Basically. I was actually very interested in buying a couple of 7970 GHZ cards last year. I even made a thread about it. That was right at the time when AMD started making big strides in improving their drivers, and had overtaken the GTX 680.
What stopped me though was the lack of Crossfire support. If you play above 1200p, multi GPU is almost a necessity if you want all the eye candy enabled.
So AMD has lost a lot of sales and high end discrete market share to NVidia by having a broken Crossfire implementation.
Now look at regular pricing of a 1Ghz 7970 and it can be found easily for $360-370.
Now look at regular pricing of a 1Ghz 7970 and it can be found easily for $360-370.
Do you mean a non-GHz edition 7970? All the GHz edition 7970s I see are north of $400.
This does matter, but it's not especially salient because very few games use that feature and NVidia aren't exactly weak in compute either.
How does AMD have better developer relations? While it's true that AMD have been very aggressive lately in adding titles to their GE program, NVidia haven't been sitting on their laurels. Assassin's Creed IV, Splinter Cell Black List, Watch Dogs, Batman Arkham Origins, Witcher 3 are all AAA titles and TWIMTBP games.
Do you mean a non-GHz edition 7970? All the GHz edition 7970s I see are north of $400.
And yet the membership in such a program does say nothing at all about how well a title performs. What does it actually mean to "have" a title?
And btw...just because an IHV has a title in their program doesn't mean the other IHV has no contacts with the developer or is a second-class partner. First and foremost it is advertising.
You do the math, GTX 770 4GB needs a price drop.
I think you missed the memo with Kepler - anything GK104 has essentially no compute performance. The 400 and 500 series have more compute performance than Kepler. Meanwhile, Tahiti has more compute performance than GK110 even....
Nvidia has been sitting on their laurels. Batman and Witcher are weak competition compared to major, major titles like Battlefield 4 and Crysis 3 and Tomb Raider, Far Cry 3 and Bioshock. The only popular current game I can think of with TWIMTBP is Metro:LL. Nvidia has had a few titles, sure. AMD has had almost every major AAA game in the last year.
. If AMD makes hardware that matches NV's, then it's game over for NV.
Witcher 3 will be a next gen exclusive game, and is definitely a big deal because it will be the first game to have no chapters, loading screens or artificial breaks in a completely open World setting.
If Kepler has "no compute performance" as you put it, then how is it ahead of the 7970 in Civilization V, which uses Direct Compute for texture decompression, and after the Tomb Raider patch, not that far behind the Radeon?
LOL, so Witcher 3 isn't a major, major title? Witcher 3 will be a next gen exclusive game, and is definitely a big deal because it will be the first game to have no chapters, loading screens or artificial breaks in a completely open World setting.
But if you don't like the Witcher 3 or Batman Arkham Origin, there's always Watch Dogs and Assassin's Creed IV..
Oh lemme guess, those aren't "major, major" titles either
LOL, so Witcher 3 isn't a major, major title?
Awww shucks, Titan loses to 7970GE on SystemCompute
Kepler has extremely limited float and FP64 performance. They cut compute performance in order to save costs. Even GK110 doesn't really win against GCN.
You absolutely cannot deny that for each AAA game that Nvidia gets, there are 2 or 3 from AMD. So even including future titles, Nvidia has Witcher 3, Batman:AC and Batman: AO, Metro:LL, Assassains Creed 3 and 4... well AMD has Battlefield 3, Crysis 3, Far Cry 3, Bioshock Infinite, Dirt: Showdown, Dishonored, MOH:W, Sleeping Dogs, Tomb Raider... that list is much bigger and includes bigger titles than ANYTHING Nvidia has (Battlefield 3, Crysis 3, and Far Cry 3 are undeniable).
TWIMTBP isn't dead, but you'd have to be living under a rock to call it even close to competing with GE.
When compared to something like BF4, I don't think Witcher 3 is a major title. I will personally be buying it, but I don't think it will be in the same league sales wise as BF4 will be.
I meant in terms of actual game performance:
And if I were a Scientist doing HPC I might actually give a damn.
And yet Titan slaps the 7970 GE like a red headed step child in the few games that do use direct compute.
Even if what you say is true, what does it matter? You think that just because AMD "scores" a big title with their GE program, that the game is guaranteed to perform better?
Think again. I think you guys forget that it was NVidia that started doing this in the first place.
Well AMD has to compensate somehow for having inferior quality, and they needed to catch up to NVidia which has been doing this for years..
Critically acclaimed or blockbuster. Some are both, like Far Cry 3... which happens to be a GE title. Or acclaimed titles like Dishonored, which is... oh, GE! Or blockbusters, like Battlefield 3... which happens to be GE.Whats the criteria for a major title? Until we agree on that, there's no use debating this..
But it's not as though the Witcher 3 is the only TWIMTBP title. You have Watch Dogs, which is going to be major, and Assassin's Creed IV.
He means that AMD has worked closer with developers on majority of AAA titles in 2012 and up to now. If NV picks up in 2H of 2013, that's because they are now realizing that AMD's GE has a strong potential to hurt them. If AMD makes hardware that matches NV's, then it's game over for NV. Right now NV is using faster hardware in the form of GTX780/Titan to compensate.
It sure does mean something in most AMD GE titles. GTX770 max overclocked is needed to keep up with a stock 7970GE in at least COH2, Tomb Raider, Hitman Absolution, and Sleeping Dogs. In Grid 2, NV is straight up losing, needing almost a GTX780 to keep up with a stock 7970GE.
In Warframe, a 680 is obliterated. That's easily 6 games where AMD's direct developer relationship involvement has put their card way above its actual punching weight due to software optimizations.
NV can't be sitting still since AMD won't be using HD7970GE as their flagship card forever.
Wrong. This has nothing to do with software optimizations. The 7970 GHz still has more resources than any GK104 chip. No surprise here. Maybe for you since you still have not understood that.
It has to do with software optimization which allows the hardware to be used to its full potential at least for GRID 2, which uses compute in the engine and gives GCN a healthy advantage. That is a case of software optimization, but hardware advantage.
Wait, what on earth are you talking about then? Clearly the 7970 is better at the actual compute, are you talking about games or compute
Games like Dirt: Showdown use compute for the engine as well, and AMD does quite well there.
A 7970GE even beats a Titan from HWC.
That is clearly using more compute than Civ V. And with the PS4 using 4 CU's for compute, next gen games are going to possibly be made with GCN compute strengths in mind (or at least using GPU compute). Apply the results from Dirt: Showdown to any other game, and Nvidia's decision to remove compute stops looking so great for gamers...
Nvidia did it in the first place, AMD got better at it than Nvidia, ergo Nvidia is resting on their laurels, if you want to look at it that way :whiste:
And no, GE titles are often better on Nvidia hardware, as GE titles don't often employ such tactics as removing AA on Nvidia cards or adding entire tesselated oceans under maps for no reason...
Yes, and now they have surpassed Nvidia. So go ahead and play your TWIMTBP titles from 2009, AMD is the leader NOW.
Critically acclaimed or blockbuster. Some are both, like Far Cry 3... which happens to be a GE title. Or acclaimed titles like Dishonored, which is... oh, GE! Or blockbusters, like Battlefield 3... which happens to be GE.
AMD has more blockbuster titles. AMD has more acclaimed titles. You know why? Because they put more money into the program, and they get more titles than Nvidia. There is no logical argument that can hope to convince anyone that Nvidia can have a better program when they have less games, less blockbuster games, and less critically acclaimed games. They lose on every account.
3 major titles cannot hope to stand a chance against 10+.
A GTX780 is faster in Grid 2 with less compute performance.
Yeah, so much to AMD's advantage.