AMD Carrizo APU Details Leaked

[Abwx]

Utter rubbish.

Also AMD isnt exactly known for its ability to deliver after a release. And we certainly dont lack examples there

Its always everyone elses fault than AMD, right?.

You re blatantly denying realities, Mullins is available for months and is already used in notebooks, you think that contra revenues have no impact.?.

And the example you list, an amazing 6- 8 hours battery time. It didnt ring any alarm bells for you?

Not at all, i d like to see a review though.

Perhaps AMD's biggest problem is that they have products that almost no one desires.

And certainly, AMD's biggest issue with getting products to market is with themselves. They fail pretty miserably at timely execution.

But no, it's always everyone's fault other than AMD's, isn't it? I wish people here did not go so much out of their way to hide themselves from the truth.

Who told you that no none wants them.?

As already said if Intel s competing products were that good they wouldnt subside them and then we could see if AMD products are good or not by witnessing the numbers, but no, Intel has an inferior product and they are forcing consumers to be choiceless, now here Techreport review, from the numbers we can see wich is the products that people wouldnt desire if ever they had the choice.

http://techreport.com/review/26377/a-first-look-at-amd-mullins-mobile-apu

Next time use numbers if you want to "prove" that BT is better rather than relying on the usual urban legends repeated ad nauseam.

 

[Abwx]

So here the product that you deem not desirable, yes, not desirable by the competition..

 

[III-V]

Where are the battery life numbers? And you do realize that Z3740 wasn't even Intel's best foot forward at the time, and has since been replaced? Also, price?

You're using a prototype to discredit my arguments -- absolutely laughable, really.

 

[Sweepr]

Thats very easy, Baytrail. Simply because of battery life. Plus its a product you can actually buy and have a wide selection of.

The fact that they provided tech sites a bulky 11'' that looks a lot more like a Core M competitor than anything based on Bay Trail and did not release power consumption numbers neither allowed measurements kinda tells you how competitive it would be in a thin 7-8'' tablet. Not to mention the complete lack of tablet designs wins, even the earlier A4 1200 crap had one or two pretty interesting designs (and there was no Bay Trail or contra-revenue back then). Also, the other Mullins models are a lot slower than the shinny A10 6700T, I'd like to see how the dual-core and capped 1.6GHz quad-core (with 300-350MHz graphics instead of 500MHz) would fare against newer mainstream quad-core Bay Trail T C0 parts. Fanboys fail to see that maybe their glorified Mullins is not as competitive as they think, with or without contra revenue there's always market for faster/better products even if they cost a bit more.

 

[AtenRa]

You think this forum is representative of the rest of the market? Oh dear...

If actual buyers are not representative of the market then who is ?? The Pope ???

Beema/Mullins has taken forever to make it to market, regardless of the market segment. That is, even in markets where Bay Trail is not being subsidized, AMD has still taken forever to hit the shelves.

Beema laptops have been in retail for a few months now, Beema/Mullins was only launched 6 months ago. It is Mullins(Tablets) that has hard time to be in a Tablet due to Intel's Contra Revenue.

 

[Abwx]

Where are the battery life numbers? And you do realize that Z3740 wasn't even Intel's best foot forward at the time, and has since been replaced? Also, price?

You're using a prototype to discredit my arguments -- absolutely laughable, really.

We ll know about battery life once we have a review, you realize of course that the perf delta is so high that they could use a significantly lower TDP part and still lead the tests, do you think that a faster Bt would be significantly better.?.

And what about the impact on the battery life.?

As for the prototype argument i saw no one protesting when BT was realeased and that benches were conducted on an Intel prototype, same thing recently with Core M launch, you are so biaised that you dont even notice the double standard you re promoting...

 

[AtenRa]

Thats very easy, Baytrail. Simply because of battery life. Plus its a product you can actually buy and have a wide selection of.

Good and nice answer, I on the other hand would take Mullins for its better iGPU performance every time no matter if it had lower Battery life.

 

[III-V]

If actual buyers are not representative of the market then who is ?? The Pope ???

You seriously think this forum represents the mass market? Where people have developed such crazy brand biases?

Again, oh dear...

Beema laptops have been in retail for a few months now, Beema/Mullins was only launched 6 months ago. It is Mullins(Tablets) that has hard time to be in a Tablet due to Intel's Contra Revenue.

AMD would have a hell of a time in the tablet market, regardless of contra revenue.

We ll know about battery life once we have a review, you realize of course that the perf delta is so high that they could use a significantly lower TDP part and still lead the tests, do you think that a faster Bt would be significantly better.?.

Are we looking at the same numbers? They're nearly neck and neck, as far as CPU goes. This would erode very quickly if they were to use a lower TDP part, especially since it would be even further away from Beema/Mullins ideal TDP.

There is no doubting their lead in graphics, though. However, I do question the sanity of someone buying a tablet for their graphics performance. Gaming is the last thing I have on my mind when using a tablet or smartphone.

And again, AMD's refusal to allow battery numbers to be published is extremely suspicious.

And what about the impact on the battery life.?

A new stepping? Very little, if at all.

As for the prototype argument i saw no one protesting when BT was realeased and that benches were conducted on an Intel prototype, same thing recently with Core M launch, you are so biaised that you dont even notice the double standard you re promoting...

That's not even remotely applicable.

 

[AtenRa]

Where are the battery life numbers? And you do realize that Z3740 wasn't even Intel's best foot forward at the time, and has since been replaced? Also, price?

You're using a prototype to discredit my arguments -- absolutely laughable, really.

Even latest Baytrail T cannot compete against Mullins in iGPU.

Also, battery life without being able to play the game is irrelevant

 

[Abwx]

The fact that they provided tech sites a bulky 11'' that looks a lot more like a Core M competitor than anything based on Bay Trail and did not release power consumption numbers neither allowed measurements kinda tells you how competitive it would be in a thin 7-8'' tablet.

The link i posted is about a 10.1 tablet.

10,1-Zoll-Display mit 1.920 × 1.200
http://www.computerbase.de/2014-10/erstes-windows-tablet-mit-mullins-apu-gesichtet/

From some people that have Mullins laptop we got a few numbers about power comsumption, unfortunately it s with 14" laptops but the numbers looks promising.

https://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=222607&postcount=212

Not to mention the complete lack of tablet designs wins, even the earlier A4 1200 crap had one or two pretty interesting designs (and there was no Bay Trail or contra-revenue back then).

Yes no contra revenue was needed but once Mullins perfs were known by OEMs (in september 2013..) Intel announced these practices.

Also, the other Mullins models are a lot slower than the shinny A10 6700T, I'd like to see how the dual-core and capped 1.6GHz quad-core (with 300-350MHz graphics instead of 500MHz) would fare against newer mainstream quad-core Bay Trail T C0 parts.

So a fair comparison is to use the best BTs and a low end Mullins.?
Are you really serious on this one.?.

 

[III-V]

Even latest Baytrail T cannot compete against Mullins in iGPU.

Also, battery life without being able to play the game is irrelevant

Who games on a tablet? Honestly? And 3D games at that? We've got years to go before that becomes even remotely viable.

And I wasn't suggesting otherwise, in regards to the iGPU.

 

[Sweepr]

The link i posted is about a 10.1 tablet.

Their reference Discovery Tablet is a thick/ugly 11.6'' tablet. 10.1'' is not a big difference, you can fit the fastest Bay Trail C0 part in 7'' tablets (and Moorefield runs 4 Silvermont cores @ 2.3GHz inside phones), good luck trying that with the top bin A10 6700T Mullins APU.

So a fair comparison is to use the best BTs and a low end Mullins.?
Are you really serious on this one.?.

You just compared the fastest Mullins to an outdated Bay Trail part that was not even the the fastest back in 2013, so I should ask, are you serious?

People would buy better performing Mullins tablets even if they would cost more than Bay Trail, just look at Core M and the latest 20nm ARM products. The complete lack of interest from OEMs screams that something is wrong, it's either performance in a small form factor, power consumption, or something else. Copying and pastying benchmarks against the successful wave of Bay Trail devices that you can buy +1 year for low prices won't change this.

 

[Phynaz]

I on the other hand would take Mullins for its better iGPU performance every time no matter if it had lower Battery life.

And you have every right to feel this way and it's good that you have the choice to buy what you want.

AMD's problem is in general the TAM doesn't want what you want, so therefore AMD is playing in niche markets.

 

[AtenRa]

You seriously think this forum represents the mass market? Where people have developed such crazy brand biases?

I dont believe this forum represents the mass market, but this forum users are buyers and you can see if they want AMDs products or not.

Also, you failed to say who were those that dont want AMDs Mullins and why

Again, oh dear...
AMD would have a hell of a time in the tablet market, regardless of contra revenue.

Isnt is strange that Temash had more design wins in 2013 than Mullins that is way better product in 2014 ?? I wonder why :whiste:

Are we looking at the same numbers? They're nearly neck and neck, as far as CPU goes. This would erode very quickly if they were to use a lower TDP part, especially since it would be even further away from Beema/Mullins ideal TDP.

There is no doubting their lead in graphics, though. However, I do question the sanity of someone buying a tablet for their graphics performance. Gaming is the last thing I have on my mind when using a tablet or smartphone.

http://fortune.com/2013/04/03/repor...a-day-glued-to-their-tablets-and-smartphones/

Report: Americans spend 2:38 hours a day glued to their tablets and smartphones

Among its findings:

• Americans who own smartphones or tablets spend, on average, 2 hours and 38 minutes “glued” (Flurry’s word) to their mobile devices.
• Only 20% (31 minutes) of that time is spent on a mobile browser — which as far as Flurry is concerned is now just another app.
• More than 50 of those minutes are spent playing games — the single largest category of apps.
• Nearly half an hour is spent on Facebook FB -1.30% . Twitter and the other social networking apps account for less than 10 minutes.
• About 19 minutes are spent on Apple’s Safari browser, six and a half minutes on Google’s GOOG -1.32% Android browser and a little more than three minutes on Opera Mini.
• E-mail is categorized under Productivity — three minutes total.

Well, it is the iGPU that most of the users need, not the CPU. Nobody runs Cinebench on their Tablets

 

[Phynaz]

Who games on a tablet? Honestly? And 3D games at that? We've got years to go before that becomes even remotely viable.

And I wasn't suggesting otherwise, in regards to the iGPU.

I game on a tablet. More than I do on my PC now.

 

[Erenhardt]

AtenRa, single-thread Cinebench runs that is.

Also, all this doom and gloom on nvidia tegra is inappropriate in amd desktop/laptop apu thread. (see what I did there?)

One have to give the credit, where the credit is due... and that is: for the same posters as always, that de-rail the thread to the point of no hope without getting single warning is quite impressive. It ends up getting locked in the result and its gone. Then the sponsors make their part of things...

 

[AtenRa]

And you have every right to feel this way and it's good that you have the choice to buy what you want.

AMD's problem is in general the TAM doesn't want what you want, so therefore AMD is playing in niche markets.

You mean that TAM wants BayTrail because of its superior performance in games ???

 

[III-V]

^ single-thread Cinebench runs that is.

Also, all this doom and gloom on nvidia tegra is inappropriate in amd desktop/laptop apu thread. (see what I did there?)

One have to give the credit, where the credit is due... and that is: for the same posters as always, that de-rail the thread to the point of no hope without getting single warning is quite impressive. It ends up getting locked in the result and its gone. Then the sponsors make their part of things...

You don't have to cry "thread derailing" every time things don't go your way.

I game on a tablet. More than I do on my PC now.

What kind of games? More specifically, would the games you play even be affected by the GPU performance difference between BT and Mullins?

I dont believe this forum represents the mass market, but this forum users are buyers and you can see if they want AMDs products or not.

Also, you failed to say who were those that dont want AMDs Mullins and why

I didn't fail to say anything. The relevant points have already been made in this thread.

Isnt is strange that Temash had more design wins in 2013 than Mullins that is way better product in 2014 ?? I wonder why :whiste:

Because AMD is incompetent and cannot get products out the door to (literally) save themselves.

http://fortune.com/2013/04/03/repor...a-day-glued-to-their-tablets-and-smartphones/

Well, it is the iGPU that most of the users need, not the CPU. Nobody runs Cinebench on their Tablets

Yes, and I'm quite sure BT's GPU is far more than enough for those users.

 

[AtenRa]

Who games on a tablet? Honestly? And 3D games at that? We've got years to go before that becomes even remotely viable.

And I wasn't suggesting otherwise, in regards to the iGPU.

http://fortune.com/2013/04/03/repor...a-day-glued-to-their-tablets-and-smartphones/

 

[Abwx]

Their reference Discovery Tablet is a thick/ugly 11.6'' tablet. 10.1'' is not a big difference, you can fit the fastest Bay Trail C0 part in 7'' tablets (and Moorefield runs 4 Silvermont cores @ 2.3GHz inside phones), good luck trying that with the top bin A10 6700T Mullins APU.

I dont think it would be a problem, all thoses APUs, and BT is an APU, are tied to their TDP up to the whole devices thermal inertias capabilty, once thermal storage is no more available they ll stick to their temperature settings, at this point what will do the difference is the power/perf ratio.

You just compared the fastest Mullins to an outdated Bay Trail part that was not even the the fastest back in 2013, so I should ask, are you serious?

These were the only reviews available, check Anand if you wants, he used the same items, so put the blame on thoses sites if you want but just dont pretend that i cherry picked the contenders.

People would buy better performing Mullins tablets even if they would cost more than Bay Trail, just look at Core M and the latest 20nm ARM products. The complete lack of interest from OEMs screams that something is wrong, it's either performance in a small form factor, power consumption, or something else. Copying and pastying benchmarks against the successful wave of Bay Trail devices that you can buy +1 year for low prices won't change this.

You know why OEMS werent prompt to release some Mullins based items, we dont need to elaborate further on this, if you have the choice, as OEM, between a 30$ Mullins and a free BT wrapped in a 50$ bill you dont need to be brillant to realise that you are offered an huge incentive that will boost your margins considerably and make the competing product irrelevant profitability wise, also Mullins is available since 6 months ago while the low prices you re talking about are due to thoses subsides and nothing else.

 

[NostaSeronx]

AMD are cash strapped and winding down the Bulldozer family

Hector Ruiz -> Dirk Meyer
K8 -> Greyhound/Greyhound+

Rory Read -> Lisa Su
Steamroller -> Excavator/Excavator+

AMD won't be winding down the Bulldozer family, nor the Cluster Multithreading architecture. AMD is cash strapped and can't afford a new radical microarchitecture.

 

[Abwx]

One have to give the credit, where the credit is due... and that is: for the same posters as always, that de-rail the thread to the point of no hope without getting single warning is quite impressive. It ends up getting locked in the result and its gone. Then the sponsors make their part of things...

Fortunately there s some relavancy in that Carrizo will replace the higher TDP parts of the Beema line, according to the knwon numbers it will be specced as low as 12W, it could well push Beema in lower TDP segments, likely in the 8-10W range since Jaguar will have better perf/Watt at this level than at 15W.

 

[Erenhardt]

You don't have to cry "thread derailing" every time things don't go your way.

That wasn't even pointed at you since you are forum newbie.

Thread going to the far end of human digest system is not my way. Its not by forum rules way, which I highly recommend reading.

I've seen too many times this same thing over and over. It always ends the same way and it always repeats itself because of how it ends.

Fortunately there s some relavancy in that Carrizo will replace the higher TDP parts of the Beema line, according to the knwon numbers it will be specced as low as 12W, it could well push Beema in lower TDP segments, likely in the 8-10W range since Jaguar will have better perf/Watt at this level than at 15W.

There is no way carizzo will make way into tablets.

 

[AtenRa]

There is no way carizzo will make way into tablets.

I believe he was talking about low power Laptops.

 

[III-V]

I believe he was talking about low power Laptops.

Yeah, he said Beema, not Mullins.