Just think how great a 6800xt would be on 5nm silicon. You can take 20% off those power numbers in your chart.
Just think how great a 6800xt would be on 5nm silicon. You can take 20% off those power numbers in your chart.@MrPickins didn't fully follow through with the reasoning, he should have stopped at ISO performance.
Consider this, the Asus TUF 7800XT is 7.5% faster than 4070, while consuming roughly 275W versus 200W. Here's what happens when you're willing to give up 5-6% performance on an 6800XT by lowering clocks, no undervolt. The workload is an UE4 game.
View attachment 85722
There we go, ~70W delta.
I'd be concerned about those GPU > Hotspot deltas. Those are some pretty wide gaps.Power color 7800XT Hellhound is a Beast, lowest temps with lowest noise (low DB) and 6900XT performance at 520 USD (new egg) or 600 Euros (Germany)
Number one place in the Computerbase.de 7800XT Custom 5 card review
PowerColor Radeon RX 7800 XT Hellhound Review - Amazing Noise Levels
PowerColor's Radeon RX 7800 XT Hellhound is an amazing custom-design for AMD's new release. It sells at the $500 baseline price, yet has the best cooler of all cards tested today, with whisper-quiet fan settings, dual BIOS and RGB illumination.www.techpowerup.com
Eh, I am pretty sure it’s just poor clock scaling and the higher than optimal clocks as demonstrated just a few posts ago. Had they been able to scale clocks more efficiently or been still competitive with 10% lower clock speeds we’d be just fine with the efficiency.My personal feeling is that RDNA3's caching algorithm is poor and leads to a lot of VRAM accesses, increasing the power usage. Begrudgingly I have to admit that the green team engineers have worked out a pretty elegant design that would have worked beautifully in a game console or a handheld. But of course, their leader is too much of an idiot to let their technology be put to good use. Money first. Let the world burn but money first!
AMD ordered the Mercedes C class car in TSMC 5nm silicon and Nvidia paid for the top of the line S class Mercedes of TSMC silicon. Nobody wants to answer the question I posed in earlier threads. AMD, Nvidia and Intel GPU's are all now on TSMC silicon. Everybody assumes all 5nm TSMC is the same. For the first time since AMD has been on TSMC silicon. The playing field is no longer level or the same. You have to pay for performance on the same node. Nvidia went with the high end 5nm silicon because crypto was flying high and they wanted to move up in the TSMC customer ranks. Apple is #1. AMD was high up in the favorable customer rankings. You move up the list with large wafer purchases.My personal feeling is that RDNA3's caching algorithm is poor and leads to a lot of VRAM accesses, increasing the power usage. Begrudgingly I have to admit that the green team engineers have worked out a pretty elegant design that would have worked beautifully in a game console or a handheld. But of course, their leader is too much of an idiot to let their technology be put to good use. Money first. Let the world burn but money first!
Memory Subsystem
The Ada SM contains 128 KB of Level 1 cache. This cache features a unified architecture that can be configured
to function as an L1 data cache or shared memory depending on the workload. The full AD102 GPU contains
18432 KB of L1 cache (compared to 10752 KB in GA102).
Compared to Ampere, Ada’s Level 2 cache has been completely revamped. AD102 has been outfitted with
98304 KB of L2 cache, an improvement of 16x over the 6144 KB that shipped in GA102. All applications will
benefit from having such a large pool of fast cache memory available, and complex operations such as ray
tracing (particularly path tracing) will yield the greatest benefit.
260-270w power consumption is pretty poor for N32 when N21/6800XT on last gen process is similar performing at 300-310w, and the original RTX 3080, an arguably faster card if including RT, is c. 330-340w and was criticized for power consumption at launch. 20-25% better efficiency than a gpu fabbed on Samsung 8nm is nothing to write home about.I suspect that the chiplet design does partly contribute to higher power usage. Keep in mind that RDNA3 is an early product to utilize GPU chiplets. There can be issues with new tech at first, we all know this. But 275W still isn't bad for the performance, and the price is decent too.
Thats total non sense, if you reduce the 7800XT perf down to the 4070 level and cut 4GB out of 16 it will consume about the same power amount +-10W.
They did it for ray tracing first, the power efficiency is an added benefit. They probably wouldn't have done it for power efficiency alone, as the large cache has a high cost: it either forces larger and more expensive dies, or it limits the amount of compute or I/O one can cram in the same die space. You can look at the large L2 as the feature that made Ada very power efficient, but you can also look at it as the reason why the 4060Ti had to go with 128 bit bus and barely managed to present itself as a performance upgrade over last gen. The L2 scales nicely with the bigger Ada dies, the smaller ones feel the pain of compromise.I think my hunch was right. Ada really is power efficient due to very large L1 and L2 caches that keep the various units busy instead of waiting for data and burning useless energy and coupled with fewer VRAM accesses, it leads to vastly better power efficiency.
260-270w power consumption is pretty poor for N32 when N21/6800XT on last gen process is similar performing at 300-310w, and the original RTX 3080, an arguably faster card if including RT, is c. 330-340w and was criticized for power consumption at launch. 20-25% better efficiency than a gpu fabbed on Samsung 8nm is nothing to write home about.
.
He wrote 260-270W, not 275W. That can also be considered as doctoring false numbers to downplay other users.It s 249W, not 275W, and 32% better efficency, not the same as 20-25%...
Better to look at real numbers rather than more or less doctoring false numbers to downplay a product.
AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT & RX 7700 XT im Test: Lautstärke, Temperatur, Leistungsaufnahme und OC
Radeon RX 7800 XT & 7700 XT im Test: Lautstärke, Temperatur, Leistungsaufnahme und OC / Lautstärke & Kühlungwww.computerbase.de
So since you do use Computerbase as a reference ..It s 249W, not 275W, and 32% better efficency, not the same as 20-25%...
Better to look at real numbers rather than more or less doctoring false numbers to downplay a product.
AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT & RX 7700 XT im Test: Lautstärke, Temperatur, Leistungsaufnahme und OC
Radeon RX 7800 XT & 7700 XT im Test: Lautstärke, Temperatur, Leistungsaufnahme und OC / Lautstärke & Kühlungwww.computerbase.de
That s total non sense, if you reduce the 7800XT perf down to the 4070 level and cut 4GB out of 16 it will consume about the same power amount +-10W.
Yup I think it's pretty clear that Ada's caches allow it to get away with way lower Vram bandwidth than RDNA3 can.. But I sure don't know how one realistically gets 12gb N32 without cutting an MCD 😉It's not a good idea to cut out one MCD from N32 as shown with 7700XT. You loose 1/4 of BW and 1/4 of Infinity cache.
It cripples performance too much, despite only 6% difference in TFLOPs.
Ada104 has lower BW requirements in comparison.
Very nice, but you also need to be lucky with your AMD GPU, you can end up with worse silicon.Hold my beer...
View attachment 85756
So since you do use Computerbase as a reference ..
View attachment 85753
View attachment 85754
Where's this 7800XT that performs like a 4070 at 4070 power draw again? Because AMD more or less made a 12GB 7800XT in the 7700XT and that sure ain't it..
260-270w power consumption is pretty poor for N32 when N21/6800XT on last gen process is similar performing at 300-310w, and the original RTX 3080, an arguably faster card if including RT, is c. 330-340w and was criticized for power consumption at launch. 20-25% better efficiency than a gpu fabbed on Samsung 8nm is nothing to write home about.
We were specifically talking about NOT undervolting, as undervolting can also be applied to Nvidia cards too. Underclocking shows all 7800XT cards can be ~200W cards when aiming for roughly equal raster performance as the 4070.Hold my beer... (though it seems 170W would be enough)
Mine is a usual reference design of modest quality, mem OC does help, though not as much as other "optimizations" do. It's just that the outcome heavily dependant on the type of worlkoad typical for a particular game. Here's another example just for the illustrative purposes (> 40% reduction in power):Very nice, but you also need to be lucky with your AMD GPU, you can end up with worse silicon.
From that picture actually OC-ing memory helped performance despite downclocking the GPU.
The pointy elbows of cable management. Reported.You don't need a big case to fit a big card. My ginormous XFXView attachment 85678 RX 6800 fit in my CoolerMaster NR200, just barely, but it fit.
Great findings, thanks.Gaming Overclocking Performance vs reference 7800XT,
+12% in Cyberpunk 77
+15% in God of war
+13% in Horizon Zero Dawn
Not bad,
PowerColor RX 7800 XT Hellhound Review - KitGuru
Following on from our launch day review of AMD's reference RX 7800 XT graphics card, today we turn owww.kitguru.net
Ah... I see. Although it's not clear why you choose to limit the clocks (not a good idea for the real case scenarios) instead of just limiting gpu power.We were specifically talking about NOT undervolting, as undervolting can also be applied to Nvidia cards too. Underclocking shows all 7800XT cards can be ~200W cards when aiming for roughly equal raster performance as the 4070.
I think it illustrates well (and did with Ampere too) just how silly the stock clock settings were. You also don't need to limit power if your "boost clock" aren't set to stupid levels on the chips efficiency curve.Ah... I see. Although it's not clear why you choose to limit the clocks (not a good idea for the real case scenarios) instead of just limiting gpu power.
Because the power slider on my card allows for only 15% adjustment, as the engineers also thought the same about the power slider... that it's purpose is to expand power.Ah... I see. Although it's not clear why you choose to limit the clocks (not a good idea for the real case scenarios) instead of just limiting gpu power.
The clock slider in wattman is for expanding its limit, not to decrease.