Maybe then AMD would not have the reputation of having bad drivers and wouldn't have to try so hard for a miracle.
Ridiculous argument. I guess NV's drivers were bad before 285.79s for Fermi users? When Fermi launched, many of us expected that GTX470/480/570/580 performance would improve, and it did. I bought a 470 expecting NV to improve drivers within 6 months, knowing upfront that Fermi's launch drivers weren't fully optimized. GTX470 was slower than HD5870 too but I had a feeling 6 months down the line with newer drivers and 470's overclocking, the value 470 offered was pretty good.
You are saying NV was desperate too when
they squeezed 10% more performance from Fermi while moving from 266.58 to 285.79? According to you, improving performance for new architectures through driver releases now means you had garbage drivers all along?
Major new architecture = driver improvements are expected (See Fermi and GCN). Old / slightly revised architecture = expect little to no graphical improvements and mature drivers out of the gate (See HD6000 series and Kepler).
I want AMD to pull through, but this is a desperate move and this level of enthusiasm should have been present long ago.
AMD's cards were already faster at each price level, especially
HD7970 and 7970 GE were already faster than GTX670/680 before Cats 12.11s. You are saying their drivers were still crap despite being in the lead since June? And all those games where GTX680 was losing in since June don't count either as NV's driver team not doing its job?
I find it amusing people aren't seeing what AMD did - close the gaps in performance where they trailed and extend the performance lead where NV was losing. NV didn't close gaps in games where it was trailing HD7970 since March! I guess now AMD gets penalized for improving performance in games across the board but NV gets a pass for doing squat in games where it continues to lose by 15-20%?
Notice how HD7970 GE was
8% faster at HWC at 1600P and now that's 15%? AMD is not desperate and if anything is pulling away even further from NV's flagship single-GPU card. 15% is now getting close to GTX580 vs. HD6970.
I also find it interesting that when a company offers more value to gamers in terms of price/performance and game bundles, they are desperate but NV selling $450-550 GTX680 is somehow great for us gamers? I guess I didn't get the memo that NV users
love giving NV more of their hard earned money and don't want NV to offer free games since it hurts NV's margins. Based on some of the responses on this forum, you'd think everyone here is an NV stock holder and drives BMWs since well if NV lowers prices and offers more than 1 free game trying to bring more value to gamers, they are
desperate and god forbid it lowers their earnings!
Next stop: NV stops improving drivers because improving performance means your drivers suck, stops bundling games because game bundles are viewed as desperate and raises prices on next generation GTX700 cards from $499 to $699 for the flagship card because its customers want to pay more $ to feel as if NV's brand is truly premium. Bundles, lower prices, deriver improvements all make NV look desperate if they do any sort of things. Why would gamers ever want these things?
It's pretty funny how to NV owners it never once has occurred that NV has been tacking on a $50-100 extra premium for the brand name knowing you'll pay. JHH must be laughing right now knowing he is building up a nice cushion of cash from each GTX670/680 for his new Ferrari upgrade, sold since he successfully nurtured a culture of consumers who "apparently" don't like price/performance or game bundles! I am pretty sure it's not the case and that people who buy NV cards also want value and game bundles, outside of the hardcore NV loyalists who won't buy an HD7970 even if it was $150.
AMD has an Apple problem on its hands. When the competitor's loyal following is like sheep, throwing $ at poor cards like GTX550Ti, GeForce 5 (esp. FX5200), or 8600GT, it's hard to figure out any strategy of how to convert customers like that. Even when AMD gave cards away for nearly 40-50% off during HD5800 generation, and launched HD5850/5870 6 months before GTX470/480, most NV users didn't switch. Now AMD is offering more performance, higher price/performance and higher value through game bundles and NV users still can't admit their team is offering worse value and their cards are currently nearly impossible to recommend. And then people are wondering why NV offered so little performance increase this generation? Why in the world would NV launch a 60-100% faster GTX780 when NV knows its customers would throw $500 again for 25-30% more performance and love it.
@Russian, it is very significant the point you raised: Not in recent history had ATI/AMD offered not just superior value but outright superior performance.
Thats why some of the NV trolls are getting their panties in a knot. Do people seriously enjoy paying $500 for a gtx680? Talk about being ripped off and bending over to take it with a smile... in ways only trolls can..
I don't get it myself. I thought it would great if NV also improved drivers, lowered prices or added its own game bundles to offer consumers more value.
This is eerily like X1950XTX or X850XT PE generations, except at lower prices than the competition! In those generations, ATI held the performance edge in most shader intensive/GPU intensive games, while NV had superior performance in OpenGL and flight sims. Even then NV cards had some pretty big wins in some games. GTX680's last huge battleground was BF3 and now with that gone, where exactly does GTX680 hold a considerable performance advantage? Portal 2 with SSAA, Lost Planet 2, HAWX 2? Without PhysX, this list can be counted on 1 hand.
With AMD Gaming Evolved, AMD is using the exact same strategy NV has used for years - leveraging the game code to make their cards perform faster. I guess all these games: Hitman Absolution, Sleeping Dogs, Dirt Showdown, Sniper Elite V2, Anno 2070, Alan Wake, MOH:W, Hitman Absolution, Far Cry 3, Metro 2033 are all unfair to include in a game test since they are likely to favor AMD cards? Whose fault is that? NV started TWIMTPB program and now the competitor said: "You know what, we'll throw $ at developers too." NV has nothing to worry about since JHH knows its customer base will stick around, all he needs to do is find another game to market PhysX to the world and how awesome it is (Planet Side 2? Hawken?).