AMD Radeon RX Vega 64 and 56 Reviews [*UPDATED* Aug 28]

[ElFenix]

Seems to me this is possibly what is happening. I mean, this isn't the first time I've ever seen retailers gouging and then try to defend it by throwing the manufacturer under the bus. And this applies to AMD cards as well.

Something went wrong from the usual transaction that has caused some retailers to speak up. I still find it ironic that that Gibbo guy was a #1 source for the health of Polaris (he constantly cited great sales numbers) and now he's being considered unreliable.

Wonder if anyone has reached out to Newegg or Amazon? Also, wonder if retailers would just drop carrying any of the SKUs?

gibbo is UK, is he not? could very well be that due to the different regulatory structure between the US and UK, in addition to different market conditions and whatnot, that amd UK was doing something that AMD's US marketers aren't aware of.

 

[railven]

gibbo is UK, is he not? could very well be that due to the different regulatory structure between the US and UK, in addition to different market conditions and whatnot, that amd UK was doing something that AMD's US marketers aren't aware of.

Yeah, Gibbo is from the OC UK website/store, I believe.

EU has much stricter consumer laws as far as I'm aware. IE, it was the EU that kicked Valve in the nuts to get them to honor refunds/returns.

If it is a EU vs NA situation, that would explain a lot of things [EDIT: So far two sites that mentioned the rebates are in EU]. I do recall a while back India's prices were all jacked up, but I didn't follow up on that. Someone else might remember more. I believe that was tied to a distributor out there and AMD had to step in.

 

[ub4ty]

AMD could have done what Nvidia did .. Select a board partner and make an 'FE' edition RADEON branded and sell it directly through your website at a reasonable ceiling above MSRP to cover the cost. Supply it primarily and force the market to honor your MSRP through basic supply/demand. This is how Nvidia kept pricing in control for 3 months. This is what you pay your sales/business/lawyers staff to understand and implement. Just goes to show how worthless such individuals are in this day in age that the internet has been yelling for 2 weeks and they've just gotten around to replying with a shrug : what do?

And why in the hell would you give a retailer a rebate who seeks to gouge your customers? f*** them back and hold back supply on any portion of your distribution chain whose screw over your customers. Fight fire w/ fire. The aim is to sell products to your customers. The demand is there middle men are just soiling the waters. So, screw them just like they screw your customers. I could give a flying h00t who I buy my computer parts from. The cheapest gets my $$$. They literally take crap off a shipping truck and put it in a box. If AMD sold directly through their website, I'd go there and buy my hardware.

You see how Google is partnering with Walmart to bring it to Amazon? The whole e-tailer industry is about to get shaken up. These idiot e-retailers who keep price gouging customers are going to face a similar disruption down the road. The same way B&M business was put out to pasture for price gouging is the same way these clowns are going to be done away with if they keep this up.

So, Vega 56 launches on Monday .. Were literal days away and not a peep from AMD on how they plan on resolving this fiasco leading into product offering #2. Meanwhile they're losing loyal customers by the day. I just bought my 2nd 1070 after the vega64 launch expecting 56 launch to be similar idiocy. Use case : General purpose compute. Yes, I was willing to risk my development on an immature software stack to support a company I believe in .. That changed when the price gouging and idiocy occurred. It's hard for me to justify paying a premium over your competitor, take on extra risk on immature software along with support an inferior product that consumes more power.

We'll see come Monday.... If it happens again (likely), I will make sure to do everything in my power to avoid Radeon's hardware in the future and warn and urge anyone else to do the same. AMD CPU division seems to have better execution/polish and business staff thus has received my $$$. As for GPU needs, team green might be getting my business down the road once my needs mature.

I wanted to eval Radeon's hardware but this is just amateur hour lunacy from every aspect of their business unit. I can't get behind such a thing. Looking forward to AMD opening up infinity fabric to 3rd party groups so that I can get an Nvidia card wired into a ryzen CPU.

https://twitter.com/nvidiageforce/status/895746289589039104?lang=en

 

[krumme]

AMD could have done what Nvidia did .. Select a board partner and make an 'FE' edition RADEON branded and sell it directly through your website at a reasonable ceiling above MSRP to cover the cost. Supply it primarily and force the market to honor your MSRP through basic supply/demand. This is how Nvidia kept pricing in control for 3 months. This is what you pay your sales/business/lawyers staff to understand and implement. Just goes to show how worthless such individuals are in this day in age that the internet has been yelling for 2 weeks and they've just gotten around to replying with a shrug : what do?

And why in the hell would you give a retailer a rebate who seeks to gouge your customers? f*** them back and hold back supply on any portion of your distribution chain whose screw over your customers. Fight fire w/ fire. The aim is to sell products to your customers. The demand is there middle men are just soiling the waters. So, screw them just like they screw your customers. I could give a flying h00t who I buy my computer parts from. The cheapest gets my $$$. They literally take crap off a shipping truck and put it in a box. If AMD sold directly through their website, I'd go there and buy my hardware.

You see how Google is partnering with Walmart to bring it to Amazon? The whole e-tailer industry is about to get shaken up. These idiot e-retailers who keep price gouging customers are going to face a similar disruption down the road. The same way B&M business was put out to pasture for price gouging is the same way these clowns are going to be done away with if they keep this up.

So, Vega 56 launches on Monday .. Were literal days away and not a peep from AMD on how they plan on resolving this fiasco leading into product offering #2. Meanwhile they're losing loyal customers by the day. I just bought my 2nd 1070 after the vega64 launch expecting 56 launch to be similar idiocy. Use case : General purpose compute. Yes, I was willing to risk my development on an immature software stack to support a company I believe in .. That changed when the price gouging and idiocy occurred. It's hard for me to justify paying a premium over your competitor, take on extra risk on immature software along with support an inferior product that consumes more power.

We'll see come Monday.... If it happens again (likely), I will make sure to do everything in my power to avoid Radeon's hardware in the future and warn and urge anyone else to do the same. AMD CPU division seems to have better execution/polish and business staff thus has received my $$$. As for GPU needs, team green might be getting my business down the road once my needs mature.

I wanted to eval Radeon's hardware but this is just amateur hour lunacy from every aspect of their business unit. I can't get behind such a thing. Looking forward to AMD opening up infinity fabric to 3rd party groups so that I can get an Nvidia card wired into a ryzen CPU.

https://twitter.com/nvidiageforce/status/895746289589039104?lang=en

Excactly. Why cant they just copy what nv did with their fe cards? Its so simple. Supply and demand is working. And working against it with rebates is hopeless.
They rake in higher profit for first buyers. Thats okey. Thats how it should be.

Amd needs to hire people like you. They need not only the competence but the agressiveness needed to push it further.

They just dont know. And thats a problem facing the entire business drive of this company. There is no f.....g business awareness and the killer mode is non existing.

 

[Crumpet]

The end result is the same.

To my eyes, it seems retailers don't want to take the blame for charging above MSRP, and are putting it on a nonissue and the reviewers are eating it up as more news/video content for clicks.

You can't blame retailers for charging above MSRP when it costs them above MSRP to get the product in.

 

[nurturedhate]

You can't blame retailers for charging above MSRP when it costs them above MSRP to get the product in.

Haven't heard anyone saying that. You're going to want to source that.

 

[Dribble]

While AMD can't force MSRP, they can force the minimum price because that's how much they charge the retailer. So if AMD charges the etailer $500 for the card the etailer has to sell it for at least $600 to make any money. So it seems AMD is charging the etailers too much for the card, hence the high prices, but they offer a *rebate* on a few cards/month so those rebate cards can be $100 cheaper.

It's a way for AMD to claim it only costs $500 (because there are a few cards every month available at that price due to AMD providing the rebate) but in fact sell the card mostly for $600. It's just a scummy way to do things. Not that it matters because no one is going to buy the cards anyway - it's takes something exceptional to get people to stop buying Nvidia and Vega certainly isn't that!

 

[R0H1T]

While AMD can't force MSRP, they can force the minimum price because that's how much they charge the retailer. So if AMD charges the etailer $500 for the card the etailer has to sell it for at least $600 to make any money. So it seems AMD is charging the etailers too much for the card, hence the high prices, but they offer a *rebate* on a few cards/month so those rebate cards can be $100 cheaper.

It's a way for AMD to claim it only costs $500 (because there are a few cards every month available at that price due to AMD providing the rebate) but in fact sell the card mostly for $600. It's just a scummy way to do things. Not that it matters because no one is going to buy the cards anyway - it's takes something exceptional to get people to stop buying Nvidia and Vega certainly isn't that!

I believe you have it backwards ~

Before we get into details, the major problem appears to be that there are people out there who are willing to buy RX Vega 64 at higher price points than the MSRP. Since e-tailers can see that, they have no incentive to sell the card at the MSRP and instead opt for a higher selling price. This is where rebates come in: AMD can offer them a manufacturers rebate to bring down the selling price for the consumer but if the margin they are earning is greater than the rebate offered, then even that at times will not work.

So what exactly is the bottom line? Will users be able to buy RX Vega 64 at the marketed MSRP of $499? The short answer is approximately yes, but the long answer is slightly more complex. Our source has informed us that AMD will be handpicking around 10-20 e-tailers that they will incentivize via rebates to enable the price point of $499 on an ongoing basis. Amazon and Newegg are amongst these and should they choose to accept the rebate then users will be able to buy RX Vega 64 [standalone version] at the promised MSRP of $499. Now these rebates will be provided in batches but on an ongoing basis, which means you might have to wait a week or so before you are able to snag one.

For the rest of the retailers and e-tailers however, AMD simply can’t do anything. While the cost of the chip is high right now, there is enough margin in place for them to sell at $499 should they choose to. Considering the initial demand for Vega 64 however, that seems very unlikely. Remember, it is illegal for AMD to force a price point on retailers. Our source believed that the market forces should naturally converge at a universal price point of $599 – which is where the Radeon Pack with 2 AAA titles comes in – a sort of a sweetener for the disgruntled customer.

http://wccftech.com/radeon-rx-vega-64-msrp-pricing-update/

Take it with the usual caveat, or salt.

 

[Crumpet]

Haven't heard anyone saying that. You're going to want to source that.

OCUK said it.

And we have this;

https://www.techpowerup.com/236422/retailers-are-buying-amd-rx-vega-64-at-usd-675-each

 

[Tup3x]

Meh, I truly wonder what RTG is doing sometimes. AMD's CPU division has completely different approach: They make something that's easy to manufacture and scale up & down. Yields are good, no supply issues and prices are fantastic (on top of that performance is competitive). Year after year RTG makes costly design decisions that barely help in performance but makes the cards really costly.

 

[tential]

Woah.... that's the whole sale cost?
Lol... no.... the plot thickens.....

Edit: I just find that wholesale cost to be so confusing... that's got to be a specific case or something.... What's that specific retailer who got that quote/sale selling their cards at?

 

[nurturedhate]

OCUK said it.

And we have this;

https://www.techpowerup.com/236422/retailers-are-buying-amd-rx-vega-64-at-usd-675-each

That doesn't demonstrate AMD or their AIB's are responsible for the price hike at all. Going by the prices for other cards from MA Labs I'm actually amazed it's $675. This is like saying Best Buy has great deals on cards.

 

[nurturedhate]

Woah.... that's the whole sale cost?
Lol... no.... the plot thickens.....

Edit: I just find that whole sale cost to be so confusing... that's got to be a specific case or something.... What's that specific retailer selling at?

Not sure on the buyer's side, MA Labs has a retail side as well. Their prices are $720 for that particular sapphire model. $710 for another vega. As a point of reference 1050ti is $180, RX 560 is $140, 1060 6g is $300 and 1080ti is $820 and up.

 

[Magic Hate Ball]

Not sure on the buyer's side, MA Labs has a retail side as well. Their prices are $720 for that particular sapphire model. $710 for another vega. As a point of reference 1050ti is $180, RX 560 is $140, 1060 6g is $300 and 1080ti is $820 and up.

Such deals!

 

[nurturedhate]

The chain saw the rise in sold prices for basically all cards south of 1080 and decided to play "who can make the most money" on a new card release. From AMD's side they tried countering this with a bundle to dissuade miners and rebates to retail to ensure their MSRP and everyone kills them for it, hilarious. This whole situation and people's response to it is laughable.

Screw Nvidia's FE/MSRP concept and let's get straight to the best possible idea. April 2018 - Nvidia drops Titan V, 5000 - 10,000 or however many cards, put them up for auction 1 at a time. Highest bidder wins. Stream the whole thing. Want a chance at bidding on one? Got to buy the stream. They'd make a killing and people would cheer.

 

[nurturedhate]

All of this seems to have started with Gibbo and OCUK. Weeks ago he posts that Vega will be a monster miner. He starts a miner's hype train. They get cards, sell a few, then drive up prices, feeding off his VEGA is a miner's dream remarks. Then he blames it all on AMD. Profit. Everyone follows suit. Did I miss something?

 

[EXCellR8]

got to try out Vega 64 at local PC shop--who managed to obtain one through a partner store. they had none for sale though.

at their demo machine it's quite nice running @ 4K+Fsync but the reference cooler is definitely too loud for my liking. keep in mind that this is a quiet family-owned shop so there's basically no background noise. they had a GTX 1080 set up also (I don't think it was a Ti) and the avg. framerate was about the same. the manager told me it all depends on the title at play, which we all kind of knew already.

so, AIB or nothing for me; hopefully the plot thins out by then

 

[Tweak155]

got to try out Vega 64 at local PC shop--who managed to obtain one through a partner store. they had none for sale though.

at their demo machine it's quite nice running @ 4K+Fsync but the reference cooler is definitely too loud for my liking. keep in mind that this is a quiet family-owned shop so there's basically no background noise. they had a GTX 1080 set up also (I don't think it was a Ti) and the avg. framerate was about the same. the manager told me it all depends on the title at play, which we all kind of knew already.

so, AIB or nothing for me; hopefully the plot thins out by then

Cool, thanks for the hands on experience comments

 

[antihelten]

Scan.co.uk, another leading UK e-tailer confirmed the rebates (for what we understand to be 275 units)

(plus Komplett in Norway confirmed it too - https://www.tek.no/artikler/amds-rx-vega-64-oker-med-1000-kroner-i-norge/403711)

(Sweclockers too - http://www.sweclockers.com/nyhet/24297-amd-kor-fult-spel-med-prissattningen-av-radeon-rx-vega-64)

For what it's worth neither Komplett nor Sweclockers make any mention whatsoever of rebates, all they are saying is that the $500 price point was limited to a small amount of cards at launch.

I also haven't seen Scan.co.uk confirm rebates anywhere, I would love to see a link to this. Without them OCUK (Gibbo) remains the only retailer to have confirmed the rebate story.

 

[Despoiler]

Interesting article testing HBCC. Did the [H] review showing perf tanking with 8xMSAA still have the HBCC setting disabled?

https://techgage.com/article/a-look-at-amd-radeon-vega-hbcc/

 

[Crumpet]

For what it's worth neither Komplett nor Sweclockers make any mention whatsoever of rebates, all they are saying is that the $500 price point was limited to a small amount of cards at launch.

I also haven't seen Scan.co.uk confirm rebates anywhere, I would love to see a link to this. Without them OCUK (Gibbo) remains the only retailer to have confirmed the rebate story.

Scan said it to OC3D, it's in their video that I posted earlier on in the thread that nobody apparently watched.

 

[PeterScott]

Scan said it to OC3D, it's in their video that I posted earlier on in the thread that nobody apparently watched.

As did Steve and GN:
http://www.gamersnexus.net/news-pc/3023-aib-partners-to-gn-yes-vega-price-will-change

"
In speaking with different sources from different companies that work with AMD, GamersNexus learned that “Gibbo is right” regarding the AMD rebate expiry and subsequent price jump. AMD purportedly provided the top retailers and etailers with a $499 price on Vega 64, coupling sale of the card with a rebate to reduce spend by retailers, and therefore use leverage to force the lower price. The $100 rebate from AMD is already expiring, hence the price jump by retailers who need return. Rebates were included as a means to encourage retailers to try to sell at the lower $499 price. With those expiring, leverage is gone and retailers/etailers return to their own price structure, as margins are exceptionally low on this product.
"

It has been confirmed from multiple sources beyond Gibbo. I have ZERO doubt this happened.

 

[ElFenix]

AMD could have done what Nvidia did .. Select a board partner and make an 'FE' edition RADEON branded and sell it directly through your website at a reasonable ceiling above MSRP to cover the cost.

that assumes that amd didn't give up the right to compete against its board partners in the retail gaming (mining) space in its contracts and/or favor one board partner over another.

 

[nurturedhate]

As did Steve and GN:
http://www.gamersnexus.net/news-pc/3023-aib-partners-to-gn-yes-vega-price-will-change

"
In speaking with different sources from different companies that work with AMD, GamersNexus learned that “Gibbo is right” regarding the AMD rebate expiry and subsequent price jump. AMD purportedly provided the top retailers and etailers with a $499 price on Vega 64, coupling sale of the card with a rebate to reduce spend by retailers, and therefore use leverage to force the lower price. The $100 rebate from AMD is already expiring, hence the price jump by retailers who need return. Rebates were included as a means to encourage retailers to try to sell at the lower $499 price. With those expiring, leverage is gone and retailers/etailers return to their own price structure, as margins are exceptionally low on this product.
"

It has been confirmed from multiple sources beyond Gibbo. I have ZERO doubt this happened.

The narrative that is being pushed is that AMD is the one creating/profiting from the higher prices. That quote states the exact opposite is happening. AMD attempted to keep retailers from inflating the price.

 

[guachi]

I guess I find it odd that people are outraged and upset that AMD would provide incentives to retailers to keep prices low.

Automobile manufacturers provide dealer incentives all the time that aren't disclosed to consumers.

I assume it's just that so many PC enthusiasts are champing at the bit to attack AMD for not delivering the rainbows and unicorns they demanded. Though, really, most of these enthusiasts wouldn't buy AMD anyway. They just want AMD to produce a better card so they can but their nVidia card for less.

As long as Vega 64 costs about the same as the 1080, it's a good buy. It's not really that controversial of a point. All the squid ink of butthurt from people like Jayz2cents is just silly (it not, if it brings views and clicks).