31. NVidia always just released a faster card - often with no sweat, no fancy tech, no wide bus, nor Ti variants.

Betting on the biggest stick is nice but it has to be the real flagship product with polished features, SW support, etc. People somehow don't want to shell $1-2k.

Let's just ignore R300, R350, RV770, 5870, 6970, and 7970.
 
Reactions: Tlh97 and NTMBK

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
11,161
3,858
136
Indeed, that's always been the case. ATi/AMD is the a bit cheaper alternative to nV. But is this enough? The market doesn't think so.

The market is heavily influenced by the constant viral marketing against AMD, Nvidia doesnt even need to pay too much people to do the job, their users are constantly bashing AMD while ignoring anything problematic in their brand GPU.

Indeed you act the same, you dont even look at the perfs and instead are telling me that cluless and influenced people choice is the prove that Radeon cards are no good, that s akin to say that 10 people saying that 1 + 1 = 11 are right against the one guy who say that the result is actually 2.
 

Thunder 57

Platinum Member
Aug 19, 2007
2,794
4,075
136
The market is heavily influenced by the constant viral marketing against AMD, Nvidia doesnt even need to pay too much people to do the job, their users are constantly bashing AMD while ignoring anything problematic in their brand GPU.

Indeed you act the same, you dont even look at the perfs and instead are telling me that cluless and influenced people choice is the prove that Radeon cards are no good, that s akin to say that 10 people saying that 1 + 1 = 11 are right against the one guy who say that the result is actually 2.

"but AMD drivers yo!". that has been garbage since Rage 128. 9700 Pro at best. Rage 128 was a bit of a pain, but once working it ran Half Life like a gem.
 
Reactions: Tlh97 and NTMBK

yuri69

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
433
714
136
From top of my head:
  • R300 got no hype due R200 issues. But yea, it is a legend.
  • RV770 was thought to have 640 shaders, again no hype. Additionally, it failed to beat nV, reportedly was really bad for AMD...
  • Cypress was somehow good and lived up the hype, you are right at this one.
  • Cayman was a let down after Cypress. It failed the hype.
  • Tahiti was beaten by a 256b cheapo GK104. No fine-wine, pls.
  • Hawaii was nice but a power hog which got no replacement vs less hoggy nV.
  • Navi 21 failed to be the nV crusher due the RT hype. But it was a nice chip for sure.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
14,823
5,440
136
That was all RDNA4, yes.
The halo part was an egregiously expensive tiled silicon spam wunderwaffen.

Tiled GPU isn't about cheaper, it's about winning more.

It's both. One of the biggest problems they've had is that usually the cut model is a far better deal than the full.. undermining the full model. They tried reversing this with the 7900 XT but it failed since the XT didn't sell at all until the price fell. In a chiplet world, the 7900 XT doesn't need to exist since they would use the partially busted tiles on some other product.
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |