AMD Phenom X3 710 --> X4

[eternalone]

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

LOL

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

Doesn't seem to be true if an XtremeSystems guy got another week CPU to do it.
I didn't care, nor did I even know that PII X3 had any sort of potential for unlocking the 4th disabled core. I was buying the CPU regardless. Like I said, I won't get disappointed nor are my hopes up that I will be able to do this on mine. No gain and no loss, I got what I paid for. If it does work and is stable, then BONUS and I wont complain.

And I don't see a huge mistake saving at least 400 bucks for the system I got over the very cheapest i7 rig. Does not compute. i7 and C2Q have advantages over PII to be sure, but if your a gamer, you won't notice a thing. PII is pretty much on par with Intel across the board for gaming. And you cannot beat the price advantage AMD is offering right now for the performance. That would include seemingly nice overclocking ability which only can add more value to your spent dollar. So don't blindly go for an i7 without looking at the whole big picture. This includes price/performance. i7 cannot hold a candle in this area. Just too damn expensive for the platform with motherboards under 230 dollars are like bigfoot sightings.
DDR3 is coming down but still far more expensive than DDR2. And the i7 itself. The cheapest one without finding a super special deal is 280 bucks. No brainer. Now if you have specific applications that require the multithreaded power of an i7, then by all means, if you NEED it, then spend the cash for it.

 

[eternalone]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

Doesn't seem to be true if an XtremeSystems guy got another week CPU to do it.
I didn't care, nor did I even know that PII X3 had any sort of potential for unlocking the 4th disabled core. I was buying the CPU regardless. Like I said, I won't get dissappointed nor are my hopes up that I will be able to do this on mine. No gain and no loss, I got what I paid for. If it does work and is stable, then BONUS and I wont complain.

And I don't see a huge mistake saving at least 400 bucks for the system I got over the very cheapes i7 rig. Does not computer. i7 and C2Q have advantages over PII to be sure, but if your a gamer, you won't notice a thing. PII is pretty much on par with Intel across the board for gaming. And you cannot beat the price advantage AMD is offering right now for the performance. That would include seemingly nice overclocking ability which only can add more value to your spent dollar. So don't blindly go for an i7 without looking at the whole big picture. This includes price/performance. i7 cannot hold a candle in this area. Just too damn expensive for the platform with motherboards under 230 dollars are light bigfoot sightings.
DDR3 is coming down but still far more expensive than DDR2. And the i7 itself. The cheapest one without finding a super special deal is 280 bucks. No brainer. Now if you have specific applications that require the multithreaded power of an i7, then by all means, if you NEED it, then spend the cash for it.

Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710.

 

[tshen83]

"Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710."

The X3 costs less than Core2 or i7 but if you figure out the power cost, it actually is more expensive. 95W for 3 active cores. Even if you enable the fourth core, that is usually the weakest core. You are talking 130W TDP to get 4 cores. Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP, and about the same vs Core 2 Quad, but Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt.

Damn, don't people get it? You are freaking burning 95W for 3 cores!!! 65W for Core2Quads or i7 for much better performance for the same TDP.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: tshen83
"Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710."

The X3 costs less than Core2 or i7 but if you figure out the power cost, it actually is more expensive. 95W for 3 active cores. Even if you enable the fourth core, that is usually the weakest core. You are talking 130W TDP to get 4 cores. Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP, and about the same vs Core 2 Quad, but Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt.

Damn, don't people get it? You are freaking burning 95W for 3 cores!!! 65W for Core2Quads or i7 for much better performance for the same TDP.

TDP != power consumption

http://www.lostcircuits.com/ma...2&limit=1&limitstart=4

I'm not saying the spirit of your argument of TCO (total cost of ownership) is wrong...but right now it is fundamentally flawed as you appear to be basing your power consumption estimates off of the rated TDP values which are definitely not the same thing.

I'd be very much interested in knowing what the TCO difference is between the systems you are pontificating over. But please use some documented power consumption numbers, state clearly your idle/load usage pattern assumptions, and use some real-world electricity prices when generating the numbers.

I think you'll find the vast majority of active posters here to be receptive to information on TCO when it is based on verifiable numbers and openly stated assumptions. Those assumptions may be critiqued and modified in follow-up posts by your forum colleagues but until you cast your opinion on TCO in a standardized format you will likely find yourself (and your message) being ignored (or chastised) by the very people you are hoping to communicate with.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: tshen83
"Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710."

The X3 costs less than Core2 or i7 but if you figure out the power cost, it actually is more expensive. 95W for 3 active cores. Even if you enable the fourth core, that is usually the weakest core. You are talking 130W TDP to get 4 cores. Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP, and about the same vs Core 2 Quad, but Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt.

Damn, don't people get it? You are freaking burning 95W for 3 cores!!! 65W for Core2Quads or i7 for much better performance for the same TDP.

Wow, this thread was so nice, until you came trolling... the point of this thread was to examine the PhII X3 core-unlocking, not engage in yet another round of Intel vs AMD.

Your argument is seriously flawed.

AMD & Intel calculate TDP differently. According to AT's tests, the power-usage profiles between PhII & C2D/Q & i7 are all similar enough. It would take many years for most of us to realize a few hundred $$ cost savings through electricity usage, comparing the productivity advantage Core i7 could have over PhII. In fact, given "typical usage" - that is, some gaming, office-type tasks, Photoshop, etc., there is no power-saving advantage that Intel has over AMD.

Unless, of course, you buy one of the new "S" C2Q's, which use 65W. Then you might save a little $$. Of course, the C2Q "S" variant cost more, negating the savings.

All of Intel's other C2Q's use 95W or 125W, and I'll reiterate, AMD and Intel calucalte TDP differently, so you need to actually measure, as AT has done, rather than rely on theoretical numbers provided by other manufacturers.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: tshen83
"Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710."

The X3 costs A LOT less than Core2 or i7 but if you figure out the power cost, it actually is more expensive. 95W for 3 active cores. Even if you enable the fourth core, that is usually the weakest core. You are talking 130W TDP to get 4 cores. Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP, and about the same vs Core 2 Quad, but Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt.

Damn, don't people get it? You are freaking burning 95W for 3 cores!!! 65W for Core2Quads or i7 for much better performance for the same TDP.

Fixed ^ bold.

You're serious aren't you.....

Hello: http://www.anandtech.com/cpuch...owdoc.aspx?i=3512&p=10

How long would you suppose it would take the PIIX3 720 to eat up about $400.00 worth of electricity? Because that is the price premium we are talking about here for the very cheapest i7 platform. And you know as well as I do, that people who are buying multicore CPU rigs really arent very concerned about how much their electric bill is going to be. Most I would guess.
So, if a C2Q which you say consumes no more than 65WTDP shows higher power consumption than the PII X3 720 at idle and at load according to Anandtechs power consumption segment of their review, do you think it's possible for the PII X3 720 is using more than 65WTDP? How does that add up?
And 95W is the maximum rated consumption. I'd wager since it bests C2Q in power consumption at load, I would think it actually uses less than 95W if the C2Q uses only 65 at theoretical maximum.

As far as the 4th core being the weakest core, your comment is completely unfounded. Perfectly good cores as well as faulty cores can be, and have been, disabled to appeal to a particular market segment. Luck of the draw as to which chip you get. And I'm not even considering the 4th core being unlocked. Just the as is x3. 4th core would just be a bonus if it worked.

"Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP"
Not for gaming it isn't.

"Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt."
Re-do your math.

Intel offers great product, but top of the line CPU's, both C2Q and i7 are still quite pricey as you go up in MHz.
AMD has always offered pretty good bang for the buck, and I'd be hard pressed to find a better deal than what I just bought from newegg.

That list of parts you see cost me 425.13 shipped.

AMD Phenom II X3 720 2.8GHz Socket AM3 95W Triple-Core Black Processor 144.99
GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H AM2+/AM2 AMD 790GX HDMI ATX AMD otherboard 138.99 (less 45.00 for combo CPU/MOBO)
G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) 44.99
Thermaltake V9 Black Edition ATX Computer Gaming Chassis 104.99
shipping 36.17
Total $425.13

I'm a happy guy.

Damn it, don't you get it???

Anyway, as Idontcare and FG have stated, enough about Intel in this thread tshen83. It's a PhenomII x3 -->x4 thread. That's it.
Cool?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: eternalone


Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710.

I went for the 720 for the unlocked multi. HTT can remain at 200 while I bump the multiplier and VID up slowly. Then I'll see how far the 1066 DDR2 can go.

Not that experienced with AMD o/cing, but there is plenty of help in this forum for that.
Gratzi AT'ers!!

 

[nyker96]

nice! i have heard about this x3->x4 conversion. question is can it work without error? is the added core reliable? report back when you tested more. occt baby.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: nyker96
nice! i have heard about this x3->x4 conversion. question is can it work without error? is the added core reliable? report back when you tested more. occt baby.

How much OCCT would you like?

 

[geokilla]

Originally posted by: tshen83
"Exactly Im a noob at overclocking and just bought a AM3 x3 710 2.6hz yesterday with a Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-US2H and Im able to hit 3Ghz stock voltages everything, 1 hour OCCT stable. Obviously Im gonna test alot more, raise some voltages and see If I can hit 3.2, but the point is these new x3 chips are very fun and cost effective especially this 710."

The X3 costs less than Core2 or i7 but if you figure out the power cost, it actually is more expensive. 95W for 3 active cores. Even if you enable the fourth core, that is usually the weakest core. You are talking 130W TDP to get 4 cores. Performance wise, it is about 60% of i7 920 at the same TDP, and about the same vs Core 2 Quad, but Core 2 Quads can be had for 65W TDP, making it twice as good performance per watt.

Damn, don't people get it? You are freaking burning 95W for 3 cores!!! 65W for Core2Quads or i7 for much better performance for the same TDP.

LOL! And you've been here for how long? For Core i7, just the CPU, motherboard, and DDR3 RAM would cost AT LEAST $600 CAD. And that's if NCIX has some good deals and stuff.

Can anyone help Apop out? Thread Link

I've tried all afternoon to 'unlock' my fourth core and have come close I think, but haven't figured it out on the boards that I have. On the Gigabyte MA790GP-DS4H motherboard with BIOS F3 I was unable to find Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) in the BIOS in order to set it to Auto. I then downloaded AMD OverDrive v2.1.6 set it to advanced and turned on ACC.... Nothing happened.

I switched over to the MSI DKA790GX Platinum motherboard with BIOS v1.6 and found that Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) is in the BIOS under the Cell Menu, but entering windows and firing up CPU-Z, Prime95 and task manager still showed just three threads installed. I once again installed AMD OverDrive v2.1.6 and set Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) to auto, per core and all cores and saw something I think is interesting... When I set it to 'per core' it shows four cores are available. I saved the settings and restarted the system. I went into the BIOS again to see if the four cores showed up there and sure enough they do.

 

[richierich1212]

We should watch a battle between Fusion and tshen, lmao

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: geokilla
Can anyone help Apop out? Thread Link

If it's the Gigabyte board, I think you have to press Ctrl+F1 in the BIOS to see the advanced settings such as ACC.

 

[JC]

Bah...got a 0906 from the 'egg. Gonna try it anyways!

Even if I only get the 3 cores, it's still way ahead of my x2-3800@2.5GHz.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: geokilla
Can anyone help Apop out? Thread Link

I've tried all afternoon to 'unlock' my fourth core and have come close I think, but haven't figured it out on the boards that I have. On the Gigabyte MA790GP-DS4H motherboard with BIOS F3 I was unable to find Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) in the BIOS in order to set it to Auto. I then downloaded AMD OverDrive v2.1.6 set it to advanced and turned on ACC.... Nothing happened.

I switched over to the MSI DKA790GX Platinum motherboard with BIOS v1.6 and found that Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) is in the BIOS under the Cell Menu, but entering windows and firing up CPU-Z, Prime95 and task manager still showed just three threads installed. I once again installed AMD OverDrive v2.1.6 and set Advance Clock Calibration (ACC) to auto, per core and all cores and saw something I think is interesting... When I set it to 'per core' it shows four cores are available. I saved the settings and restarted the system. I went into the BIOS again to see if the four cores showed up there and sure enough they do.

Looks like he has a bum core. Someone at another forum - I forget which one, maybe XS - had an 0851, could "see" the core, but it wouldn't function, even at 1 Ghz.

 

[SunnyD]

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

Why is that exactly? Because the i7 offers a negligible performance advantage to 90% of users out there for approximately 2x the platform price? :roll:

 

[Negronpope]

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

Honestly, I don't care how great you think the i7 is. I've been using AMD processors since the Athlon was introduced and I've always been satisfied. Frankly, right now its still just more economical to buy AMD and I LIKE supporting the only company left that can compete with Intel. You Intel guys don't get it. Without AMD's competition all you'll have are over-priced Intel offerings that Intel will not have to update as frequently.
Besides, how did this thread become yet another Intel vs. AMD discussion?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Negronpope

Originally posted by: tshen83
Seriously, guys, it only works for one week worth of CPUs. AMD intentionally did this to lore the gamblers into buying X3s. There is no reason to risk one core to save the 30 dollar difference AMD is asking for the X4s. You are making a huge mistake to pick the Phenom II architecture over the i7 920. To each his own I guess.

Honestly, I don't care how great you think the i7 is. I've been using AMD processors since the Athlon was introduced and I've always been satisfied. Frankly, right now its still just more economical to buy AMD and I LIKE supporting the only company left that can compete with Intel. You Intel guys don't get it. Without AMD's competition all you'll have are over-priced Intel offerings that Intel will not have to update as frequently.
Besides, how did this thread become yet another Intel vs. AMD discussion?

First of all, you know how.

And second,

It was kind of drifting back on topic until you gently hip checked it back into play. Irony.

 

[sjwaste]

Wow, I don't really stay in the hardware loop anymore, but this is a pretty cool thread. My HTPC is an Opty 165 (939) @ 2.4 GHz and main desktop is an E2200 @ 3.2. Now I'm thinking about getting one of these X3's for the HTPC and fooling with it.

AMD definitely has the value segment nailed. Since I'm not running benchmarks as a hobby, that's what I want. Since I don't run a server farm, I also don't care that much about performance/watt.

Besides, if half the people who cried superiority b/c of performance per watt actually cared about that, they wouldn't be running a GPU that sucks down twice the power of their CPU, right?

 

[alkalinetaupehat]

Wasn't there someone who had a dual Kuma unlock into a quad for a while some time back?

 

[richierich1212]

Originally posted by: alkalinetaupehat
Wasn't there someone who had a dual Kuma unlock into a quad for a while some time back?

Yup, dingleberrydorkbut. But he got too greedy, lol.

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...ht_key=y&keyword1=quad

 

[eternalone]

Whats the max volts you pro overclockers would give this chip. The amd website says 1.425.
http://products.amd.com/en-us/...=&f6=&f7=&f8=&f9=&f10=

I have my AM3 x3 710 @ 2.99 Ghz stable 2 hours OCCT, stayed cool at 47 degrees during stress test. No voltage increase at all, which I like. I cant go any further without a voltage increase, me thinks. I tried messing around with everything in bios, but I think it needs voltage or Im limited by my memory. Here are my specs.

GA-MA78GM-US2H (rev. 1.0)
AMD 780G + SB700 Chipset
Am3 x3 710 2.6ghz
Gskill 2gb (800) 6400
Patriot 4gb (800) 6400
ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 64 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler - Retail
Arctic Silver 5

I know im a noob at overclocking and I mixed memory and all that but Im really trying to get the most value for my money. So Im trying to get the best out of the hardware that I have. The cpu is fast enough for my liking but I wouldnt mind hitting 3.2 with voltage increase. Anyway any suggestions would be nice, also does anyone know how to unlock the fouth core on a 780G like the one I have?? Thanks.

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: richierich1212

Originally posted by: alkalinetaupehat
Wasn't there someone who had a dual Kuma unlock into a quad for a while some time back?

Yup, dingleberrydorkbut. But he got too greedy, lol.

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...ht_key=y&keyword1=quad

That's a username if I ever heard one.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: eternalone
Whats the max volts you pro overclockers would give this chip. The amd website says 1.425.

It's a good question, I haven't heard of anyone killing their 45nm AMD chips yet from excessive voltage.

So other than the conservative opinion on what is bad or good based on what AMD says is the spec, I suppose no one can really answer your question yet.

Unless someone here has come across a reporting or two of dead Phenom II's? If you have please let us know.

 

[veri745]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: eternalone
Whats the max volts you pro overclockers would give this chip. The amd website says 1.425.

It's a good question, I haven't heard of anyone killing their 45nm AMD chips yet from excessive voltage.

So other than the conservative opinion on what is bad or good based on what AMD says is the spec, I suppose no one can really answer your question yet.

Unless someone here has come across a reporting or two of dead Phenom II's? If you have please let us know.

The 45nm chips start to deteriorate quickly when you get them into the high 1.5s