AMD GPU14 Tech Event Sept 25 - AMD Hawiian Islands

[BD2003]

@MeldarthX

Have you tried this youtube vid:

"AstoundSound® 3d audio demo"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKnhcsRTNME

Im surprised its this good, I want to see this get traction in games.

I recammend closeing your eyes while listning to this.

*edit:

I swear I could believe there was a guy standing behinde me ripping news-papirs.
And you hear the tearing start up above head, and go down past your head,
and him walking around you ect.

Its odd that it takes a graphics company to push good sound like this.... but I ll take it if I can have it.

The thing that should really bother you....is that was recorded in 2004.

 

[p0rkguy]

So are all the new AMD GPUs going to come with BF4 or just 290X?
GMG deal ends on the 30th and I believe the NDA for the AMD GPUs are lifted on the 3rd.

 

[tential]

Oh, i forgot: There will be no new games for Android in the future. :\

This is the internet Sontin. People don't look past today. Today is all there is and nothing else. I think people are forgetting how the Android market is moving at breakneck speeds.

Did anyone just see Apple's A7, which is running better than BayTrail? The A7 is in the iphone 5s, Baytrail is in a Tablet. If you don't think that mid life cycle of the Xbone/PS4, there won't be amazing mobile chips out there you have to be crazy.

 

[HurleyBird]

@MeldarthX

Have you tried this youtube vid:

"AstoundSound® 3d audio demo"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKnhcsRTNME

Im surprised its this good, I want to see this get traction in games.

I recammend closeing your eyes while listning to this.

*edit:

I swear I could believe there was a guy standing behinde me ripping news-papirs.
And you hear the tearing start up above head, and go down past your head,
and him walking around you ect.

Its odd that it takes a graphics company to push good sound like this.... but I ll take it if I can have it.

One listen to it and it's obvious that the recording, or at least a portion of it (when he puts the newspaper over your head it's a dead giveaway) is just recorded with binaural mics. This has been done many times before (look up virtual haircut and some ASMR stuff) and isn't that complicated. Getting that level of binaural sound reproduction in games is an entirely different matter altogether, and AstoundSound's Doom 3 BFG demo on Youtube isn't very impressive at all.

 

[Arkadrel]

..and AstoundSound's Doom 3 BFG demo on Youtube isn't very impressive at all.

I didnt even know there was one, so I went looking on youtube for it.
It impressed me, I remember playing the game wayback when and it didnt sound like that to me.
Any improvement in audio experiance is good.

Its not as drastic as the demo with the newspapirs though.

 

[Final8ty]

I own my own little pc shop in SA, I have a good client base, nothing like the big companies but since the mantle news dropped I've gotten 30 back orders for R9 290X BF4 editions.
To put that into perspective, when the Titan launched I had 6 back orders. That's a big difference.

A close friend of mine owns the largest online shop in SA and he has confirmed the exact same thing, huge amount of back orders, more than we've ever seen with anything from AMD.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1429286/...-strike-the-599-price-point/580#post_20883574

 

[BD2003]

One listen to it and it's obvious that the recording, or at least a portion of it (when he puts the newspaper over your head it's a dead giveaway) is just recorded with binaural mics. This has been done many times before (look up virtual haircut and some ASMR stuff) and isn't that complicated. Getting that level of binaural sound reproduction in games is an entirely different matter altogether, and AstoundSound's Doom 3 BFG demo on Youtube isn't very impressive at all.

Yeah, I'm still really suspicious of that demo. There's no mention of how it was recorded, it really does sound binaural. So it's either fake, or the best 3D sound algorithm ever invented, that's just been sitting idle and unused for a decade.

 

[24601]

I didnt even know there was one, so I went looking on youtube for it.
It impressed me, I remember playing the game wayback when and it didnt sound like that to me.
Any improvement in audio experiance is good.

Its not as drastic as the demo with the newspapirs though.

There is no indication of whether the sound originated in front or behind you.

Considering that is the whole point of 3D audio algorithms then the algorithm is a failure.

You can do left/right detection easily since its goddamn stereo for god sakes.

That is something games have done well for years, so this is worthless.

 

[ams23]

This is the internet Sontin. People don't look past today. Today is all there is and nothing else. I think people are forgetting how the Android market is moving at breakneck speeds.

Did anyone just see Apple's A7, which is running better than BayTrail? The A7 is in the iphone 5s, Baytrail is in a Tablet. If you don't think that mid life cycle of the Xbone/PS4, there won't be amazing mobile chips out there you have to be crazy.

Within ~3 years time, ultra mobile devices will have graphics quality and speed to rival upcoming next gen consoles, all within the palm of your hands and in a variety of different form factors. And of course the power efficiency will be far superior too. That is just the nature of the beast.

 

[raghu78]

Within ~3 years time, ultra mobile devices will have graphics quality and speed to rival upcoming next gen consoles, all within the palm of your hands and in a variety of different form factors. And of course the power efficiency will be far superior too. That is just the nature of the beast.

keep dreaming. PS4 boasts a GPU with 1840 GFLOPS. Apple A7 chip is 76.8 GLOPS. Tegra 4 is also around the same performance 74.8 GLOPS

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7335/the-iphone-5s-review/7
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6666/the-tegra-4-gpu-nvidia-claims-better-performance-than-ipad-4

Normally you can expect a doubling of performance at every new process node. 20nm is going to come around 2.5 years after 28nm. future nodes are getting difficult. so every 2 - 3 years you can double perf. there is no way the tablets or phones are going to match a PS4 GPU before the end of the decade by which time the consoles would be at the end of their life cycle. the current gen consoles ps3 and xbox 360 are 200 GFLOPS. show me a phone or tablet today which has that GPU performance ?

 

[blackened23]

Within ~3 years time, ultra mobile devices will have graphics quality and speed to rival upcoming next gen consoles, all within the palm of your hands and in a variety of different form factors. And of course the power efficiency will be far superior too. That is just the nature of the beast.

Since Tegra 4 with the absolute highest clocks which most products won't reach @ 90Gflops (mostly far less), which is far less than the 10 year old xbox 360, I think it's safe to say that this is a fantasy. Since nvidia is releasing 1 tegra product a year and higher density nodes are only available to the highest bidders, wake me up when Tegra can match a 10 year old xbox 360. I'd give nvidia 3-4 years to do even that with a Tegra chip.

But, according to you, a tablet chip designed for a 2W TDP device is going to break the 2Tflops barrier. With a 2W TDP. You've got jokes eh? Like I said, wake me up in 4 years when Tegra can manage to match the xbox 360. That is, of course, assuming that Tegra 5 doesn't fail and lose to Qualcomm as the T4 did - if that happens, nvidia may have to re-think their entire mobile strategy.

 

[Arkadrel]

Within ~3 years time, ultra mobile devices will have graphics quality and speed to rival upcoming next gen consoles, all within the palm of your hands and in a variety of different form factors. And of course the power efficiency will be far superior too. That is just the nature of the beast.

Like others have said before...

Tegra 4 = ~74 GFLOPs
PS4 = ~1840 GFLOPs

Thats like a 25 times difference in performance.

You think that within the next 3 years, you ll see Mobile phones 25 times faster than todays? Get real.

And thats without even factoring in stuff like Ram load/write speeds & memory bandwidth, HDD load speeds and a intire list of otherstuff that ll favor the consols vs mobile phones.

Also what is up with the MODS locking the most intresting thing on the forums? some of those mantle threads where fun and filled with cool little tibits.

I guess they just want us to keep it in here? <.< they could have atleast left one of them open.

 

[blackened23]

Like others have said before...

Tegra 4 = ~74 GFLOPs
PS4 = ~1840 GFLOPs

Thats like a 25 times difference in performance.

You think that within the next 3 years, you ll see Mobile phones 25 times faster than todays? Get real.

And thats without even factoring in stuff like Ram load/write speeds & memory bandwidth, HDD load speeds and a intire list of otherstuff that ll favor the consols vs mobile phones.

And the most obvious difference is that wafer prices increase exponentially with each new node. Last I checked, at TSMC 20nm - the cost for wafers is so high with a contractual commitment, that any company using 20nm must sell 500,000 chips to reach a break-even point. Wafer prices are set to be double for 20nm than they are for 28nm.

So that relegates new nodes to firms like Apple, Qualcomm, and I don't know who else initially, while everyone else waits. Besides which, TSMCs 20nm is not groundbreaking, it is still worse than intel's 22nm with FinFETs - it will have more density but similar leakage to TSMC's 28nm, which isn't very impressive. Maybe that will change when TSMC has FinFETs in 2016.

 

[ams23]

LOL, keep dreaming? By mid-to-end 2014 there will be ultra mobile SoC's approaching ~ 400 GFLOPS graphics throughput. That will approximately double again by mid-to-end 2015 (with unified virtual memory added to the feature set), and then will approximately double again by end of 2016 (with stacked DRAM added to the feature set). Don't be so quick to brush off the ultra mobile space, because it is moving at breakneck speed over the next few years, and form factors go well beyond just what can fit in a phone.

 

[blackened23]

LOL, keep dreaming? By mid-to-end 2014 there will be ultra mobile SoC's aproaching ~ 400 GFLOPS graphics throughput. That will approximately double again by mid-to-end 2015 (where unified virtual memory will be added to the feature set), and then will approximately double again by end of 2016 (with stacked DRAM and 3d FinFET transistors addedto the mix. Don't be so quick to brush off the ultra mobile space, because it is moving at breakneck speed over the next few years, and form factors go well beyond just what can fit in a phone.

Erm, we're dreaming? I think the only person dreaming here is you. But, since nearly 100% of your posts here are related to the Tegra 4 in some fashion, I don't find this assertion by you to be surprising, despite the nature of the claim. You're telling us that Tegra will increase performance by a factor of 25 while maintaining a 2W TDP in 2 years. Yeah right.

 

[Arkadrel]

By mid-to-end 2014 there will be ultra mobile SoC's aproaching ~ 400 GFLOPS graphics throughput.

That is just what Anandtech is speculateing, and its abit optimistic.


http://www.anandtech.com/show/7169/nvidia-demonstrates-logan-soc-mobile-kepler

Doing some quick Photoshop estimation it looks like NVIDIA is claiming mobile Kepler has somewhere around 5.2x the FP power of the PowerVR SGX 554MP4 in the iPad 4 (76.8 GFLOPS). That works out to be right around 400 GFLOPS. With a 192 core implementation of Kepler, you get 2 FLOPS per core or 384 FLOPS per cycle. To hit 400 GFLOPS you'd need to clock the mobile Kepler GPU at roughly 1GHz. That's certainly doable from an architectural standpoint (although we've never seen it done on any low power 28nm process), but it's probably a bit too high for something like a smartphone.

So where is the 400 GFLOP # from?

1) Its from one of nvidia's crazy PR performance slides
(nvidia could be overexagerating to get hype).

2) Its from Anandtech "guessing" by looking at said crazy PR slide.

3) Even Anand thinks its "abit to much" for something like a smart phone.


Its just PR hype, I doubt Tegra 5 will be anywhere near performing like a Playstation 3.
And its still like a year away from release. I guess we ll have to wait and see.

 

[ams23]

@ blackened23: Let's revisit this thread in 1, 2, 3 years, and I can assure you that you will be proven wrong As for T4, you were the one who mentioned it, not me. And unlike you, I actually own a T4 product and it is really good for what it is.

 

[blackened23]

I figured as much, you probably own a tegra 4 product. But, sure, we'll see what happens in a couple of years - i'm not holding my breath since you're stating that a 2W TDP device is apparently going to break the 2TFop barrier in 2 years.

 

[raghu78]

@ blackened23: Let's revisit this thread in 1, 2, 3 years, and I can assure you that you will be proven wrong As for T4, you were the one who mentioned it, not me. And unlike you, I actually own a T4 product and it is really good for what it is.

you have no idea about the laws of physics. keep believing whatever Nvidia says. Tegra 5 Logan would struggle to hit 500 Mhz (192 GLOPS) and stay within a sub 3W TDP for the GPU portion especially at 28nm.

 

[RussianSensation]

Oh, i forgot: There will be no new games for Android in the future. :\

Oh, i forgot: There will be no 1st party games for PS4/XB1 in the future that extract even more performance via lower-level API and make 1st wave of PS4/XB1 games look outdated. This never happens with consoles.... :\

Please let us know how awesome your gaming experience is in Angry Birds 13 on an Android Galaxy Note 9 that might match the performance of a GTX670 in 7 years. I don't think any of us care. The PS4/XB1 consoles will be here for 7-10 years. It would be foolish to even begin to compare mobile smartphone gaming to PS4 gaming on a say a 55-60 inch Panasonic plasma. I love how now that Mantle might be used in consoles, you derail the thread even further by trying to undermine the importance of next gen consoles by comparing their fixed hardware to the evolving Android smartphone eco-system.

 

[2is]

Considering even an older game like Uncharted 2 for PS3 looks better than any game on any mobile device, I'm not sure why we are even arguing this. Sontin sound like a typical over-enthusiastic ARM/Android fan putting some work in this thread

 

[RussianSensation]

I'm not sure why we are even arguing this.

Me neither.

1) If Mantle succeeds, PS4/XB1 and GCN GPU owners get an added performance boost. On the console side, gamers enjoy better graphics and/or performance. On the PC side, this forces NV to lower prices and/or release faster GPUs. More competition in the gaming industry. Win-win.

2) If Mantle fails and goes the way of GLIDE, we lose nothing. All the risk is on AMD/game developer.

 

[monstercameron]

Me neither.

1) If Mantle succeeds, PS4/XB1 and GCN GPU owners get an added performance boost. This forces NV to lower prices and/or release faster GPUs. More competition in the gaming industry. Win-win.

2) If Mantle fails and goes the way of GLIDE, we lose nothing. All the risk is on AMD/game developer.

pretty much this. We all just have to wait and see but atleast we can agree that this was a bold and well calculated move by AMD. High level strats and all...

 

[pipm1]

Will MantleAPI only work for these up-coming cards, or will existing GCN 1.0 cards also benefit?

 

[Arkadrel]

Will MantleAPI only work for these up-coming cards, or will existing GCN 1.0 cards also benefit?

Should work on the current 7xxx series ones too.
Anyone with a GCN GPU is set to benefit from it.