[AMD] Vega coming in 1H 2017

[Maverick177]

Raja specifically said AMD will introduce 3 GPUs this year. What's the surprise here? Am I missing something?

 

[Unreal123]

Raja specifically said AMD will introduce 3 GPUs this year. What's the surprise here? Am I missing something?

Not true. He promised that AMD will launch 2 GPU this year ,which were Polaris 10 and 11. That is it from AMD this year and you are hitting a dead horse if you except them to compete with Nvidia Pascal this year or next year early.

 

[Erenhardt]

brainfart

 

[Glo.]

Not true. He promised that AMD will launch 2 GPU this year ,which were Polaris 10 and 11. That is it from AMD this year and you are hitting a dead horse if you except them to compete with Nvidia Pascal this year or next year early.

He specifically said: AMD will introduce two Polaris GPUs. There are two designs, yet there are three GPUs in Polaris line.

 

[Glo.]

Secondly. There are two Vega GPUs.

Enthusiast is the market segment where lies Titan X. GTX 1080 - High-End with Enthusiast price tag. GTX 1070 - Mid-range with high-end price tag. Everything beneath this is mainstream market.

 

[AtenRa]

Who is going to buy Vega in Q2 2017, if its basically a GP104 competitor.

There are people buying 2014 GTX 980 performance cards two years later in 2016, you know the RX 480/GTX 106.

And who would have thought that people would buy a 2015 GTX 980Ti performance card in 2016 (GTX 1070)

 

[ShintaiDK]

There are people buying 2014 GTX 980 performance cards two years later in 2016, you know the RX 480/GTX 106.

And who would have thought that people would buy a 2015 GTX 980Ti performance card in 2016 (GTX 1070)

How many people that didn't #waitforvega and bought GP104/GP102 will buy it? Maybe you forgot its labelled enthusiast.

If you wish to compare with the GTX970(470/480) and GTX980(1060). Are you saying AMD will sell Vega very cheap because its all they can get? Selling performance years ago for lower price? In that case its an entirely different set of buyers. And they are not enthusiast segment buyers.

 

[AtenRa]

How many people that didn't #waitforvega and bought GP104/GP102 will buy it? Maybe you forgot its labelled enthusiast.

If you wish to compare with the GTX970(470/480) and GTX980(1060). Are you saying AMD will sell Vega very cheap because its all they can get? Selling performance years ago for lower price?

What im saying is that there are people that will buy last years High-End performance products at lower prices this year, otherwise companies would only release a single product every year.

GTX 1070 vs GTX 980Ti
GTX 1060 vs GTX 980

etc etc

Also there are two VEGA Chips, one could be a GTX 1070/1080 competitor and the other could be a higher-end product. Also dont forget that 14/16nm Wafer cost is higher in 2016, same performance SKUs in 2017 will be cheaper to produce. That means they will be sold cheaper in 2017 but will maintain almost the same margins, add also that due to lower price they will sell higher volume than what they did in 2016.

So this doom about nobody will buy a Vega in 2017 if it is a GTX 1070/180 competitor is simple out of touch with reality

 

[linkgoron]

What im saying is that there are people that will buy last years High-End performance products at lower prices this year, otherwise companies would only release a single product every year.
[...]
So this doom about nobody will buy a Vega in 2017 if it is a GTX 1070/180 competitor is simple out of touch with reality

The question is what will Vega go up against. It's not clear that the 1070/1080 lineup will be its competition. It's also not clear that Vega will actually have better value than the 1070/1080 lineup at the time of its release. Nothing is stopping Nvidia from price cuts or releasing new GPUs.

The market and Nvidia are not waiting for AMD.

 

[ShintaiDK]

What im saying is that there are people that will buy last years High-End performance products at lower prices this year, otherwise companies would only release a single product every year.

GTX 1070 vs GTX 980Ti
GTX 1060 vs GTX 980

etc etc

Also there are two VEGA Chips, one could be a GTX 1070/1080 competitor and the other could be a higher-end product. Also dont forget that 14/16nm Wafer cost is higher in 2016, same performance SKUs in 2017 will be cheaper to produce. That means they will be sold cheaper in 2017 but will maintain almost the same margins, add also that due to lower price they will sell higher volume than what they did in 2016.

So this doom about nobody will buy a Vega in 2017 if it is a GTX 1070/180 competitor is simple out of touch with reality

You didn't address the issue. Who is going to wait and who is going to buy?

470/480 and 1060 offers something today in their price segment. What will Vega offer at launch compared? Will Vega be discounted to attract from a lower segment?

Else only a fool will wait and get the possible same performance a year later for the possible same price.

 

[AtenRa]

You didn't address the issue. Who is going to wait and who is going to buy?

There are people today with GTX 970/980/980ti and R9 380/390/Fury that will want to upgrade in 2017, Vega will be an option for them simple as that.

 

[AtenRa]

The question is what will Vega go up against. It's not clear that the 1070/1080 lineup will be its competition. It's also not clear that Vega will actually have better value than the 1070/1080 lineup at the time of its release. Nothing is stopping Nvidia from price cuts or releasing new GPUs.

The market and Nvidia are not waiting for AMD.

It has been know there are two Vega chips, one could compete against the GP104 market and the big chip could actually compete against GP102, its simple as that.

 

[Thala]

You didn't address the issue. Who is going to wait and who is going to buy?
470/480 and 1060 offers something today in their price segment. What will Vega offer at launch compared? Will Vega be discounted to attract from a lower segment?
Else only a fool will wait and get the possible same performance a year later for the possible same price.

This statement makes no sense whatsoever. You essentially say, that NVidia should stop production of 1070/1080 early next year, as only fools are left buying these GPUs later. This goes against evidence, that even high end GPUs are still selling well after a year - or maybe there are just many fools.
Would be great for AMD if NVidia would follow the same stupid reasoning, as it would leave the according market segments for only Vega.

 

[linkgoron]

It has been know there are two Vega chips, one could compete against the GP104 market and the big chip could actually compete against GP102, its simple as that.

Yes, but for all we know only Vega 10 is close(r?) to being ready. We don't really know anything about Vega 11. If AMD have not solved their Polaris perf/watt problems, I don't see Vega 10 beating the 1080 without having significant perf/watt problems. I can probably see it somewhere between the 1070 and 1080 with decent power usage.

Looking at Polaris pricing, I see Vega MSRP between 330$ and 350$. The question is if 290(x)/390(x)/970/980 owners will wait for Vega if the 1070 gauging stops. Currently the lowest 1070 is 410$ (according to nowinstock), but if the 1070 actually goes down to its MSRP (380$, if anyone remembers) I doubt people will wait.

That's not to say people won't buy Vega. I will probably buy one, as I will probably have a freesync monitor by then, and also I dislike Nvidia and prefer AMD, but Vega is horribly late given the great execution by Nvidia across the board.

 

[guskline]

I recently built a third rig around a Reference RX 480 I was able to snag off Newegg for $239 plus shipping. My 5960x rig had my GTX 980TI in it and I moved that to the 4790K rig which previously had 2 R9-290s in CF. I sold the 290s but since I wanted an AMD video card and was able to snag the RX480 at retail I have one built with it.

Vega will be AMDs next step back into the higher end cards. Fury X and Fury were it's first step but Vega needs to bring it closer to AMD just as the RX480 has to the GTX 1060.

AMD had originally listed Vega as a 2017 release, and despite some tweets and teases, that appears to be it's strategy.

 

[guskline]

Raja specifically said AMD will introduce 3 GPUs this year. What's the surprise here? Am I missing something?

Maverick177, Perhaps the 3rd Raja is referring to is the Pro WX Radeon series?

 

[Erenhardt]

The other way to look at it is Vega in 2017 may be extremely early.
Not to start a hype train, but...
Choo-chooo!
Vega may be the first fully dx12 compatible GPU, have new and shiny HBM2, new cheap tricks to BS ppl about VR, etc.

OTOH AMD can try to pull an Apple and launch like they're the only player in the market. Confidence attracts people and when a company acts like they got the best game in town, the low information crowd eats it right up...

It all depends on what Vega actually is. If it is improved and updated to latest standards, with new and innovative features, it very well may be the only game in town.

But, because we don't know anything about Vega, other than the codename, hold your horses, sip some tea for the next 6 months, and then see what happens.

 

[Newbian]

Yes, but for all we know only Vega 10 is close(r?) to being ready. We don't really know anything about Vega 11. If AMD have not solved their Polaris perf/watt problems, I don't see Vega 10 beating the 1080 without having significant perf/watt problems. I can probably see it somewhere between the 1070 and 1080 with decent power usage.

Looking at Polaris pricing, I see Vega MSRP between 330$ and 350$. The question is if 290(x)/390(x)/970/980 owners will wait for Vega if the 1070 gauging stops. Currently the lowest 1070 is 410$ (according to nowinstock), but if the 1070 actually goes down to its MSRP (380$, if anyone remembers) I doubt people will wait.

That's not to say people won't buy Vega. I will probably buy one, as I will probably have a freesync monitor by then, and also I dislike Nvidia and prefer AMD, but Vega is horribly late given the great execution by Nvidia across the board.

If it hits in the area of the 1070 / 1080 expect to add $100 to that estimate at least as selling for so cheap would make little sense especially when it's so close to what the rx 480's are going right now as you see them mostly going for $270+ and if mining continues I doubt they will be in stock for less then a few minutes in many places if vega 10 is released in time for the holidays.

 

[spat55]

There are people buying 2014 GTX 980 performance cards two years later in 2016, you know the RX 480/GTX 106.

And who would have thought that people would buy a 2015 GTX 980Ti performance card in 2016 (GTX 1070)

Because the GTX 1070 is rather cheap in the UK starting at £360 for a Palit whereas when the 980ti came out last year it was priced at over £600, the GTX 1070 is also faster, has more VRAM and can overclock harder.

 

[Maverick177]

You didn't address the issue. Who is going to wait and who is going to buy?
470/480 and 1060 offers something today in their price segment. What will Vega offer at launch compared? Will Vega be discounted to attract from a lower segment?
Else only a fool will wait and get the possible same performance a year later for the possible same price.

Me, since I will never buy anything Nvidia.

Maverick177, Perhaps the 3rd Raja is referring to is the Pro WX Radeon series?

Can't remember where I read it but GPU refers to the cards, not the chips, hence 3 GPUs.

 

[IEC]

If Vega is competitive, I will buy at least three of them.

 

[maddie]

What about considering the radical idea that when someone wants to buy a card, they will choose from the available options? Performance, hardware and price. Fairly certain this applies to most of the world's buyers.

The idea that all demand is saturated at launch and that no other cards of any given performance bracket will sell in the future is so funny.

 

[biostud]

I'll wait for vega, or whatever has the best price/performance ratio when there will be a good dp1.3 monitor to combine it with.

 

[beginner99]

If that's true, HBM2 was a horrible engineering/business decision.

Nvidia are managing very well with GDDR5x.

Exactly. The fact they need HBM2 for efficiency and bandwidth tells that their product seriously lacks in some areas. On the other hand NV is offering mid range cards at sky high price levels. I'm glad I bought a cheap 290x a year ago. Still unbeaten in performance/$.

 

[zentan]

What about considering the radical idea that when someone wants to buy a card, they will choose from the available options? Performance, hardware and price. Fairly certain this applies to most of the world's buyers.

The idea that all demand is saturated at launch and that no other cards of any given performance bracket will sell in the future is so funny.

You mean an idea similar to "the introduction of fury X" a little late to the game? And even worse this time the whole high-end market(or even the 300$+) would virtually belong to Nvidia(for 10months or more?).
ShintaiDK surely has a point here. Many of those who would have already bought gtx 1080/70/titan X(pascal) won't buy again next year unless Vega cards prove to be that big of an upgrade over those cards. Sure it could be a good situation for the buyers at the time when Vega cards launch with more options and possible price shake up from both the camps, but still won't change the thing that a lot of potential sales went away with them coming late to the party. It's not like there will be no sales, but if the sales would be like that those of fury line-up then it would not be something great either.
If they are going to be that late they better bring out something that great that swings it in their favour. It's looking somewhat good for AMD next year,more DX12 titles by next year means they would likely be higher up on average than they would have been at this point of time.