AMD 7970 v Nvidia GTX 770

[MrK6]

7970 + games is better bang/buck. GTX 770 would be better if you're planning on multi-GPU (bad decision IMO, but your money), although as mentioned 2GB might be a problem in the near future.

 

[toyota]

IMO the 770 should be $350 and come with at least one AAA title. and yeah 2gb of vram might be sketchy within a year so that makes 400 bucks even harder to swallow for that card. its ridiculous that we have to pay $650 or more to get a card with 384 bit bus and 3gb of memory from Nvidia. Nvidia has to be laughing selling what essentially is nothing more than scraps for 650 and 1000 bucks.

 

[powruser]

IMO the 770 should be $350 and come with at least one AAA title. and yeah 2gb of vram might be sketchy within a year so that makes 400 bucks even harder to swallow for that card. its ridiculous that we have to pay $650 or more to get a card with 384 bit bus and 3gb of memory from Nvidia. Nvidia has to be laughing selling what essentially is nothing more than scraps for 650 and 1000 bucks.

If anything the GTX 760 and 770 are scraps because they're GK104, but GTX 780 and Titan are GK110, which is a new chip, definitely not scraps.

 

[ICDP]

If anything the GTX 760 and 770 are scraps because they're GK104, but GTX 780 and Titan are GK110, which is a new chip, definitely not scraps.

He's referring to the fact that GK110 is a cut down Quadro chip.

 

[monster88]

We both know that was a weak attempt at best for a member call out. The only company I could possibly be shilling for is AMD, because they don't require disclosure.

Instead of attacking other members, why not instead produce something that refutes what they believe to be factual information/reasons?

Besides, if I was shilling for anyone at this point it would have to be Intel. They sent me this awesome cherry picked 60C at 4.8GHz 1.25v i5, pick one up today!

why should i even bother?

[removed]

^ how you typically react when someone proves you wrong in an amd vs nvida discussion

Second warning issued for personal attack. And if you ever post an image like that in this forum again, you're getting a vacation.
-- stahlhart

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I'm not even discussing AMD vs Nvidia, I'm talking about why AMD is dropping their prices.

In fact I never even said the 770 was a better buy, I think the 7970 is at current pricing. The 770 is overpriced and Nvidia needs a 770Ti based on GK110 with 40 ROPs and a 320 bus, the 770 fell short.

The more important question, is why even bother responding to you at all?

 

[UaVaj]

If you're sure you will add a second card, either buy Nvidia now or wait to see what AMD's driver update does July 31st. If you want to save a lot of money and buy now, go AMD, and hope the upcoming drivers are good:

good advice on multi gpu.

owned both 7970cf and 680/770sli.

7970 sold. 680/770 still in use.

enough said.

 

[Carfax83]

In fact I never even said the 770 was a better buy, I think the 7970 is at current pricing. The 770 is overpriced and Nvidia needs a 770Ti based on GK110 with 40 ROPs and a 320 bus, the 770 fell short.

How is it overpriced? It slightly edges the fastest single core graphics card from their competitor (which costs more on average), whilst providing additional benefits like SLI that works great right out of the box, PhysX (if you like it) and 3D Vision..

If it was overpriced, NVidia would be the ones to drop their prices, and not AMD.. I was actually considering AMD as an option about a year ago. I made a thread enquiring about 7970 Ghz Crossfire owner experiences. Needless to say, I chickened out, because I didn't want to jump through hoops to get Crossfire working properly.

Not having proper Crossfire support definitely weakens AMD's high end market, and could be why they've lost discrete marketshare to NVIdia. Hopefully they can resolve the problem with their new driver set this month.

Going back to the 770, to justify the price range of the 780, the 770 can't be too fast. An overclocked GTX 770 requires at least 1250 MHz to come within a few percentage points of the GTX 780, and about 1320 MHz or so to more or less tie it.

No manufacturer is going to release cards clocked to such a high level, so GTX 780 supremacy is assured. I bought two GTX 770 4GB cards, and at no time did I think they were overpriced. They were a steal, because they're only 15% or 16% slower than a GTX 780 on average whilst costing 46 or 47% less.

It's the GTX 780 thats vastly overpriced if anything.

 

[toyota]

well I do think 400 bucks is just too much. heck its 25% faster than the 760 but costs 60% more. plus some of that difference is simply from the higher default clocks. oc both the 760 and 770 and you are talking less than 20% difference. also 400 bucks for a card with only 2gb of vram at this point just seems crazy. IMO 350 bucks is what the 2gb 770 should go for and 400 for a 4gb model.

 

[Carfax83]

well I do think 400 bucks is just too much. heck its 25% faster than the 760 but costs 60% more.

It's a better spread than the difference between the 780 and the 770.

But thats with high end cards in general. Gamers buy high end cards not only for performance, but for bragging rights too. Those bragging rights come with a cost.

plus some of that difference is simply from the higher default clocks. oc both the 760 and 770 and you are talking less than 20% difference.

Here are some reviews of two overclocked GTX 760s:

KFA2 GTX 760

Inno3D GTX 760

And here's the MSI GTX 770 Lightning for comparison:

MSI GTX 770 Lightning

Looking at the overclock scores, I'm seeing above 20% for the most part, and close to 30% as well. The only game where the overclocked GTX 760 is less than 20% slower than than the overclocked GTX 770, is Hitman Absolution, and that game favors AMD big time.

also 400 bucks for a card with only 2gb of vram at this point just seems crazy. IMO 350 bucks is what the 2gb 770 should go for and 400 for a 4gb model.

I would agree with that pricing, but until AMD fix their Crossfire issues and become more competitive, NVidia can charge slightly more for their products.

 

[Shmee]

The way I see it, the 7970 is still the 3rd highest performing current gen card, after the titan and gtx 780. The 770 and 680 are comparable, but to my understanding just can't compete when overclocked.

 

[toyota]

The way I see it, the 7970 is still the 3rd highest performing current gen card, after the titan and gtx 780. The 770 and 680 are comparable, but to my understanding just can't compete when overclocked.

I dont know why you would say that. even at 2560 the 770 and 680 are even with the 7970 when all 3 are oced. not too mention the 770 Hard had was a dud of an overclocker. the 7970 does do much better in Tomb Raider but that is with the TressFX enabled. disable that and there goes that lead.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/06/06/msi_n770_lightning_overclocking_review/3#.UdPRGPmyDf4

 

[Silverforce11]

IMO the 770 should be $350 and come with at least one AAA title. and yeah 2gb of vram might be sketchy within a year so that makes 400 bucks even harder to swallow for that card. its ridiculous that we have to pay $650 or more to get a card with 384 bit bus and 3gb of memory from Nvidia. Nvidia has to be laughing selling what essentially is nothing more than scraps for 650 and 1000 bucks.

Holy crap.. you are finally coming out and saying what needs to be said, NV is ripping consumers off so badly.

If AMD do a refresh in a few months and charge $500 for a OC 7970 performance.. we can all join in the corporate rip off bashing together.

 

[raghu78]

I dont know why you would say that. even at 2560 the 770 and 680 are even with the 7970 when all 3 are oced. not too mention the 770 Hard had was a dud of an overclocker. the 7970 does do much better in Tomb Raider but that is with the TressFX enabled. disable that and there goes that lead.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/06/06/msi_n770_lightning_overclocking_review/3#.UdPRGPmyDf4

why should we ignore HD 7970's commanding lead in a game like tombraider. AMD is investing significantly in GE in the last 18 months and the results are there for everyone to see. When Nvidia was doing the same with TWIMTBP everybody was complaining that AMD was not proactive with working closely with developers. Now when AMD is aggressive with GE AMD's perf leads in those games are not important.

Games like tombraider, hitman absolution, sleeping dogs, dirt showdown, Grid 2 , company of heroes 2 are running significantly faster on AMD HD 7970 Ghz wrt GTX 770. in sleeping dogs HD 7970 ghz is close behind titan.

Sleeping dogs

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/02/21/nvidia_geforce_gtx_titan_video_card_review/5#.UdPottj3x8E

http://techreport.com/review/24996/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760-graphics-card-reviewed/8

Hitman Absolution

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/03/11/asus_hd_7970_directcu_ii_video_card_review/8#.UdPqBtj3x8E

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...1369-nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-2gb-review-7.html

company of heroes 2

http://gamegpu.ru/rts-/-strategii/company-of-heroes-2-test-gpu.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/689-company-of-heroes-2-performance/page2.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/graphics/display/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760_9.html#sect0

 

[RussianSensation]

It's a better spread than the difference between the 780 and the 770.

But thats with high end cards in general. Gamers buy high end cards not only for performance, but for bragging rights too. Those bragging rights come with a cost.

If you look at the benchmarks from GameGPU, there is a larger spread between 780 OC and 770 OC then there is between 760 OC and 770 OC. This makes sense since 780 has higher overclocking room than 770 does.

I would agree with that pricing, but until AMD fix their Crossfire issues and become more competitive, NVidia can charge slightly more for their products.

1Ghz HD7970 for $310 vs. $450 4GB GTX770 is not "slightly more". If you are talking about SLI vs. CF, then it's $620 vs. $900! You first said $1,300 is way too much for 780s in SLI vs. $900 for 770s, and yet 780 OC is 30-35% faster than 770 OC but 770 OC is barely faster than 7970 OC CF yet costs nearly $300 more for 770 SLI. Logic does not compute. You just artificially created a constraint that you won't pay more than $1,000 for dual-GPUs. That still doesn't relieve 770s from their poor value proposition.

IMO 350 bucks is what the 2gb 770 should go for and 400 for a 4gb model.

Those are much more reasonable prices but even then the 4GB version would be 29% more expensive than 1Ghz 7970.

 

[Shmee]

I dont know why you would say that. even at 2560 the 770 and 680 are even with the 7970 when all 3 are oced. not too mention the 770 Hard had was a dud of an overclocker. the 7970 does do much better in Tomb Raider but that is with the TressFX enabled. disable that and there goes that lead.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/06/06/msi_n770_lightning_overclocking_review/3#.UdPRGPmyDf4

Hmm interesting, last I heard, 79x0 series overclocked so well, they usually beat the GTX 600 cards when both were overclocked. I suppose newer driver updates, plus game updates and perhaps better GTX 600/700 overclocks are putting them more neck and neck.

This means you cant really go wrong, just go for the best deal, (usually 7970 now) unless you want multi GPU, then nvidia has smother SLI performance.

It will be interesting to see how the crossfire fix changes this, if at all. Might be time to pick up either a new 7970 after that, to go with the 7950, or wait for CFX HD 9000 series.

 

[toyota]

why should we ignore HD 7970's commanding lead in a game like tombraider. AMD is investing significantly in GE in the last 18 months and the results are there for everyone to see. When Nvidia was doing the same with TWIMTBP everybody was complaining that AMD was not proactive with working closely with developers. Now when AMD is aggressive with GE AMD's perf leads in those games are not important.

Games like tombraider, hitman absolution, sleeping dogs, dirt showdown, Grid 2 , company of heroes 2 are running significantly faster on AMD HD 7970 Ghz wrt GTX 770. in sleeping dogs HD 7970 ghz is close behind titan.

Sleeping dogs

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/02/21/nvidia_geforce_gtx_titan_video_card_review/5#.UdPottj3x8E

http://techreport.com/review/24996/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760-graphics-card-reviewed/8

Hitman Absolution

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/03/11/asus_hd_7970_directcu_ii_video_card_review/8#.UdPqBtj3x8E

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...1369-nvidia-geforce-gtx-770-2gb-review-7.html

company of heroes 2

http://gamegpu.ru/rts-/-strategii/company-of-heroes-2-test-gpu.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/689-company-of-heroes-2-performance/page2.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/graphics/display/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760_9.html#sect0

way to take it out of context. I was saying that it was that one setting that gives AMD the big lead in that game. the other games they tested were dead even and that was at 2560 with all cards oced. and yes we all know there are games that go back and forth, especially depending on the settings, but many of the AMD bundled games actually run better on Nvidia cards anyway.

 

[raghu78]

way to take it out of context. I was saying that it was that one setting that gives AMD the big lead in that game. the other games they tested were dead even and that was at 2560 with all cards oced. and yes we all know there are games that go back and forth, especially depending on the settings, but many of the AMD bundled games actually run better on Nvidia cards anyway.

you are wrong. a heavily factory overclocked GTX 770 doing 1.2 ghz is slower than a stock HD 7970 Ghz at 1.05 ghz at 2560 x 1600 Ultra settings without Tress FX enabled. you can see the GTX 770 lightning doing 52.5 fps without tress fx and 39.4 fps with tress fx at 1600p. hd 7970 ghz does 54.5 fps without tress fx and 40.6 fps with tress fx at 1600p. so TressFX is not the reason for AMD HD 7970 Ghz to be faster. its just that this game runs better on HD 7970 Ghz. once overclocked the HD 7970 Ghz leaves the GTX 770 OC behind in the dust.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013...70_lightning_video_card_review/5#.UdQMdtj3x8E

"Unfortunately, even the highly clocked MSI GeForce GTX 770 Lightning wasn't fast enough to give us playable gameplay with TressFX turned on at 2560x1600. To get that kind of gameplay you will need at least a GeForce GTX 780. The best we could manage was to play this game at the highest settings at 2560x1600 with "ultra" settings enabled, including shadows. We had to set the hair to "normal" quality.

This then matched the same level of gameplay we were able to achieve from the GeForce GTX 680 and Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition at 2560x1600. Naturally, the MSI GeForce GTX 770 Lightning was faster than the GTX 680 though, and gave us faster framerates. The MSI GTX 770 Lighting was 15% faster than the GeForce GTX 680. In this game however, the Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition was a bit faster than the new MSI GeForce GTX Lightning. Here, the HD 7970 GE is 4% faster, even with just normal hair enabled. "

the fact is more games are going in AMD's favour because of AMD's GE program . thats why i mentioned the other games. the margins are not small either. thats the reason a HD 7970 OC wins more games and on average is the faster card compared to GTX 770 OC. in games like crysis 3, farcry 3, bf3, metro last light you see them close but in other GE games like tombraider, hitman, sleeping dogs, dirt showdown, grid 2, coh 2 its not close at all.

 

[Silverforce11]

We're gonna be stuck for another 8 years of console ports.. but its gonna be developed for an entirely AMD ecosystem ground up.. imagine that.

 

[gammaray]

if i look on newegg, most 7970 are around 400$ and so are the 770gtx.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...NG&PageSize=20

having a card on sale around 300$ doesn.t make the 7970 best bang for the buck, it makes *that card* on sale best bang for the buck.

So the whole debate here is quite silly.

You have to want a sapphire and you have to want that particular model...

 

[cmdrdredd]

We're gonna be stuck for another 8 years of console ports.. but its gonna be developed for an entirely AMD ecosystem ground up.. imagine that.

Directx is not proprietary to any manufacturer though. I don't see any reason to pick one over the other based on what is inside a console.

 

[Elfear]

if i look on newegg, most 7970 are around 400$ and so are the 770gtx.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...NG&PageSize=20

having a card on sale around 300$ doesn.t make the 7970 best bang for the buck, it makes *that card* on sale best bang for the buck.

So the whole debate here is quite silly.

You have to want a sapphire and you have to want that particular model...

That Sapphire model is a good solid card. If it was the XFX DD, you might have a point but there isn't much reason not to go with the Sapphire when it is so cheap (unless you have some special circumstance like extreme overclocking or space considerations).

If a good 7970Ghz can be bought for that cheap, of course it should enter into a conversation about bang for your buck. I'm not talking a 6-hour fire sale but something that is available for awhile. It would be the same thing with a 770 available for a good deal.

 

[bryanW1995]

Right now SLI has less microstutter than Crossfire. With that being said AMD will be releasing a Crossfire fix on July 31st that is supposed to fix the ms issues.

When I game with more than one 7970 I use a frame limiter (RadeonPro or Afterburner) and my games run very smooth. If you've got a 120hz monitor that might not work so well but it works great for 60hz.

If you had asked me which to get for a mult-GPU setup a couple days ago, I would have said the 770 but prices on 7970s are extremely good right now ($290-310). I'd say it's worth saving $150-200 and using a frame-limiter but that's just my opinion.

Alternatively you could get a single 7950, overclock it to within an inch of its life, and wait a month to see what happens on the Crossfire front.

This is the reason that I went with 7970. I was ready to pull the trigger on a gtx 770, but found an OC edition 7970 for $307 AR that was just too good of a deal to pass up.

 

[Silverforce11]

Directx is not proprietary to any manufacturer though. I don't see any reason to pick one over the other based on what is inside a console.

You don't? Look at the recent PC GE games. Now imagine GE being infinitely more effective when its designed ground up to take advantage of the hardware inside consoles.. that's radeon GCN and Jaguar.

Doesn't take a genius to figure out future crossplatform games will run better on radeons due to the overwhelming development focus.

 

[f1sherman]

Doesn't take a genius to figure out future crossplatform games will run better on radeons due to the overwhelming development focus.

Indeed it doesn't.

Just a pinch of faith