285/x is successor of 280/x obviously... What's the Comedy Central doing here?
You wanted amd to name it r9 370 so much that you believed yourself. ^^
Most depressing thing is it's not a competitor for maxwell, there is no competitor for maxwell - AMD are still competing with kepler with in this case what is basically a 7950.
Unless Nvidia releases a Maxwell based card that performs in the ballpark of 7870/270X or higher with similar $ and significantly lower power, there is absolutely no reason for AMD to be worried.
Its not as if everyone here is desperate to get a 750Ti performance level card in their rig. Absolutely sure we would be hearing the same if it was AMD who were the first to come up with 750Ti like card, we would be hearing that nobody buys in this performance range and AMD cannot scale it up properly and so on.
Where is this maxwell based card that is above a 260X that AMD should compete against.?.
The fact that they are using a 30months old GPU to compete with AMD's latest GPU architecture should tell you enough.
They care so much about Tongo that they will sell the successor of the GTX770 for $499 while AMD is selling the successor of Tahiti for the same or less. :|
So let me ask you this,
If NVIDIA was expecting to have GM204 in late September, why lower MSRP of GTX-770 a few weeks before launch ??
ps: GTX-770 is not 30months old GPU, you mean Kepler architecture is 30month old. Same with GCN, it was released in January 2012, GCN 1.1 is only an update.
If NVIDIA was expecting to have GM204 in late September, why lower MSRP of GTX-770 a few weeks before launch ??
I think it means that GM204 is competing in an entirely different performance bracket than GK104, which should seem obvious, but given Tonga's performance-matching (to predecessor Tahiti) debut, perhaps we shouldn't take such advances for granted.
Because GTX 960 is coming.
GTX 780 have also recieved a major price cut. GTX 970 coming. It will be the direct competitor to R9 290X with muuuch lower TDP, and combined with a very good price, it will undoubtly sell well.
I read here in this thread tonga has been hyped much. absolutely every thread maxwell gets hyped so much without knowing anything about the cards. thats what you call hyping.
So let me ask you this,
If NVIDIA was expecting to have GM204 in late September, why lower MSRP of GTX-770 a few weeks before launch ??
ps: GTX-770 is not 30months old GPU, you mean Kepler architecture is 30month old. Same with GCN, it was released in January 2012, GCN 1.1 is only an update.
The fact that they are using a 30months old GPU to compete with AMD's latest GPU architecture should tell you enough.
They care so much about Tongo that they will sell the successor of the GTX770 for $499 while AMD is selling the successor of Tahiti for the same or less. :|
Forget for a second about Maxwell, AMD managed to released a mid-range GPU to compete against another mid-range GPU, both with cores disabled, but one 20% larger than the other. And one silicon 2 1/2 years later than the other.
And even though the AMD GPU beats it by a bit, they still can't even manage to ask money for it.
That's a really scary situation to be in.
You guys care about low prices or perf/$, but AMD has higher cost and can't even monetize a slightly better performance. Over the long term, that never ends well. And the fact that they release this chip now doesn't bode well for the mid-term future: you don't make new silicon to replace it 6 months later with something else.
We don't know what Maxwell will bring in terms of perf/W but does anyone have any doubt that it will spank the Kepler architecture, and thus the GCN too?
That's even scarier.
AMD has always competed reasonably well from a technical point of view. But they were never able to get top dollar and market share for it. With Kepler, Nvidia was able to match or slightly surpass AMD from a technical point of view.
Now it looks like it's going to lose even that last glimmer of hope.
You mean NV will compete with GTX-770 against Tonga in that price segment ??
Yeah, that's what I anticipate. I think they won't come out with a GM206 on 28nm because they can compete with Tonga with the GK104. GK104 is smaller (about 294mm2 compared to Tonga's 350mm2 or so), as power efficient, and not so deprived of features (i.e. GK104 doesn't lack features that other Nvidia cards have, like Tahiti did compared to Hawaii/Tonga). As is rumored at TPU, if the GTX770 (or a re-branded version thereof) is lowered in price to $270, and GTX 760 (or a re-branded version thereof) is lowered to $220-230, then Nvidia already has its answer to Tonga.
Even if the full-blown Tonga die in the 285x outperforms the 770 somewhat (I expect it will), there are no indications why Nvidia couldn't sell the 770 for a little cheaper than the 285x. Also, as we have seen time and time again, Nvidia can compete even if it doesn't have the performance/$$ advantage.
Forget for a second about Maxwell, AMD managed to released a mid-range GPU to compete against another mid-range GPU, both with cores disabled, but one 20% larger than the other. And one silicon 2 1/2 years later than the other.
And even though the AMD GPU beats it by a bit, they still can't even manage to ask money for it.
That's a really scary situation to be in.
You guys care about low prices or perf/$, but AMD has higher cost and can't even monetize a slightly better performance. Over the long term, that never ends well. And the fact that they release this chip now doesn't bode well for the mid-term future: you don't make new silicon to replace it 6 months later with something else.
We don't know what Maxwell will bring in terms of perf/W but does anyone have any doubt that it will spank the Kepler architecture, and thus the GCN too?
That's even scarier.
AMD has always competed reasonably well from a technical point of view. But they were never able to get top dollar and market share for it. With Kepler, Nvidia was able to match or slightly surpass AMD from a technical point of view.
Now it looks like it's going to lose even that last glimmer of hope.
I think this was great food for thought. I think its great observation.
My biggest let down was the efficiency. Not the name, not the price. It was the efficiency. And its not a let down cause i wanted to buy it. It is kinda worrisome. Perhaps its nothing to think on but i find myself concerned with it when looking at the bigger picture. No one wants to see AMD fall far behind.
Perhaps we are looking too deep and the situation doesnt get bleak. It can go anyway from here.
Nvidia may simply position the gk104 in the 900 series. The gm204 may be efficient but not very powerful. It would be a boring time in GPU history and everything work out fine in the end.
It's not too far from the truth. The 285 came at a bad time for us - Anand's retirement, labor day weekend, and a business trip I'm in the middle of. We've never missed a review like this before (and we won't again), but it was exceptional circumstances.
You'll see it tomorrow.
So tomorrow came and went, but the review never showed up. Are we still getting a review and your perspective on the card???
True that. But I am confident that Nvidia is a much bigger customer of TSMC than AMD, and that Nvidia must be getting a pretty good deal there.1. You dont know how much AMD or Nvidia pays for each die, neither the ratio of functional dies.
I bet it will destroy GK104 in absolute performance. At the cost of extra DRAMs. I bet it will be destroyed by GM204 despite the latter having 2 DRAMs less. And if gm107 is an indication, I bet gm204 will destroy Tonga as well in perf/mm2.2. You dont know whats the performance of the full Tonga die. I bet it destroy GK104 in every way and even Maxwell in performance/mm2.
Tonga has better perf/$ than Tahiti. So much is obvious. It's just that they only now catch up with GK104 in that respect. They're 2 years late.3. Doubt any company would release any product that cost them the same as the previous one, and gets the same performance.
True that. But I am confident that Nvidia is a much bigger customer of TSMC than AMD, and that Nvidia must be getting a pretty good deal there.
In addition, since both have cores enabled, the yield of both should be very high on such a mature process. And, finally, the yield on the fully functional dies has to tilt in favor of Nvidia because their die is 20% smaller.
I think that's sufficient arguments to conclude that Nvidia's die cost will be significantly lower.
I bet it will destroy GK104 in absolute performance. At the cost of extra DRAMs. I bet it will be destroyed by GM204 despite the latter having 2 DRAMs less. And if gm107 is an indication, I bet gm204 will destroy Tonga as well in perf/mm2.
And, finally, gm204 will have better perf/W as well, so the perf/$ for cooling will be better for gm204 as well.
Bloodbath coming.
Tonga has better perf/$ than Tahiti. So much is obvious. It's just that they only now catch up with GK104 in that respect. They're 2 years late.
You really wonder what AMD has been doing all this time.