AMD Ryzen 3000 Builders Thread

[Fanatical Meat]

I really can't blame them (I don't agree with it, but I fully understand why so many take advantage of new, in demand products. $$$$). There's people out there who will gladly pay the "I wanna be first" tax.

However, I am patient and I can wait a while since my PC is working just fine.

Hell, I’m thinking of going to microcenter to get in line to buy one the eBay it. I’ll take the extra cash for my build, I can wait a few more weeks.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Eh, *g*, nope, not trying to sell any Bulldozer CPUs, currently. Although I do have a built rig with one in it, could be available cheap to the right buyer.

 

[phillyman36]

Any idea what time places like Amazon and Newegg are going to start selling everything? I have a Microcenter about 5 miles from me so im going to check there as well.

 

[Topweasel]

Hell, I’m thinking of going to microcenter to get in line to buy one the eBay it. I’ll take the extra cash for my build, I can wait a few more weeks.

You might get lucky with boards. But AMD hasn't had a CPU supply probably at any point during a Ryzen launch. This guy can get an extra 100 because he is selling it before anyone else can. You won't get a premium when everyone has it in stock.

 

[DrMrLordX]

We have to agree to disagree, but that's fine.
Life would be boring without a bit of arguing

Can't wait for Sunday!

Frankly, I was surprised by what he said. 2700x won't draw more than ~90a with just PB + XFR (no PBO). I don't see why they would have upped the current spec on Matisse unless it's to accommodate the 12c and 16c chips. We may not see 140a sustained draw on anything but the 3950x (again, without PBO). And that makes sense! A 3800x drawing 140a would probably put its all-core speed somewhere close to its boost limit. That would be really interesting if that is indeed what happens with those chips!

Keep in mind that in regards to Ryzen, a small frequency downgrade for dual-rank sticks versus the single-rank "good stuff" still meant roughly equal performance.

I would like to have seen this benchmarks more often, but you are correct. Dual-rank DIMMs brought with them higher performance in some applications as a trade-off for lower memory clocks. BUT the downside is that you'd lose some IF speed in the process thanks to the low memory clockspeeds. Going dual-rank on Zen/Zen+ was therefore not usually worth it.

On the plus side, AMD is acting like a). most RAM overclocks won't go higher than DDR4-3733 without using a 1/2 IF multiplier and b). 2x16GB configs (2x dual rank) may hit speeds of around DDR4-3333 this time around. Maybe. If someone could figure out how to push a 2x16GB config to DDR4-3733, you might get the best of both worlds.

OK, first pre-order on a 3900x: but at $600 ???

Looks like someone is anticipating selling a Day 1 chip at a markup to someone who can't get one. Pretty lame actually. I have no reason to believe that guy can deliver the chip today.

Any idea what time places like Amazon and Newegg are going to start selling everything? I have a Microcenter about 5 miles from me so im going to check there as well.

7/7 at either 3am or 9am. They had Radeon VII tied to the review embargo, and the review embargo for that product lifted @ 9am.

 

[IEC]

OK, first pre-order on a 3900x: but at $600 ???

https://www.ebay.com/itm/AMD-Ryzen-...032535?hash=item1a7f3fba17:g:Y7oAAOSwpRhdGoMd

And even though it says 3900x in the title, it says 3800x below, but 12 cores.

"Includes 5 business days handling time after receipt of cleared payment."

Also known as, they are going to camp out at a Microcenter or other B&M store and pick up some to resell, knowing that the demand will be high.

They don't actually have the chip on hand.

 

[phillyman36]

I just texted my local Microcenter. The said they will have stock and will be open at 9Am (EST). Didnt give my quantities and which item they will have.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

You might get lucky with boards. But AMD hasn't had a CPU supply probably at any point during a Ryzen launch. This guy can get an extra 100 because he is selling it before anyone else can. You won't get a premium when everyone has it in stock.

That’s the rub, I have a gut feeling supplies will be limited however I’ll abort that plan if it appears I’m wrong.

 

[Markfw]

Frankly, I was surprised by what he said. 2700x won't draw more than ~90a with just PB + XFR (no PBO). I don't see why they would have upped the current spec on Matisse unless it's to accommodate the 12c and 16c chips. We may not see 140a sustained draw on anything but the 3950x (again, without PBO). And that makes sense! A 3800x drawing 140a would probably put its all-core speed somewhere close to its boost limit. That would be really interesting if that is indeed what happens with those chips!



I would like to have seen this benchmarks more often, but you are correct. Dual-rank DIMMs brought with them higher performance in some applications as a trade-off for lower memory clocks. BUT the downside is that you'd lose some IF speed in the process thanks to the low memory clockspeeds. Going dual-rank on Zen/Zen+ was therefore not usually worth it.

On the plus side, AMD is acting like a). most RAM overclocks won't go higher than DDR4-3733 without using a 1/2 IF multiplier and b). 2x16GB configs (2x dual rank) may hit speeds of around DDR4-3333 this time around. Maybe. If someone could figure out how to push a 2x16GB config to DDR4-3733, you might get the best of both worlds.



Looks like someone is anticipating selling a Day 1 chip at a markup to someone who can't get one. Pretty lame actually. I have no reason to believe that guy can deliver the chip today.



7/7 at either 3am or 9am. They had Radeon VII tied to the review embargo, and the review embargo for that product lifted @ 9am.

It said 7/7 he would sell it. 3 available

 

[Kenmitch]

I just texted my local Microcenter. The said they will have stock and will be open at 9Am (EST). Didnt give my quantities and which item they will have.

If it was me I'd just be watching their online store for the opportunity to just snag one for in store pickup. I'd imagine they'll have them available at some point in time. They might pop up showing available in store only or give the option for purchase with in store pickup.

 

[phillyman36]

If it was me I'd just be watching their online store for the opportunity to just snag one for in store pickup. I'd imagine they'll have them available at some point in time. They might pop up showing available in store only or give the option for purchase with in store pickup.

That's what I'm going to try and do if i cant find on Amazon or Newegg. Try to do the reserve in store pick up.

 

[B-Riz]

BUILD SPECS TIME

Using a 1TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus until a nice selection of PCIE4 NVME drives are out.

2 x 16 GB Crucial Ballistix 3200 DDR4.

I am buying Sunday morning ASAP from Micro Center for Monday pickup; 3900X, X570 board and 5700XT.

I am torn on cooler, MAYBE a Mugen 5 or something similar later on. Kinda indifferent about CPU OC right now, going to try memory OC and timing tweaking first.

5700XT is whatever available at MSRP; but, I think just like the Hawaii days, 5700 is going to be the best bang for buck.

First board choice is the MSI X570 Pro Carbon WIFI (seems to be a nice balance of features, kinda like the layout of the board most), second is between the Gigabyte X570 Aorus Pro, AsRock X570 Extreme4 or Asus X570 Pro.

It would be nice to have more boards with 14 phases and no wifi available.

I don't really want / care about wifi on a mobo.

https://us.msi.com/Motherboard/MPG-X570-GAMING-PRO-CARBON-WIFI/Overview

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X570-AORUS-PRO-rev-10#kf

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X570 Extreme4/index.asp#Overview

https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/PRIME-X570-PRO/

 

[DrMrLordX]

@B-Riz

You already got the RAM in hand? That Samsung M-die is looking mighty interesting. $160 for a 32GB is compelling, and you might hit DDR4-3600 with two sticks of that.

Not 100% sure about the Mugen. Only one I've seen benched is the rev. B (not PCGH or TUF versions) but if you're going to get one of those, they're within spitting distance of the Dark Rock Pro 3 for about $50, so they look okay. I would be all-in on air cooling if I were going to use air on a 3900x though. Maybe $30-$40 more gets you an NH-d15 or Dark Rock Pro 4. For point-of-reference:

https://www.tomshardware.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-4-cpu-cooler,review-34292-2.html

In a heavy heat load, the Dark Rock Pro 4 is beating the older Dark Rock Pro 3 by ~8C. You should reasonably expect a Mugen Rev. B to be maybe 1C behind the Pro 3 at most. NH-d15 can eclipse the Pro 4 in heavy heat loads by another 1-2C.

In the end it comes down to budget vs. expectations. I have loved both my NH-d14 and NH-d15, and the former put in approximately 8 years of duty on multiple different processors, so I do not mind that I spent a few extra dollars on it (yay AM2 having the same retention mechanism as FM2+). The NH-d15 will stay with my 1800x wherever it goes. Good HSFs last. Despite being a Noctua fanboy, I see several reasons why people might want the Pro 4 instead. I can understand if some of the larger HSFs do not meet some of your other needs. RAM clearance is not an issue on the Pro 4, but it can be one with Noctua's largest HSFs. Then there's the problems with fitting the things into your case.

As for motherboards, what exact features are you looking for, and how many phases do you want on the primary? I am cautious of MSI now that I see that their prices may be appallingly high. They want over $700 for their top-of-the-line board when it already looks mostly inferior to Gigabyte's best board. If you don't want to risk Gigabyte UEFI then I do not blame you. As far as Asus goes, the Impact may be one of the most interesting boards they offer. It's probably 6-layer (rare for a small board), and it allegedly is laid out to maximize RAM overclocks above all else. On top of that, while it only has an 8-phase primary, each phase is rated for 70a. That's actually more robust than my X370 Taichi's 12-phase primary (40a per phase). Haven't seen the price on it yet, though, and it may not have all the features you want.

 

[mopardude87]

https://www.tomshardware.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-4-cpu-cooler,review-34292-2.html

In a heavy heat load, the Dark Rock Pro 4 is beating the older Dark Rock Pro 3 by ~8C.

The thing about that Dark Rock Pro 4 that amazes me most is its compatibility with the 775 chipset. There is a QX9770 extreme user somewhere who may be all over this one. I had a friend who got one of those QX9770 chips days before i got a i7 940. Talk about someone being upset.

I thought the Cooler Master V8 i had on the i7 940 was a bit much.

 

[B-Riz]

@B-Riz

You already got the RAM in hand? That Samsung M-die is looking mighty interesting. $160 for a 32GB is compelling, and you might hit DDR4-3600 with two sticks of that.

Not 100% sure about the Mugen. Only one I've seen benched is the rev. B (not PCGH or TUF versions) but if you're going to get one of those, they're within spitting distance of the Dark Rock Pro 3 for about $50, so they look okay. I would be all-in on air cooling if I were going to use air on a 3900x though. Maybe $30-$40 more gets you an NH-d15 or Dark Rock Pro 4. For point-of-reference:

https://www.tomshardware.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-4-cpu-cooler,review-34292-2.html

In a heavy heat load, the Dark Rock Pro 4 is beating the older Dark Rock Pro 3 by ~8C. You should reasonably expect a Mugen Rev. B to be maybe 1C behind the Pro 3 at most. NH-d15 can eclipse the Pro 4 in heavy heat loads by another 1-2C.

In the end it comes down to budget vs. expectations. I have loved both my NH-d14 and NH-d15, and the former put in approximately 8 years of duty on multiple different processors, so I do not mind that I spent a few extra dollars on it (yay AM2 having the same retention mechanism as FM2+). The NH-d15 will stay with my 1800x wherever it goes. Good HSFs last. Despite being a Noctua fanboy, I see several reasons why people might want the Pro 4 instead. I can understand if some of the larger HSFs do not meet some of your other needs. RAM clearance is not an issue on the Pro 4, but it can be one with Noctua's largest HSFs. Then there's the problems with fitting the things into your case.

As for motherboards, what exact features are you looking for, and how many phases do you want on the primary? I am cautious of MSI now that I see that their prices may be appallingly high. They want over $700 for their top-of-the-line board when it already looks mostly inferior to Gigabyte's best board. If you don't want to risk Gigabyte UEFI then I do not blame you. As far as Asus goes, the Impact may be one of the most interesting boards they offer. It's probably 6-layer (rare for a small board), and it allegedly is laid out to maximize RAM overclocks above all else. On top of that, while it only has an 8-phase primary, each phase is rated for 70a. That's actually more robust than my X370 Taichi's 12-phase primary (40a per phase). Haven't seen the price on it yet, though, and it may not have all the features you want.

I have 32GB of Ballistic 3200 in hand right now, and was planning to get more on Monday as Micro Center has been having it on sale. It can OC to ~3466 according to other users of it, and is very underrated memory.

My board specs are minimal really, I have not bought the hype about current draws and needing this and that yet. Looking for at least 10 phase, Intel wired LAN, ALC 1220 audio, 2 x M.2, mostly PCIE4 slots.

The MSI X570 I like because the top slot layout makes the most sense; no extra x1 that is going to get blocked anyway. AND, I am not going hog wild on a board here, TR3 is still going to be a chunk of change in the next 6 months and I want to plan accordingly for that CPU and RAM upgrade.

A Gigabyte 12 phase is the next candidate if the MSI sells out.

For me, PCIE4 storage / expansion slots are the draw here, max OC this and that feels like a fools errand anymore if the CPU is full of sensors that do a better job for the most part anyway. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Basically, all the things people have crapped on X570 about, I like.

And, I am old school, ATX or bust, eff anything else.

Honestly, I don't feel the Noctua big air coolers are worth the money for me, as I am not going for max all core static OC. I have two Mugen 2 Rev B and have been happy with them.

I just thought about modding the included 3900X cooler with a bracket and 120mm or 140mm fan, just because. I never upgraded the cooler on the 2700X, not sure what I will do with the 3900X cooling right now.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I have 32GB of Ballistic 3200 in hand right now, and was planning to get more on Monday as Micro Center has been having it on sale. It can OC to ~3466 according to other users of it, and is very underrated memory.

Okay, forget the M die then.

My board specs are minimal really, I have not bought the hype about current draws and needing this and that yet. Looking for at least 10 phase, Intel wired LAN, ALC 1220 audio, 2 x M.2, mostly PCIE4 slots.

Just remember, not all phases are created equal. There are some 8-phase boards out there (like ones with 60-70a phases) that are stronger than some 10-phase boards (like the Gigabyte X470 board that has 10 phase primary with 40a per phase).

A Gigabyte 12 phase is the next candidate if the MSI sells out.

Gigabyte Aorus Master looks amazing, if it's in your price range. I haven't seen the full lineup of MSI prices but I think the Master is supposed to be less than C8H, somewhere around $320-$340.

And, I am old school, ATX or bust, eff anything else.

I am usually like that, but I will make exceptions for the right board. Last time I went smaller than full ATX was an old Abit board (NF m2 nView) that wound up being a killer OC platform. Still, if slots are a draw for you then you want to avoid smaller form factors.

Honestly, I don't feel the Noctua big air coolers are worth the money for me, as I am not going for max all core static OC.

Nobody will get max OC on air with a 3900x. People pushing for 4.7 GHz or higher static will need AiO or custom water. I'm calling it now. NH-d15 owners, feel free to prove me wrong.

If you're really not sure what you want to do vis-a-vis cooling, try the stock cooler that comes with the 3900x for awhile, get a feel for how hungry is the processor, and then go from there. You already own some Mugen 5 coolers so potentially you could test one of those if you like.

 

[IEC]

I've got Gigabyte X370 K7 and Gaming 5 boards that should theoretically be good enough VRMs for 3900X OC. I also have EK AM4 waterblock and Noctua D15 sitting around...

 

[B-Riz]

Okay, forget the M die then.



Just remember, not all phases are created equal. There are some 8-phase boards out there (like ones with 60-70a phases) that are stronger than some 10-phase boards (like the Gigabyte X470 board that has 10 phase primary with 40a per phase).



Gigabyte Aorus Master looks amazing, if it's in your price range. I haven't seen the full lineup of MSI prices but I think the Master is supposed to be less than C8H, somewhere around $320-$340.



I am usually like that, but I will make exceptions for the right board. Last time I went smaller than full ATX was an old Abit board (NF m2 nView) that wound up being a killer OC platform. Still, if slots are a draw for you then you want to avoid smaller form factors.



Nobody will get max OC on air with a 3900x. People pushing for 4.7 GHz or higher static will need AiO or custom water. I'm calling it now. NH-d15 owners, feel free to prove me wrong.

If you're really not sure what you want to do vis-a-vis cooling, try the stock cooler that comes with the 3900x for awhile, get a feel for how hungry is the processor, and then go from there. You already own some Mugen 5 coolers so potentially you could test one of those if you like.

I appreciate your enthusiasm and helpfulness, but, right now, the whole phase things is ehhhhhh and I really do not think it is a big deal unless you really are going to max OC; the CPU will throttle and the system will shutdown before it matters if you have 40, 50, 60, 70 or a billion amp phases All that lends to more efficient switching, but, it is not the end all be all.

If I was really concerned, I would wait 6+ months for Buildzoid to run through a crap ton of boards, but, again, I am not worried about all that because I am not going for max OC or even any CPU OC right now.

I really have no problem running the 3900X on the cheapest 10 phase or 8 phase even! and clocking memory at 3466, but I want a few features beyond the basic X570.

I am fully prepared to spend $250 - $300 on a board, that is the reality of the situation, but I do not want to pay extra for fuggin wifi when I don't run it on the desktop (14 phase boards, most 12 phase boards).

Right now the MSI X570 Pro Carbon WIFI looks like the best all around package (despite WIFI) for what I want. And I am still dropping a chunk on TR3 later, I don't need a crazy board for Zen2 right now.

Cooling is what it is right now, and this is a 7nm chip, the same cooler works pretty darn good on the 2700X.

I am looking at beefy down draft coolers right now and will probably pick one up in a month or so.

I still have my NF7-S Rev 2 and mobile Athlon XP chillin' in the basement.

Sorry, but this whole endeavor of worrying about power delivery on things that have been planned and designed for and planned and designed for and planned and designed for is getting tiring.

(I ran / am running a Gigabyte B350 Gaming3 and R7 1700 with mild OC and have had no board issues, and that is a budget budget board, so, really, I am not worried about a mid range X570 right now )

I run good airflow and 80+ Gold power supplies, so, I have that covered too

 

[VirtualLarry]

Has there been any recent data on possibly a recanting, or spec. correction, with regards to 1st-Gen Ryzen CPUs NOT working on X570 boards?

I would love to pick up an X570 board with appropriate specs, and drop in a PCI-E 4.0 x4 NVMe SSD.

Oh, right, with 1st-Gen Ryzen CPUs, I won't get PCI-E 4.0 speeds anyways.

Well, it was a nice dream, for the brief moment that it lasted.

 

[B-Riz]

I've got Gigabyte X370 K7 and Gaming 5 boards that should theoretically be good enough VRMs for 3900X OC. I also have EK AM4 waterblock and Noctua D15 sitting around...

Throw something together, for science!

 

[DrMrLordX]

Cooling is what it is right now, and this is a 7nm chip, the same cooler works pretty darn good on the 2700X.

3900x will pull more power than 2700x.

edit: that one leaked review already put the 3700x (65W TDP) at ~120W full load.

 

[B-Riz]

Has there been any recent data on possibly a recanting, or spec. correction, with regards to 1st-Gen Ryzen CPUs NOT working on X570 boards?

I would love to pick up an X570 board with appropriate specs, and drop in a PCI-E 4.0 x4 NVMe SSD.

Oh, right, with 1st-Gen Ryzen CPUs, I won't get PCI-E 4.0 speeds anyways.

Well, it was a nice dream, for the brief moment that it lasted.

Lol, good reason to recklessly eyeball an R5 3600 / X570 setup

 

[Markfw]

@DrMrLordX To simple and direct, what do you think of the ASRock x370 and X470 Taichi ? and ther ASUS X470 prime pro ? With regards to running a 3900x overclocked.

 

[VirtualLarry]

edit: that one leaked review already put the 3700x (65W TDP) at ~120W full load.

My 2700 @ 4.0Ghz and 1.35V goes to 135W, according to HWMonitor. It's under 240mm CM ML240 AIO WC.

Edit: That's on an Asus ROG STRIX B450-F ATX board.

 

[DrMrLordX]

@DrMrLordX To simple and direct, what do you think of the ASRock x370 and X470 Taichi ? and ther ASUS X470 prime pro ? With regards to running a 3900x overclocked.

They have the VRMs for it, theoretical current limit is 480a on the primary (realistically speaking, you will hit socket/pinout limits before hitting even the functional current limits of the VRMs). Both are T-topology so do not expect elite memory overclocks. HOWEVER if you are going to populate all four DIMM slots, you may be in a better position because of that. ASRock used doublers on both boards so you may see some more vdroop compared to "twinned" configs (Asus) or configs with "true" non-doubled/non-twinned layouts (basically, top two Gigabyte boards). Use common sense and some LLC to mitigate.

You may miss some features you find on Asus boards (PBO tweaking) but that is pretty niche. Also expect the max memclock selectable in UEFI to be DDR4-4000, at least on the X370 Taichi anyway.

Overall, X470 Taichi should be slightly better due to the layout changes that AMD mandated from X370 -> X470. And UEFI support has slowly been getting better for some users of Summit Ridge and Pinnacle Ridge on X370 Taichi. There may be hope in that department. UEFI rev 5.60 on X370 Taichi already supports Matisse. UEFI 3.40 on X470 Taichi does the same. X470 seems to be getting updates more frequently (X470 has had 3.40 available since late May; X370 was updated two days ago). Both are using AGESA Combo-AM4 1.0.0.1

@B-Riz

Looking at the MSI Gaming Pro Carbon WIFI:

https://www.overclock.net/forum/13-amd-general/1624051-vrm-new-am4-motherboards.html

Only 4-layer means reduced signal stability for PCIe 4.0. May also limit RAM overclocking. There were some rumours that x570 boards would all have to be 6-layer to handle PCIe 4.0. I do not think that's the case, but still. It's something to consider. If you aren't using any PCIe 4.0 devices and if you do not care about your RAM OC then it may never matter. VRMs are equal to the task, even if they de-rate at higher temperatures.

My 2700 @ 4.0Ghz and 1.35V goes to 135W, according to HWMonitor. It's under 240mm CM ML240 AIO WC.

Is that static, though? Usually a 2700x with PB + XFR tops out at 105-110W, depending on the review. I know my 1800x @ 4.0 GHz pulls over 200W. Heh.