AMD Nano Blacklist Situation

[AtenRa]

My methodology for testing Nano would be in open table (or big case) against every other card for reference and then inside a slim SFF case against 970 mini.

 

[Goatsecks]

Nano isn't really a card that compares to others. Whether it is benched exactly the same doesn't really matter, as it has nothing to compare to except maybe the 970. It is, however, interesting to know how it operates in its natural environment.

Testing it against the 980 or Fury X is just so you have a reference point. Not to see how they compete.

I am sorry, but the nano is computing with the Fury-X. Most smaller cases take a full sized GPU. I would love to actually see a situation where the nano fits but the fury does not. I suspect this scenario accounts for a minority of cases. Next, there is the price point equal to that of the fury and the 980ti. Thirdly, allegedly, the nano is a 4K card.

AMD have scored an own goal by making the nano redundant with one of their own cards, the Fury-X.

 

[AtenRa]

I am sorry, but the nano is computing with the Fury-X. Most smaller cases take a full sized GPU. I would love to actually see a situation where the nano fits but the fury does not. I suspect this scenario accounts for a minority of cases. Next, there is the price point equal to that of the fury and the 980ti. Thirdly, allegedly, the nano is a 4K card.

AMD have scored an own goal by making the nano redundant with one of their own cards, the Fury-X.

There are many small (SFF) cases where you cannot install the Fury X due to the radiator.

Examples,

Lian-Li PC-Q03
Lian-Li PC-05

 

[Pariah]

There are many small (SFF) cases where you cannot install the Fury X due to the radiator.

Examples,

Lian-Li PC-Q03
Lian-Li PC-05

Can't fit a radiator in a Lian-Li PC-05?

Lian-Li disagrees with you. You can actually fit a 240 mm radiator in the case.

Also off the same spec page from Lian-Li which you obviously never looked at:

VGA length: 190mm (175mm when using a VGA card with a front-located power plug)
310mm(Remove HDD rack)

So, w/out the HD cage, you can fit a Titan X in the case, or if you want something cheaper than a Nano, a 980 Ti.

0 for 1

As for the Lian-Li PC-Q03. First off, it's a fanless case, which means you would have to be an idiot to use it for a gaming PC, especially with a video card like a Nano which does not use a blower style cooler. 2ndly, I'll post the following picture and see if you can figure out the bigger problem:

Good luck getting a Nano in that case.

0 for 2

I look forward to the rest of your case list which contains "many small (SFF) cases where you cannot install the Fury X due to the radiator."

 

[ShintaiDK]

Its a tiny tiny niche where the Nano/Mini cards fits in.

And the real issue is PSU, opticals and HD/SSD placements besides airflow to some degree.

Unless M.2 and external PSU brick is used, these cases will just be a bad excuse.

Take my 14.8 litre volume SG08B. Lower volume than most "Nano/Mini" cases. Yet full size GFX, great airflow, optical drive, storage cages, regular sized PSU. But making a smaller GFX card wont help anything.

If you removed the PSU and used external brick, removed optical and used M.2 storage only it could be half size.

 

[Glo.]

Its a tiny tiny niche where the Nano/Mini cards fits in.

And the real issue is PSU, opticals and HD/SSD placements besides airflow to some degree.

Unless M.2 and external PSU brick is used, these cases will just be a bad excuse.

Take my 14.8 litre volume SG08B. Lower volume than most "Nano/Mini" cases. Yet full size GFX, great airflow, optical drive, storage cages, regular sized PSU. But making a smaller GFX card wont help anything.

If you removed the PSU and used external brick, removed optical and used M.2 storage only it could be half size.

Its not. Its the future. Small, efficient, quiet computers are the way to go. Imagine a computer with 35W Quad Core Skylake CPU with 175W Fury Nano.
Both can be cooled from one water cooling solution. And that can be part of the case of the computer.

You see what Im getting at?

 

[Redentor]

Even Titan cards were a niche, but we have seen that these cards sold very well.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Its not. Its the future. Small, efficient, quiet computers are the way to go. Imagine a computer with 35W Quad Core Skylake CPU with 175W Fury Nano.
Both can be cooled from one water cooling solution. And that can be part of the case of the computer.

You see what Im getting at?

That would be nice. But after watching over 5 years of Mini cards and no real development in cases I am less optimistic.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Its not. Its the future. Small, efficient, quiet computers are the way to go. Imagine a computer with 35W Quad Core Skylake CPU with 175W Fury Nano.
Both can be cooled from one water cooling solution. And that can be part of the case of the computer.

You see what Im getting at?

Not for every usage it's not. Some people want SLI and more than a few drives. Those people might require more space in the case for their components.

 

[Qwertilot]

There is also simply the noise - doing 200+w of cooling in a tiny case isn't easy however you do it.

Go up from truly tiny, to merely 'small' and you can have quite a few more fans and run them more slowly.

I certainly hope the next few years see some good cases for short cards, and for that matter for high powered iGPU chips and no dgpu.

 

[Glo.]

Form factor of Nano is the form factor of future HBM cards, because of the small package of the GPU. It can vary between the sizes, but it is the way to go how HBM GPUs will look like. The trend for every High End desktop is to have water cooling solution that can handle all of the components inside the computer. I don't know what will Intel do, will they finally not allow GPUs being connected to the computer by PCIe port, and only by Thunderbolt? That is the question. The market is moving forward guys, and nothing that is right now available shows where the future lies. Apart from - the size of Fury Nano. Thats how most of the dGPUs in future will look like.

P.S. You can have really cool and quiet computer even with air cooling, at 450W of power, and dual GPUs and 130W CPU. New Mac Pro is the case.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Lol lets all get out the crystal ball and find out what the future is. That's all you're doing here.

 

[AtenRa]

Can't fit a radiator in a Lian-Li PC-05?

Lian-Li disagrees with you. You can actually fit a 240 mm radiator in the case.

This is the Lian-Li PC-05S,
I said PC-05 which is a smaller case and it cannot take a 120mm rad.

Also off the same spec page from Lian-Li which you obviously never looked at:

VGA length: 190mm (175mm when using a VGA card with a front-located power plug)
310mm(Remove HDD rack)

So, w/out the HD cage, you can fit a Titan X in the case, or if you want something cheaper than a Nano, a 980 Ti.

0 for 1

I dont know why you mentioned that, i was only talking about the cases where you cannot install the Fury X due to the radiator and not about the length of the card.

As for the Lian-Li PC-Q03. First off, it's a fanless case, which means you would have to be an idiot to use it for a gaming PC, especially with a video card like a Nano which does not use a blower style cooler. 2ndly, I'll post the following picture and see if you can figure out the bigger problem:

Good luck getting a Nano in that case.

0 for 2

yes my bad, i mistaken this with the PC-Q01

I look forward to the rest of your case list which contains "many small (SFF) cases where you cannot install the Fury X due to the radiator."

a few more

Cubitek Mini Center

Lian Li PC-Q25B

SST-SG01S-F USB 3.0 Sugo F-Version

In-Win BK-644
(this is the smallest micro-ATX case i know, cannot install a 120mm rad)

One more thing, i highly doubt you can install the Fury X in the following Silverstone cases, duo to the way water tubes are getting out of the GPU.

SST-FTZ01B Fortress
SST-RVZ01B Raven Z
SST-ML07B Milo

SST-SG06B Sugo

 

[96Firebird]

They have to be in the same category, don't they? Like trying to compare Pitcairn's efficiency against Big Kepler, or something.

Same category? I'd say mini cards that can fit in tiny cases are the same category, no? It is such a niche product, you'd think the comparison would be to other such niche products...

 

[SimianR]

If I had the cash I would put together a build with one of these

https://www.facebook.com/pages/HG-Computers/224496684372711?fref=photo&sk=photos

 

[Attic]

Why not build a beast mode computer, put it somewhere tolerable, and then get the steam streamer thingy for $49?

Once I finish wiring my home with CAT6 that's what i'm going to do. The steam streamer only has a 100mb NIC card though. Should be good for 1080P streaming.

Adding that HG case along with a Silverstone RVZ02 to my short list of options.

I keep trying to sell myself on the Nano, but the size frankly doesn't add a ton of value becuase most cases that can accommodate any full width GPU can accomodate reasonable length cards. The price at $649 just not getting it into a worthwhile space given the size isn't that big of a deal and it's performance/noise(capacitor squeal) is not top of line.

 

[SPBHM]

it's a device playing h264 video, the image quality is lower, and there is added latency for the video encode/transfer/decode, it's not the same thing.

 

[Pariah]

Cubitek Mini Center

Passively cooled case. Unusable with a video card like the Nano that dumps the heat into the case and a CPU powerful enough to make use for it. Yet you insist on testing the Nano on an open bench. Totally logical thinking...


Lian Li PC-Q25B

Maximum Compatibility
VGA Card Length: 320mm

There is no logical reason to buy a nano in any SFF situation where you can fit a 980Ti with a blower style cooler in it.

SST-SG01S-F USB 3.0 Sugo F-Version

Follow the link. There is a picture of a 14.5" Radeon HD 2900XTX installed into this case.

In-Win BK-644

This appears to be a discontinued product. I can't find anything on VGA compatibility except that pictures make it look like the 4 expansion slots are clear for cards to stretch the full depth of the case. It's a 6 year old case which includes a 300W PSU. Not surprising it would be EOL now.


The next 3 Silverstone cases you listed are based on the same basic design and all support 13" video cards.


SST-SG06B Sugo

Looks like the In-Win part 2. Old case with a 300W PSU that's been discontinued. It does support video cards up to 10".




So back to the Lian Li PC-O5. Googling this case just brings up links to the Lian Li PC-O5S which I incorrectly guessed was a silver version of whatever this case was. With some further digging, the only place I could find that was selling this case was a single vendor on Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-list...0?ie=UTF8&condition=all&qid=1442083586&sr=8-2

Only $390 shipped. If you thought $650 for the Nano was out of line, good luck telling people they need to drop $400 on case designed for it. Congratulations, you've found your exclusive case for your exclusive video card.

 

[Piroko]

Not in the market for SFF PCs, but why should it be a desirable quality to remove the only drive cage out of one of these cases? Personally I'd rather pick a weaker GPU if that meant I could have several TB of cheap HDD space.

However, I would have no issues with an mATX case in my living room (Define Mini), so there's that.

 

[AtenRa]

Cubitek Mini Center

Passively cooled case. Unusable with a video card like the Nano that dumps the heat into the case and a CPU powerful enough to make use for it. Yet you insist on testing the Nano on an open bench. Totally logical thinking...

You can use a 35-45-55 or even 65W TDP CPUs, not need to go higher with this case. Also as i have explained earlier, the case is fine for the NANO. It has drilled holes in the back of the case and the Fan from the PSU to dump hot air out. The Nano also dumps a lot of air outside of the case by itself.

Lian Li PC-Q25B

Maximum Compatibility
VGA Card Length: 320mm

There is no logical reason to buy a nano in any SFF situation where you can fit a 980Ti with a blower style cooler in it

SST-SG01S-F USB 3.0 Sugo F-Version

Follow the link. There is a picture of a 14.5" Radeon HD 2900XTX installed into this case.

The next 3 Silverstone cases you listed are based on the same basic design and all support 13" video cards.

You keep talking about the length of the card, let me remind you what was the comment i replied to.

I would love to actually see a situation where the nano fits but the fury does not.

As i have explained its not about the size of the card but about the Radiator of the Fury X.

In-Win BK-644


This appears to be a discontinued product. I can't find anything on VGA compatibility except that pictures make it look like the 4 expansion slots are clear for cards to stretch the full depth of the case. It's a 6 year old case which includes a 300W PSU. Not surprising it would be EOL now.

This is an OEM case, you will not find it easily in retail. That also doesnt make it EOL, still available to purchase. You can use the Nano with a 35-55W TDP CPU plus SSD easily on that 80 plus Bronze 300W PSU.

SST-SG06B Sugo

Looks like the In-Win part 2. Old case with a 300W PSU that's been discontinued. It does support video cards up to 10".

Silverstone SST-SG06BB-Lite Sugo USB 3.0 has no PSU (you can use any SFX PSU) and it is available. I dont believe you can fit the Fury X on it but you can definitely install the NANO.

So back to the Lian Li PC-O5. Googling this case just brings up links to the Lian Li PC-O5S which I incorrectly guessed was a silver version of whatever this case was. With some further digging, the only place I could find that was selling this case was a single vendor on Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-list...0?ie=UTF8&condition=all&qid=1442083586&sr=8-2

Only $390 shipped. If you thought $650 for the Nano was out of line, good luck telling people they need to drop $400 on case designed for it. Congratulations, you've found your exclusive case for your exclusive video card.

Lian Li PC-O5 is widely available in Europe.

http://geizhals.eu/lian-li-pc-o5-black-with-side-panel-window-a1210805.html

And i dont remember anyone talking only about low budget cases. Seems to me you are trying hard to find excuses, first with the length of the cards, next with the high price of the PC-O5 case etc.

The fact is that there are a lot of SFF cases that you cannot install Fury X due to the limitation of the 120mm Radiator but you can definitely install the Nano.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Seems they should have focused more on quality testing than who get the samples:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1573423/...high-pitch-noise-poor-quality-components-used

Add Guru3D to the list.

 

[3DVagabond]

Same category? I'd say mini cards that can fit in tiny cases are the same category, no? It is such a niche product, you'd think the comparison would be to other such niche products...

Performance categories. You can never compare across performance categories. I didn't think you needed it explained.

 

[Phynaz]

Seems they should have focused more on quality testing than who get the samples:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1573423/...high-pitch-noise-poor-quality-components-used

Add Guru3D to the list.

Jeez, what the hell is going on at AMD?

 

[IEC]

Coil whine for a $649 graphics card is unacceptable. I am going to rip into BOTH red and green teams here, especially because they are supposed to be "flagship" level cards.

Green example:
Gigabyte and their 980Ti G1 Gaming cards. Friend ended up RMAing his Gigabyte twice for coil whine before giving up and buying a MSI Gaming 980 Ti instead. Read Newegg reviews. He's not alone. It's also not isolated to Gigabyte. Other 980 Tis from different AIBs have the same issue. For a $649+ card!

Red example:
Fury Nano coil whine
Are you kidding me? $649 card, and you skimp on the components and/or QC?

Honorable mention:
Cooler Master and the miserable job they did with the initial batch of Fury X pumps.

Common thread:
Chinese manufacturing and QC. You get what you pay for.

 

[tential]

Coil whine for a $649 graphics card is unacceptable. I am going to rip into BOTH red and green teams here, especially because they are supposed to be "flagship" level cards.

Green example:
Gigabyte and their 980Ti G1 Gaming cards. Friend ended up RMAing his Gigabyte twice for coil whine before giving up and buying a MSI Gaming 980 Ti instead. Read Newegg reviews. He's not alone. It's also not isolated to Gigabyte. Other 980 Tis from different AIBs have the same issue. For a $649+ card!

Red example:
Fury Nano coil whine
Are you kidding me? $649 card, and you skimp on the components and/or QC?

Honorable mention:
Cooler Master and the miserable job they did with the initial batch of Fury X pumps.

Common thread:
Chinese manufacturing and QC. You get what you pay for.

Makes me very very angry and it's one of my MAIN reasons I complain right now about high end gaming. I don't care about the performance/price ratio as much as I'm angry about how poor the cooling solutions are and QC, etc.

It may be flagship performance, but I expect flagship treatment in every aspect =/