AMD Announces their GameWorks Equivalent

[Silverforce11]

Believe what you want, I tend to believe developers over, well... you. Sorry. :\

That was from their developer, you obviously missed that fiasco back then. On their official forums. Their lead software engineer.

What you are showcasing now is PR.

 

[bononos]

How does that help AMD?

It's all quite unbelievable. Here they are, bleeding millions every quarter, yet they continue to give away proprietary advantages on a silver platter to competitors.

Here's a hint AMD :- you don't make money by giving things away for free to competitors. That's why you're on the verge of bankruptcy.

I don't know if AMD has a choice here. Its the underdog and has to make it products more attractive.
AMD basically did alot of legwork for DX12/Vulkan with Mantle because MS wasn't moving fast enough. And probably for the same reason with Gpuopen.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Strange think TressFX also took drivers and patches for fixing mess, but ended locked down.

I think Lichdom: Battlemage using TressFX 2.0. I wouldn't be shocked if AMD will use dirty tricks suck as TressFX 1 for Nvidia, TressFX 3 for AMD in Deus Ex.

Also what's the point for AOFX aka HDAO? Enabled HDAO looks same as turned off but kills performance... Nvidia's of course.

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTM1NTUxNzk3MlNtdHptSllFZVlfN180X2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTM1NTUxNzk3MlNtdHptSllFZVlfN181X2wuZ2lm

I wonder if this will put a sock in the mouth for all those blindly defending AMD.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Good news that it is open source.

That depends how you see it. Try name the last successful open source part from AMD. Hence the inherit open physics joke in the start.

Its not going anywhere if the work is just put on someone else shoulders and expected to be done for free,

 

[Techhog]

That depends how you see it. Try name the last successful open source part from AMD. Hence the inherit open physics joke in the start.

Its not going anywhere if the work is just put on someone else shoulders and expected to be done for free,

Did any of you ever thing that the real issue with the industry is that GameWorks is not open source? Seriously, in any other part of the computer industry you guys are all in favor of open source, but here all you guys care about is being fanboys and AMD vs. Nvidia. If I wanted exclusive proprietary bullcrap, I would have stuck with consoles. You people won't be happy until there are Nvidia-exclusive games (or perhaps Intel in your case).

 

[sontin]

So, nVidia user cant demand nVidia optimized effects but they have to life with unoptimized AMD effects?

This doesnt make sense...

 

[Dribble]

Did any of you ever thing that the real issue with the industry is that GameWorks is not open source? Seriously, in any other part of the computer industry you guys are all in favor of open source, but here all you guys care about is being fanboys and AMD vs. Nvidia. If I wanted exclusive proprietary bullcrap, I would have stuck with consoles. You people won't be happy until there are Nvidia-exclusive games (or perhaps Intel in your case).

Companies have to make money. Hence if any of them makes something special they use it to sell their own goods. No game dev is going to develop some amazing bit of code then give it away for free to all the competing game devs. Neither will nvidia or AMD. Hence none of them will be putting much effort into AMD's initiative (yes that includes AMD - they can't commit real manpower to this as it has no return on the investment for AMD, they won't sell more cards!).

There is a bunch of people who don't work for any company and do create code for the greater good. They however have been proven time and again to not be sufficiently interested in AMD's initiatives to do anything with them.

Hence all this comes down too is a bunch of power points, some positive forum posts from all the fanboys, and a lot of hope. If you want AMD to succeed then joining in with the positive posts isn't going to help. Might as well tell it as it is and hope AMD stops with all the failed initiatives because they clearly aren't the way to make the company successful again.

 

[Snafuh]

So, nVidia user cant demand nVidia optimized effects but they have to live with unoptimized AMD effects?

This doesnt make sense...

Open Source means the devs can see and modify the source code. They can spend as much time with NVidia optimizations as they want. They could make the AMD effects only run on NVidia.
With a closed approach devs have to rely on Nvidia for support. This makes Gameworks less relevant for small projects.

 

[sontin]

Open Source means the devs can see and modify the source code. They can spend as much time with NVidia optimizations as they want. They could make the AMD effects only run on NVidia.

Or they are just using nVidia's Gamework libaries which are optimized for nVidia hardware.
Which developer would rewrite 90% of the unoptimized code and implement two different sets? Nobody.

With a closed approach devs have to rely on Nvidia for support. This makes Gameworks less relevant for small projects.

Nope. It is the other way: nVidia's middleware is the reason why so many games are using HBAO+ for example. Small projects dont really code. They design their games.

 

[therealnickdanger]

I thought that it was established some time ago that paying developers could modify source code of GameWorks - versus devs that don't pay and can't.

 

[Genx87]

Did any of you ever thing that the real issue with the industry is that GameWorks is not open source? Seriously, in any other part of the computer industry you guys are all in favor of open source, but here all you guys care about is being fanboys and AMD vs. Nvidia. If I wanted exclusive proprietary bullcrap, I would have stuck with consoles. You people won't be happy until there are Nvidia-exclusive games (or perhaps Intel in your case).

Opensource sounds so nice. Yet people rarely use truly open source software. At least in gaming. The biggest advancement in PC gaming APIs is Direct X. That is closed source and proprietary to MS operating systems. The open source competitor became irrelevant years ago. How about Physics? Remember how Bullet was going to take over physics operations years ago? Instead Havok and PhysX rule the roost. At the end of the day proprietary is not some horrible thing in the PC world. It drives innovation where open source is mired in bureaucracy.

 

[Bryf50]

Have you ever fanboyed so hard that you spin something(open source) that's obviously good into something negative? Many people in this thread have.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Have you ever fanboyed so hard that you spin something(open source) that's obviously good into something negative? Many people in this thread have.

If it is so good, why dont we see more of it? Specially in terms of usage. OpenGL, Open Physics etc. Instead of DirectX, GNM/GNMX, Havok, PhysX etc.

 

[NTMBK]

Or they are just using nVidia's Gamework libaries which are optimized for nVidia hardware.
Which developer would rewrite 90% of the unoptimized code and implement two different sets? Nobody.

By opening up like this, AMD is providing more choice. NVidia gives a binary choice- use our libraries as-is, without modification, or go and build your own implementation from scratch. Both of those choices are still available with the AMD libraries, but there is also the option to take an already working feature and make minor modifications to tweak it to work just the way you want.

Maybe you want to modify TressFX behaviour, to make the hair fit better with your game's art design. So you integrate the effect into your game, tweak the behaviour a bit, and you're done. You don't need to write an entire new hair shader effect from scratch.

 

[Bryf50]

Instead of DirectX, GNM/GNMX, Havok, PhysX etc.

So if tomorrow it was announced that all these would be going open source you would consider it a bad thing?

 

[ShintaiDK]

So if tomorrow it was announced that all these would be going open source you would consider it a bad thing?

Your hypothetical case is irrelevant. Only trying to change the goalpost.

People and companies tend to dislike to work for free.

 

[Bryf50]

Your hypothetical case is irrelevant. Only trying to change the goalpost.

People and companies tend to dislike to work for free.

And the fact that there exists proprietary software that is more popular than its open source counter-part is also irrelevant.

A company contributing to open source software isn't working for free. Do you believe that all of these companies are working purely for altruistic reasons? This clearly shows you have no clue what you're talking about.

 

[railven]

Also HITMAN and im sure BF5 (coming 2016 holidays) will be fully optimized for AMD hardware although not a pure GE title.

So, we only got 2 confirmed games, one probable, and one just announced to be in development? How does this support your prior post?

During the AMD Gaming Evolved initiative, they announced like 6 games off the bat with another 4-5 within a few months.

AMD needs to block Gameworks, otherwise Nvidia is gonna continue to get AAA titles under its belt.

 

[Azix]

If it is so good, why dont we see more of it? Specially in terms of usage. OpenGL, Open Physics etc. Instead of DirectX, GNM/GNMX, Havok, PhysX etc.

problem with open source is, if its used, you do not have to know. They will not advertise that they copy pasted or modified some open code from such and such.

The greatest benefit here is of course that this code can be optimized to kingdom come by developers. they can improve and have the improvements available to others. They can keep the proprietary stuff from their game engines but the special effects like fire etc do not have to be that way.

 

[AtenRa]

So, we only got 2 confirmed games, one probable, and one just announced to be in development? How does this support your prior post?

During the AMD Gaming Evolved initiative, they announced like 6 games off the bat with another 4-5 within a few months.

AMD needs to block Gameworks, otherwise Nvidia is gonna continue to get AAA titles under its belt.

4-5 DX-12 GE games for 2016 is fine, i dont believe NVIDIA released more than 5-6 GameWorks titles in 2015.

We could also see some already released games patched for DX-12 as well, also GCN could be extremely competitive in DX-12 GameWorks titles in 2016
like Fable etc.

So, the situation in 2016 will be completely different than what we had in 2015. New 16nm hardware, new GE games and especially DX-12 will help tremendously the AMD cards in 2016.

 

[sandorski]

AMD announces Mantle and people complain that it is closed and proprietary, despite AMD's claims otherwise.

AMD announces GPUOpen as Open Source and people complain that it is Open Source.

AMD is always wrong!

 

[dacostafilipe]

People and companies tend to dislike to work for free.

People in the gaming industry (aka Devs) like to share solutions to problems, new rendering techniques and other information.

Your view of software seems a little bit outdated. Even Microsoft is open sourcing more and more stuff ... D:

 

[desprado]

4-5 DX-12 GE games for 2016 is fine, i dont believe NVIDIA released more than 5-6 GameWorks titles in 2015.

We could also see some already released games patched for DX-12 as well, also GCN could be extremely competitive in DX-12 GameWorks titles in 2016
like Fable etc.

So, the situation in 2016 will be completely different than what we had in 2015. New 16nm hardware, new GE games and especially DX-12 will help tremendously the AMD cards in 2016.

Nvidia Gameworks 2015

Dying light
Fallout 4
MGS V
Witcher 3
Project Cars
Just Cause 3
Assassins Creed Syndicate
Rainbow Siege Six
Killing Floor 2
Evolve
Batman Arkham Knight

AMD Gaming Evolve 2015

Battlefield Hardline
Star Wars
Dirt Rally

 

[ShintaiDK]

AMD announces Mantle and people complain that it is closed and proprietary, despite AMD's claims otherwise.

AMD announces GPUOpen as Open Source and people complain that it is Open Source.

AMD is always wrong!

AMD (fans) claimed Mantle was open, it was a blatant lie.

AMD fans now expect everything to be fixed with CPUOpen. That's just a hyperbole. The real reason behind is most likely the same as always. The cash ran out. IBM didn't make OpenPower for their blue eyes sake either, but because POWER is dying and they hope someone else will pay the bills.

People in the gaming industry (aka Devs) like to share solutions to problems, new rendering techniques and other information.

Your view of software seems a little bit outdated. Even Microsoft is open sourcing more and more stuff ... D:

That story never gets old. However reality is we get less. But PR is cheap

 

[railven]

4-5 DX-12 GE games for 2016 is fine, i dont believe NVIDIA released more than 5-6 GameWorks titles in 2015.

Where are you getting even 4? So far only two are confirmed. There are a possible other 2 but AMD (nor their partners) have said anything about it.

And that's the problem. At least when Gaming Evolved was announced, it had 6 popular games at the helm. And it later added another 5-6 games within a few months.

Off the top of my head games that partnered with NV in 2015:
Project Cars, MGS5 (Questionable if it has any Gameworks code, but partnered with NV for promotions), FFXIV (a once Gaming Evolved title), Batman: AK, The Witcher 3, Fallout 4, Ass.Creed, Just Cause 3, Rainbow Six, Killing Floor 2...

Now, I'm not saying at all that Gameworks implementation in any of these games is amazing, what I'm saying is these are titles that performed subpar on AMD because NV got it's dirty hands on it.

We could also see some already released games patched for DX-12 as well, also GCN could be extremely competitive in DX-12 GameWorks titles in 2016
like Fable etc.

If AMD is gonna solely rely on DX12 without their involvement, I hope they don't get shafted by any Nvidia shenanigans. This is basically another 'wait and see' approach instead of an aggressive circa 2012-2013 Gaming Evolved where AMD was announcing partnerships out the ying-yang.

So, the situation in 2016 will be completely different than what we had in 2015. New 16nm hardware, new GE games and especially DX-12 will help tremendously the AMD cards in 2016.

Of course it's going to be different, that's calling water wet. But we're back to "wait and see" mantra that doesn't seem to be paying off too well. AMD needs to block Gameworks yesterday.